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Post by m on Dec 7, 2010 15:49:24 GMT -5
So what ? m It's clear that the mind has the remarkable ability to not see what it doesn't want to see. The evidence can be overwhelming and if there isn't the motivation to notice it, and especially if there is the motivation to not notice it, it simply won't be seen. And yet, it IS seen or we wouldn't know to deny it or ignore the obvious. This is the value of conceptually dividing the mind into conscious and subconscious. We live on the surface level of our conscious awareness, which is a highly distorted and filtered version of the actual content of our experience and knowledge. We generally assume we make conscious decisions and are able to be at least somewhat objective about the facts, and yet the selection of those 'facts' and the choices themselves are made at unconscious levels and what appears on the surface awareness is the preferred version of the story and only the final verdict of our choices. The choices are not made consciously, only observed consciously. The life that we actually seem to live is the 'final cut' after deeper levels of mind have done some major editing. Living on the surface level of mind is like watching the movie of your life which you acted and edited, without any recollection of having done any editing. It's not possible to live on some other level of mind, but it's possible to become aware of much of this unconscious editing process, thereby increasing the depth of your conscious awareness. Burt's first problem is that he's not motivated to look at the reality of his situation and even question it. If he comes to believe he has something to gain by looking, (which usually means some suffering to avoid) then he may look. This motivation might be supplied by those who realize their humanness and can tell him it's better than the delusion of being a rabbit, whether that's true or not. The second problem is that there's seemingly a price to be paid in seeing, in that his personal identity as a rabbit is seriously threatened. However, this is an obstacle that can potentially be overcome. If we believed that we were a beggar and we were told we are actually a Prince, even though it may be disrupting and frightening, it may be possible to let go of that identity for something about which little is known, if not for the third problem. The third problem has to do with the meeting of desire with fulfillment. Typically, desire and fulfillment are present together as they arise from unconscious levels, and are brought to the surface of conscious awareness together. Desire in one hand, the fulfillment of the desire in the other, and they meet to end the tension. If the desire is to win the lottery, and it is fulfilled, the desire brings the fulfillment into our conscious awareness. If the desire is to realize one is a human and not a rabbit, the moment the desire meets it's fulfillment on unconscious levels, it collapses completely. The momentum of desire abruptly ends before the desire can meet fulfillment since the desire originates in the delusion and the fulfillment collapses the illusion along with the desire. Without any further momentum, the fulfillment (the realization of humanness) is no longer a fulfillment, and it remains as an unconscious knowing that lacks the psychic energy to become conscious. We could say Burt is already 'enlightened'. The realization is already present. Nothing but the obvious needs to be seen.
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Post by unveilable on Dec 7, 2010 16:49:54 GMT -5
Im not seeing where you are going with this just yet. Its the lug-head in me. If the desire collapsed then he would be content no? In my case, desire is there and fulfillment? Im not sure about fulfillment. I am still swayed by my thoughts. It appears as though I am unconscious in those moments. There is a general sense that Ive not gone deep enough. Psychic energy sounds way too abstract for me and Im still perplexed by this idea that there needs to be some dark angst to go vertical. Tony Parsons took a year off from searching to play golf and then woke up. It sounds as though realization occurred after he stopped trying to hit at it directly. Im not seeing this need for angst from what he is saying. Maybe you and I talking about different things? Am I needlessly fixating on the finger and not what it is pointing to? www.theflawofattraction.com/tony-parsons-a-recent-video/09:00 If the desire is to realize one is a human and not a rabbit, the moment the desire meets it's fulfillment on unconscious levels, it collapses completely. The momentum of desire abruptly ends before the desire can meet fulfillment since the desire originates in the delusion and the fulfillment collapses the illusion along with the desire. Without any further momentum, the fulfillment (the realization of humanness) is no longer a fulfillment, and it remains as an unconscious knowing that lacks the psychic energy to become conscious. We could say Burt is already 'enlightened'. The realization is already present. Nothing but the obvious needs to be seen.
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Post by runstill on Dec 7, 2010 17:00:19 GMT -5
[quote author=enigma board=misc thread=1121 post=11
I
We could say Burt is already 'enlightened'. The realization is already present. Nothing but the obvious needs to be seen. [/quote]
Except that psychic energy needs to be present to see the obvious, enigma are you saying this ?
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Post by enigma on Dec 7, 2010 18:56:23 GMT -5
"Except that psychic energy needs to be present to see the obvious, enigma are you saying this" ?
Yes. The intelligence that you are is innocent and remains innocent. Attention moves simply and presently with the arising of desire. No complicated future plans like sacrificing this desire for a future gain, or if only I'm willing to stop thoughts I might realize myself. It's only present desire arising now, and meeting it's fulfillment now. All the rest is an artificial overlay of planning, problem solving and goal setting. What you are does none of this, and so if the desire collapses, then that's what it is in that moment, and attention is removed from it.
What you are is here playing. It has no idea of accomplishing something like Self realization. It plays until it's done playing.
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Post by monkkey on Dec 7, 2010 20:43:22 GMT -5
IT IS AWARENESS PRESENTLY WATCHING IT is creating
an illusion of separateness
and using psychic energy
to maintain the illusory walls
that keep the illusion
IT is creating
from realizing the WHOLENESS
that IT really IS
creating this illusion |
YOU ARE IT DOING JUST THIS (whatever it is that the illusion is doing)
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Post by question on Dec 7, 2010 21:28:41 GMT -5
If the desire is to realize one is a human and not a rabbit, the moment the desire meets it's fulfillment on unconscious levels, it collapses completely. The momentum of desire abruptly ends before the desire can meet fulfillment since the desire originates in the delusion and the fulfillment collapses the illusion along with the desire. Without any further momentum, the fulfillment (the realization of humanness) is no longer a fulfillment, and it remains as an unconscious knowing that lacks the psychic energy to become conscious. Just for the record, what is it that is known unconsciously and never becomes conscious? 1) Burt's realization of his humanness? I'd doubt that, because he will be able to say "I am human" and undoubtedly mean what he's saying. 2) The collapse of the desire/fulfillment structure? If it's 2), why do you bring it up? Why is it significant that the collapse can't become conscious?
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Post by question on Dec 7, 2010 21:44:00 GMT -5
question! go go GO....over the edge! you are right there! I wish. I see no edge, no progress whatsoever, except for some limited intellectual understanding. I have zero faith in myself to ever amount to anything in the department of nonduality. It's pathetic, really. I'm like that monk sweeping the tombs in the graveyard, except that some idiot in me is actually secretely waiting for the magic pebble to strike the bamboo fence.
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Post by monkkey on Dec 7, 2010 22:42:01 GMT -5
NO! STOP! that is an aspect of the psychic energy creating the illusion.
GOOD! there is no edge or progress; they are also aspects of the psychic energy bound as the illusion of mind/separateness.
NO! there is no intellectual understanding to be achieved; more psycho-babble BS!
GOOD! chuck it all. that faith is part of the attachment to separateness as a "self"...Q does not exist outside of the illusion of Q...Q is just an idea...
yet more delusion. STOP already!
YES! Q is a pathetic meager infinitismally small illusion that seemingly just loves thinking. STOP! LOOK! Q is a POS illusion....addicted to thinking. YOU/AWARENESS creating Q and doing stupid BS thinking in circles all day everyday.
nice poetic way of thinking about the illusion of Q thinking. but they are just words pointing to what you are now consciously aware of...the BS illusion of Q doing any thinking...the illusion of Q just said he is a BS lie...and that there is some psychic energy being used by IT to maintain that lie/illusion.
NO EXCEPT. the illusion of Q is the idiot little me. it is just an idea, a lie, and illusion.
the illusion of 'waiting' is the psychic energy being used to maintain the illusion of time, which maintains the finite context of the illusory BS little me.
STOP! F'ING LOOK!
First, close your eyes and LOOK, with what the "little illusory you" thinks is "its" mind, without thinking. That looking without thinking and seeing nothing is as close as 'you' will ever get to seeing wholeness. PERIOD. you look and think nothing. PURE AWARENESS.
Second, open your eyes and do the same. It is all a happening. That looking without thinking and seeing nothing is as close as 'you' will ever get to seeing wholeness. PERIOD. you look and think nothing. PURE AWARENESS.
Third, that little Q thingy comes in and starts to set up camp, so the illusion of Q can be...that is just it. It is a part of all that is...just a happening. That looking without thinking and seeing nothing is as close as 'you' will ever get to seeing wholeness. PERIOD. look and think nothing. PURE AWARENESS LOOKING.
Finally, IT IS ALL JUST A HAPPENING, even the Q pushing the psychic energy noodle around. PURE AWARENESS ISING.
IT's FUNNY. IT's AWESOME. IT's BIZARRE. TRULY INCREDIBLE because IT is not of the mind.
OK, gotta go. It is snowing outside. What is this IT that is snowing? What is it that is giving a c r a p? Without thinking, NOTHING is EVERYTHING HAPPENING. INCREDIBLE!
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Post by m on Dec 8, 2010 1:51:15 GMT -5
monkkey, who are you (not the idea of you)-being pure awareness ? m NO! STOP! that is an aspect of the psychic energy creating the illusion. GOOD! there is no edge or progress; they are also aspects of the psychic energy bound as the illusion of mind/separateness. NO! there is no intellectual understanding to be achieved; more psycho-babble BS! GOOD! chuck it all. that faith is part of the attachment to separateness as a "self"...Q does not exist outside of the illusion of Q...Q is just an idea... yet more delusion. STOP already! YES! Q is a pathetic meager infinitismally small illusion that seemingly just loves thinking. STOP! LOOK! Q is a POS illusion....addicted to thinking. YOU/AWARENESS creating Q and doing stupid BS thinking in circles all day everyday. nice poetic way of thinking about the illusion of Q thinking. but they are just words pointing to what you are now consciously aware of...the BS illusion of Q doing any thinking...the illusion of Q just said he is a BS lie...and that there is some psychic energy being used by IT to maintain that lie/illusion. NO EXCEPT. the illusion of Q is the idiot little me. it is just an idea, a lie, and illusion. the illusion of 'waiting' is the psychic energy being used to maintain the illusion of time, which maintains the finite context of the illusory BS little me. STOP! F'ING LOOK! First, close your eyes and LOOK, with what the "little illusory you" thinks is "its" mind, without thinking. That looking without thinking and seeing nothing is as close as 'you' will ever get to seeing wholeness. PERIOD. you look and think nothing. PURE AWARENESS. Second, open your eyes and do the same. It is all a happening. That looking without thinking and seeing nothing is as close as 'you' will ever get to seeing wholeness. PERIOD. you look and think nothing. PURE AWARENESS. Third, that little Q thingy comes in and starts to set up camp, so the illusion of Q can be...that is just it. It is a part of all that is...just a happening. That looking without thinking and seeing nothing is as close as 'you' will ever get to seeing wholeness. PERIOD. look and think nothing. PURE AWARENESS LOOKING. Finally, IT IS ALL JUST A HAPPENING, even the Q pushing the psychic energy noodle around. PURE AWARENESS ISING. IT's FUNNY. IT's AWESOME. IT's BIZARRE. TRULY INCREDIBLE because IT is not of the mind. OK, gotta go. It is snowing outside. What is this IT that is snowing? What is it that is giving a c r a p? Without thinking, NOTHING is EVERYTHING HAPPENING. INCREDIBLE!
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Post by monkkey on Dec 8, 2010 2:07:05 GMT -5
m-
it is a good question.
clarify it.
make it more "about m" and see what is creating .
do not wobble.
let the board know what you come up with.
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Post by zendancer on Dec 8, 2010 2:13:59 GMT -5
m: You already know who Monkkey is! It is what is asking the question, "Monkkey, who are you?" LOL.
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Post by enigma on Dec 8, 2010 3:36:50 GMT -5
If the desire is to realize one is a human and not a rabbit, the moment the desire meets it's fulfillment on unconscious levels, it collapses completely. The momentum of desire abruptly ends before the desire can meet fulfillment since the desire originates in the delusion and the fulfillment collapses the illusion along with the desire. Without any further momentum, the fulfillment (the realization of humanness) is no longer a fulfillment, and it remains as an unconscious knowing that lacks the psychic energy to become conscious. Just for the record, what is it that is known unconsciously and never becomes conscious? 1) Burt's realization of his humanness? I'd doubt that, because he will be able to say "I am human" and undoubtedly mean what he's saying. 2) The collapse of the desire/fulfillment structure? If it's 2), why do you bring it up? Why is it significant that the collapse can't become conscious? It's significant because it may be the single obstacle to Self realization.
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Post by m on Dec 8, 2010 5:15:41 GMT -5
I am me. What about you? m m- it is a good question.
clarify it.
make it more "about m" and see what is creating .
do not wobble.
let the board know what you come up with.
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Post by monkkey on Dec 8, 2010 5:44:20 GMT -5
Don't know.
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Post by m on Dec 8, 2010 6:49:18 GMT -5
Then, who is saying "I don't know"? m
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