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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2022 16:49:02 GMT -5
I guess it depends what you mean by fake. Aikido looks super cool, and I bet it's a fun sport and good way to train your body. But from what I understand it's not effective against more realistic fighting techniques. The flips and showy techniques appear to depend on compliant partners. There have been a few videos where some MMA guy or boxer destroys an aikido guy, and not a single person has made aikido work in an MMA ring/octagon. In contrast a few people have made some of the more traditional tae-kwon-do / karate techniques work (eg, Stephen Thompson like this). MMA is the closest to real fighting, but even that is not 100%, because disgusting techniques like eye gouges, finger bending, groin attacks, biting, etc., are disallowed but could work in a serious self-defense situation. Quite right. MMA violence is all out fight to destroy the other guy. It's pretty ugly. Don't forget boxing. When the Brits started this, it was sport between "gentlemen". It morphed into a mindless bloodsport in America. Like I said, dojo nonsense is for cowards. Same deal here in this forum: spiritual dojo. It's all talk. Yes, the violence of MMA is disturbing, but it's interesting how much the mind also matters there. Most of the best guys have also been smart. It helps their training, but also their strategy moment to moment in a fight. What they call "fight IQ". I don't like the potential brain injury from skull shaking. Though I've heard that may be worse in boxing and even American football. As for this forum being all talk, I think you're partly right, but you've also engaged in a way to make that a bit of a self-fulfilling prophesy. There are at least a few people here who can speak to some degree from a genuine, deeper place, and offer potentially useful guidance or pointers. But if you're coming at it like a debating society, a philosophy club, and generating a ton of verbiage, it may not bring out the best. The more genuine stuff tends to be brief. As someone once said, "truth is simple; humans are complex". If there's a 100 page thread happening... I'm not saying it's zero value, but there is a lot of mind noise, entertainment, and other games in the mix. If you feel it's all talk, maybe best to take a break, meditate (or something like it), and re-ground in what your genuine questions or interests might be. Another thing that can help cut through the BS (in oneself) is ... "memento mori". |
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Post by sree on Oct 27, 2022 18:07:06 GMT -5
I thought of a question sree. See if this is appropriate. Walking, I considered one question, but it would take 50-100 years to verify, figured it wasn't a good question. So I narrowed it down. Presently, is the USA moving more liberal? I figure we get an answer to that in 2-3 weeks. If you think it not an appropriate question let me know, I'll be considering another. No, it is not appropriate. You guys are just fooling around here. Your life has to be on the line. It has to be about you, a matter critically important to you. Do you care if the USA is moving liberal? Seriously, what are you? Can we treat this forum as a hexagonal cage and we are not fooling around? Real combatants facing death and out to destroy each other. Psychologically.
Pick a hexagram, together. Each one throw the coins to pick a line. Six of us. Who do you think is worth a damn in this forum? You? If you feel you matter, then there are 5 more. I will throw my name in the ring. This leaves 4 more. Is there anyone else?
We can form the question together once we have six guys who are not just shooting the bull here.
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Post by sree on Oct 27, 2022 19:31:59 GMT -5
Quite right. MMA violence is all out fight to destroy the other guy. It's pretty ugly. Don't forget boxing. When the Brits started this, it was sport between "gentlemen". It morphed into a mindless bloodsport in America. Like I said, dojo nonsense is for cowards. Same deal here in this forum: spiritual dojo. It's all talk. Yes, the violence of MMA is disturbing, but it's interesting how much the mind also matters there. Most of the best guys have also been smart. It helps their training, but also their strategy moment to moment in a fight. What they call "fight IQ". I don't like the potential brain injury from skull shaking. Though I've heard that may be worse in boxing and even American football. As for this forum being all talk, I think you're partly right, but you've also engaged in a way to make that a bit of a self-fulfilling prophesy. There are at least a few people here who can speak to some degree from a genuine, deeper place, and offer potentially useful guidance or pointers. But if you're coming at it like a debating society, a philosophy club, and generating a ton of verbiage, it may not bring out the best. The more genuine stuff tends to be brief. As someone once said, "truth is simple; humans are complex". If there's a 100 page thread happening... I'm not saying it's zero value, but there is a lot of mind noise, entertainment, and other games in the mix. If you feel it's all talk, maybe best to take a break, meditate (or something like it), and re-ground in what your genuine questions or interests might be. Another thing that can help cut through the BS (in oneself) is ... "memento mori".
There is no bs in me. Minding the body is not bs. It is necessary, and that's all I do. When the body is quiet, and my chores are done, reflection arises from moment to moment. As Krishnamurti said, life is an unbroken movement in meditation, and not just when you are sitting cross legged doing Zen to get TPTPAU.
Death of the body is a certainty. The self vanishes every night when the body sleeps. Sleep is no different from death. It's the memory, the recall of experiences of the self, that conjures the presence of the self as a human being alive on planet earth.
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Post by inavalan on Oct 27, 2022 20:37:40 GMT -5
The yarrow have been drawn....
The present is embodied in Hexagram 25 - Wu Wang (The Unexpected): Great progress and success is indicated, while there will be advantage in being firm and correct. If he or his action be not correct, he will fall into errors, and it will not be advantageous for him to move in any direction.
The topmost line, undivided, shows its subject free from insincerity, yet sure to fall into error, if he take action. His action will not be advantageous in any way.
The situation is evolving slowly, and Yin (the passive feminine force) is gaining ground.
The future is embodied in Hexagram 17 - Sui (Following): There will be great progress and success, but one must be firm and correct. There will then be no error.
The things most apparent, those above and in front, are embodied by the upper trigram Chi'en (Heaven), which is transforming into Tui (Lake). As part of this process, strength and creativity are giving way to joy, pleasure, and attraction.
The things least apparent, those below and behind, are embodied by the lower trigram Chen (Thunder), which represents movement, initiative, and action.
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Post by inavalan on Oct 27, 2022 21:12:00 GMT -5
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Post by Reefs on Oct 27, 2022 22:44:05 GMT -5
The yarrow have been drawn.... The present is embodied in Hexagram 25 - Wu Wang (The Unexpected): Great progress and success is indicated, while there will be advantage in being firm and correct. If he or his action be not correct, he will fall into errors, and it will not be advantageous for him to move in any direction. The topmost line, undivided, shows its subject free from insincerity, yet sure to fall into error, if he take action. His action will not be advantageous in any way. The situation is evolving slowly, and Yin (the passive feminine force) is gaining ground. The future is embodied in Hexagram 17 - Sui (Following): There will be great progress and success, but one must be firm and correct. There will then be no error. The things most apparent, those above and in front, are embodied by the upper trigram Chi'en (Heaven), which is transforming into Tui (Lake). As part of this process, strength and creativity are giving way to joy, pleasure, and attraction. The things least apparent, those below and behind, are embodied by the lower trigram Chen (Thunder), which represents movement, initiative, and action. I've figured that out a while ago already, all without the Yjing.  But that's where I see the usefulness of such predictive techniques like (horary) astrology, tarot or the Yijing, to confirm what you already knew as a gut feeling, but didn't dare to accept intellectually. These techniques will help you accept it intellectually. If used that way, one would use these predictive techniques to one's advantage and I wouldn't discourage anyone doing that. If, however, someone has no reading at all on their inner guidance or doesn't even care and then uses these predictive techniques to come to a decision, that's like gambling and I would strongly advice against it, because it will not only create a dependency on these techniques for an otherwise naturally unfolding decision process, but it will also render these techniques ineffective if only employed out of curiosity or speculation. Because these techniques only work if there's a genuine interest and personal involvement in the matter inquired. |
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Post by laughter on Oct 27, 2022 22:46:16 GMT -5
Cool article, I browsed it, will go back and read in full. Too bad the Celtic Church died out. It is somewhat being revived by the literature. Celtic Christianity, like Eastern Orthodox Christian theologians (mostly) did not have Augustine's concept of original sin. Pelagius, who debated Augustine on the matter, was a Celtic Christian. Too bad Augustine won the debate. In the Tao Te Ching it says One became two, two became three and the three became the 10,000 things. This is not arbitrary. You find triads everywhere, they are part of the structure of the universe, that is, they are the basis of your repeating patterns. We all know yin and yang, the third is more illusive. I explored this, I'd say the third is the central unmoving point, it's a point of balance. Take a pendulum, it swings back and forth, yin and yang, where it is attached, is the unmoving point. The TTC gives another example, a wheel, it revolves around a central unmoving point. A lever is another example. You want to move a large rock, that's the passive yin. You want to apply force to move the rock, you have a pole and active yang force, your muscles. But you need a central unmoving point of pivot, a fulcrum. Those are your 3 forces. From yin and yang the whole I Ching is evolved, the 64 hexagrams. You could actually go to 128, but they decided 64 'situations' were enough to give a picture of life, in repeating patterns. So at 64, it shift back to 1 instead of going to 65. So where is the third force? The Supreme Ultimate Tai Chi symbol is a moving symbol, The black dot in the white expands until it is almost completely black, and at the extreme is becomes the black with the white dot, and the cycle continues. This movement is finetuned in the 64 hexagrams of the I Ching, yin turning into yang and yang turning into yin. The I Ching represents all of life, in time, and in the present moment, and in cycles. So the point of the shift, the pivot, is the third force. Third balancing force is a kind of string holding together yin and yang, which are really One, they are all One, the three are one. Where have we heard that before? Linked to that page as it was the first that came up on googling "celts law of three". It's built into the language: the best rhetoric makes related, interlocking points over three different clauses in the same conclusory sentence of a paragraph. Look for it. The reference to the "Triskel" at Newgrange was interesting, as the current anthropology is that Newgrange was built by the same culture that built Stonehenge, a culture that predated the "celts" by well over a thousand years. Hat tip to the original trek writers for inserting this into pop culture. |
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Post by laughter on Oct 27, 2022 22:57:34 GMT -5
Yes, the violence of MMA is disturbing, but it's interesting how much the mind also matters there. Most of the best guys have also been smart. It helps their training, but also their strategy moment to moment in a fight. What they call "fight IQ". I don't like the potential brain injury from skull shaking. Though I've heard that may be worse in boxing and even American football. As for this forum being all talk, I think you're partly right, but you've also engaged in a way to make that a bit of a self-fulfilling prophesy. There are at least a few people here who can speak to some degree from a genuine, deeper place, and offer potentially useful guidance or pointers. But if you're coming at it like a debating society, a philosophy club, and generating a ton of verbiage, it may not bring out the best. The more genuine stuff tends to be brief. As someone once said, "truth is simple; humans are complex". If there's a 100 page thread happening... I'm not saying it's zero value, but there is a lot of mind noise, entertainment, and other games in the mix. If you feel it's all talk, maybe best to take a break, meditate (or something like it), and re-ground in what your genuine questions or interests might be. Another thing that can help cut through the BS (in oneself) is ... "memento mori".
There is no bs in me. Minding the body is not bs. It is necessary, and that's all I do. When the body is quiet, and my chores are done, reflection arises from moment to moment. As Krishnamurti said, life is an unbroken movement in meditation, and not just when you are sitting cross legged doing Zen to get TPTPAU.
Death of the body is a certainty. The self vanishes every night when the body sleeps. Sleep is no different from death. It's the memory, the recall of experiences of the self, that conjures the presence of the self as a human being alive on planet earth.
The body minds itself. Don't believe me? Hold your breath. Or, better yet, decide not to take a piss. Your sense of "minding the body" is at best, referring to observation. |
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Post by sree on Oct 27, 2022 23:34:22 GMT -5
There is no bs in me. Minding the body is not bs. It is necessary, and that's all I do. When the body is quiet, and my chores are done, reflection arises from moment to moment. As Krishnamurti said, life is an unbroken movement in meditation, and not just when you are sitting cross legged doing Zen to get TPTPAU.
Death of the body is a certainty. The self vanishes every night when the body sleeps. Sleep is no different from death. It's the memory, the recall of experiences of the self, that conjures the presence of the self as a human being alive on planet earth.
The body minds itself. Don't believe me? Hold your breath. Or, better yet, decide not to take a piss. Your sense of "minding the body" is at best, referring to observation. You cannot stop your body from breathing, neither can you stop your body from pissing. Are you a goat or a donkey pissing and shitting where you stand or walk? Laffy, can you post a pix of what you look like? |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Oct 28, 2022 4:22:16 GMT -5
Cool article, I browsed it, will go back and read in full. Too bad the Celtic Church died out. It is somewhat being revived by the literature. Celtic Christianity, like Eastern Orthodox Christian theologians (mostly) did not have Augustine's concept of original sin. Pelagius, who debated Augustine on the matter, was a Celtic Christian. Too bad Augustine won the debate. In the Tao Te Ching it says One became two, two became three and the three became the 10,000 things. This is not arbitrary. You find triads everywhere, they are part of the structure of the universe, that is, they are the basis of your repeating patterns. We all know yin and yang, the third is more illusive. I explored this, I'd say the third is the central unmoving point, it's a point of balance. Take a pendulum, it swings back and forth, yin and yang, where it is attached, is the unmoving point. The TTC gives another example, a wheel, it revolves around a central unmoving point. A lever is another example. You want to move a large rock, that's the passive yin. You want to apply force to move the rock, you have a pole and active yang force, your muscles. But you need a central unmoving point of pivot, a fulcrum. Those are your 3 forces. From yin and yang the whole I Ching is evolved, the 64 hexagrams. You could actually go to 128, but they decided 64 'situations' were enough to give a picture of life, in repeating patterns. So at 64, it shift back to 1 instead of going to 65. So where is the third force? The Supreme Ultimate Tai Chi symbol is a moving symbol, The black dot in the white expands until it is almost completely black, and at the extreme is becomes the black with the white dot, and the cycle continues. This movement is finetuned in the 64 hexagrams of the I Ching, yin turning into yang and yang turning into yin. The I Ching represents all of life, in time, and in the present moment, and in cycles. So the point of the shift, the pivot, is the third force. Third balancing force is a kind of string holding together yin and yang, which are really One, they are all One, the three are one. Where have we heard that before? Linked to that page as it was the first that came up on googling "celts law of three". It's built into the language: the best rhetoric makes related, interlocking points over three different clauses in the same conclusory sentence of a paragraph. Look for it. The reference to the "Triskel" at Newgrange was interesting, as the current anthropology is that Newgrange was built by the same culture that built Stonehenge, a culture that predated the "celts" by well over a thousand years. Hat tip to the original trek writers for inserting this into pop culture. Yes, that's a nice episode. I had the sense Gene Roddenberry was an atheist, don't know, never researched it. That was an unusual episode. ...I'm pretty sure William Shatner is an atheist, I wonder how he liked that episode, never heard. When I was in elementary school, maybe 4th grade, when had to do a research project. Somehow mine ended up on the Druids. For some reason I became very attracted, and never forgot that. Same with the Sumerians, 5th grade. They amazed me. I decided they had been an advanced culture, the end of an advanced culture, and after them, civilization went down hill for a long time. Later when I started learning about the Celts, who I'm sure you know, predated Christianity, I discovered they were very "spiritually" advanced, had a deep relationship with the real world (the Whole world). I read once that when Jesus died, they knew it, they knew that something very significant had occurred. It just now came to me, an analogy, they felt a disturbance in the Force, and recognized what it was. So when missionaries finally came upon them, they instantly became Christians. ....And I have surmised, without any research so to speak, Merlin was a Celt (the stories were based on a something). And so the Grail stories were a something. My favorite story is the Fisher King. And The Fisher King with Robin Williams and Jeff Bridges is a pretty good adaptation. I don't know about Newgrange, I'll check it out. When I was on Beliefnet (sorry that went away, had some good internet friends there) I had myself listed as a Taoist, Zen, Kabbalist, Eastern Orthodox, Celtic Christian mystic. |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Oct 28, 2022 4:38:44 GMT -5
Yes, the violence of MMA is disturbing, but it's interesting how much the mind also matters there. Most of the best guys have also been smart. It helps their training, but also their strategy moment to moment in a fight. What they call "fight IQ". I don't like the potential brain injury from skull shaking. Though I've heard that may be worse in boxing and even American football. As for this forum being all talk, I think you're partly right, but you've also engaged in a way to make that a bit of a self-fulfilling prophesy. There are at least a few people here who can speak to some degree from a genuine, deeper place, and offer potentially useful guidance or pointers. But if you're coming at it like a debating society, a philosophy club, and generating a ton of verbiage, it may not bring out the best. The more genuine stuff tends to be brief. As someone once said, "truth is simple; humans are complex". If there's a 100 page thread happening... I'm not saying it's zero value, but there is a lot of mind noise, entertainment, and other games in the mix. If you feel it's all talk, maybe best to take a break, meditate (or something like it), and re-ground in what your genuine questions or interests might be. Another thing that can help cut through the BS (in oneself) is ... "memento mori".
There is no bs in me. Minding the body is not bs. It is necessary, and that's all I do. When the body is quiet, and my chores are done, reflection arises from moment to moment. As Krishnamurti said, life is an unbroken movement in meditation, and not just when you are sitting cross legged doing Zen to get TPTPAU.
Death of the body is a certainty. The self vanishes every night when the body sleeps. Sleep is no different from death. It's the memory, the recall of experiences of the self, that conjures the presence of the self as a human being alive on planet earth.
Then you are a bottom-up guy and not a top-down guy. You believe "consciousness" arises from brain processing and not that brain processing arises from consciousness. Krishnamurti (you have to read between the lines) disagrees. In the '70's I read Alan Watt's autobiography, In My Own Way. He spent a few pages in J Krishnamurti, talked about his history. He said if Krishnamurti was Maitreya, the New World Teacher, returned, as the Theosophists believed, he would have done exactly as he did, dissolve The Order of the Star in the East (which then had more members than even the Theosophical Society), and teach on his own. |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Oct 28, 2022 4:43:00 GMT -5
I thought of a question sree. See if this is appropriate. Walking, I considered one question, but it would take 50-100 years to verify, figured it wasn't a good question. So I narrowed it down. Presently, is the USA moving more liberal? I figure we get an answer to that in 2-3 weeks. If you think it not an appropriate question let me know, I'll be considering another. No, it is not appropriate. You guys are just fooling around here. Your life has to be on the line. It has to be about you, a matter critically important to you. Do you care if the USA is moving liberal? Seriously, what are you? Can we treat this forum as a hexagonal cage and we are not fooling around? Real combatants facing death and out to destroy each other. Psychologically. Pick a hexagram, together. Each one throw the coins to pick a line. Six of us. Who do you think is worth a damn in this forum? You? If you feel you matter, then there are 5 more. I will throw my name in the ring. This leaves 4 more. Is there anyone else?
We can form the question together once we have six guys who are not just shooting the bull here.
My immediate thought, read this last night, was, are you crazy? Rethought it, I do have a question, however........... |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Oct 28, 2022 4:47:45 GMT -5
The yarrow have been drawn.... The present is embodied in Hexagram 25 - Wu Wang (The Unexpected): Great progress and success is indicated, while there will be advantage in being firm and correct. If he or his action be not correct, he will fall into errors, and it will not be advantageous for him to move in any direction. The topmost line, undivided, shows its subject free from insincerity, yet sure to fall into error, if he take action. His action will not be advantageous in any way. The situation is evolving slowly, and Yin (the passive feminine force) is gaining ground. The future is embodied in Hexagram 17 - Sui (Following): There will be great progress and success, but one must be firm and correct. There will then be no error. The things most apparent, those above and in front, are embodied by the upper trigram Chi'en (Heaven), which is transforming into Tui (Lake). As part of this process, strength and creativity are giving way to joy, pleasure, and attraction. The things least apparent, those below and behind, are embodied by the lower trigram Chen (Thunder), which represents movement, initiative, and action. inavalan, I have a serious question, if you will, would? I also kind of need it today, or tomorrow. I had pretty much resolved it, but this would help. Last week I met someone on the internet. After 10 days, should I, stardustpilgrim continue communicating with this person? |
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Post by laughter on Oct 28, 2022 5:28:43 GMT -5
I thought of a question sree. See if this is appropriate. Walking, I considered one question, but it would take 50-100 years to verify, figured it wasn't a good question. So I narrowed it down. Presently, is the USA moving more liberal? I figure we get an answer to that in 2-3 weeks. If you think it not an appropriate question let me know, I'll be considering another. No, it is not appropriate. You guys are just fooling around here. Your life has to be on the line. It has to be about you, a matter critically important to you. Do you care if the USA is moving liberal? Seriously, what are you? Can we treat this forum as a hexagonal cage and we are not fooling around? Real combatants facing death and out to destroy each other. Psychologically. Pick a hexagram, together. Each one throw the coins to pick a line. Six of us. Who do you think is worth a damn in this forum? You? If you feel you matter, then there are 5 more. I will throw my name in the ring. This leaves 4 more. Is there anyone else?
We can form the question together once we have six guys who are not just shooting the bull here.
Answer the question: "who/what is it that would seek to annihilate?", and the conflict seeking will stop. On a dime. |
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Post by laughter on Oct 28, 2022 5:33:45 GMT -5
Linked to that page as it was the first that came up on googling "celts law of three". It's built into the language: the best rhetoric makes related, interlocking points over three different clauses in the same conclusory sentence of a paragraph. Look for it. The reference to the "Triskel" at Newgrange was interesting, as the current anthropology is that Newgrange was built by the same culture that built Stonehenge, a culture that predated the "celts" by well over a thousand years. Hat tip to the original trek writers for inserting this into pop culture. Yes, that's a nice episode. I had the sense Gene Roddenberry was an atheist, don't know, never researched it. That was an unusual episode. ...I'm pretty sure William Shatner is an atheist, I wonder how he liked that episode, never heard. When I was in elementary school, maybe 4th grade, when had to do a research project. Somehow mine ended up on the Druids. For some reason I became very attracted, and never forgot that. Same with the Sumerians, 5th grade. They amazed me. I decided they had been an advanced culture, the end of an advanced culture, and after them, civilization went down hill for a long time. Later when I started learning about the Celts, who I'm sure you know, predated Christianity, I discovered they were very "spiritually" advanced, had a deep relationship with the real world (the Whole world). I read once that when Jesus died, they knew it, they knew that something very significant had occurred. It just now came to me, an analogy, they felt a disturbance in the Force, and recognized what it was. So when missionaries finally came upon them, they instantly became Christians. ....And I have surmised, without any research so to speak, Merlin was a Celt (the stories were based on a something). And so the Grail stories were a something. My favorite story is the Fisher King. And The Fisher King with Robin Williams and Jeff Bridges is a pretty good adaptation. I don't know about Newgrange, I'll check it out. When I was on Beliefnet (sorry that went away, had some good internet friends there) I had myself listed as a Taoist, Zen, Kabbalist, Eastern Orthodox, Celtic Christian mystic. I don't know about the tales of the instant success of the missionaries, and with all things celt or druid I'd take them with a grain of salt, as there's no cultural continuity, so we're filling in the blanks to some degree. That said, that culture represents an interesting bridge, a phase of development that - at least technologically - fell in between the stone age and the agricultural revolution. I've never looked into them in depth, but what little I know of "aboriginal" spiritual practices - of, say, the "American Indians" or the "Australian natives" - to be quite intriguing. There's a definite power to innocence .. like .. you know, beginners mind?  |
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