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Post by swamicollins on Nov 13, 2008 4:21:41 GMT -5
LM--"If you heal something in yourself you heal the world"!! HA HA HA!!youve been reading too many happy clappy New age books dearie!just another string of Meaningless but fine-sounding associated words!
I DONT THINK ANYTHING!!But I will write and comment!TRUTHFULLY!Its up to you to choose between my TRUTHFULNESS and your TRUTH.
You cant "deepen the realationship with "your true self" as you(Id-Entity) ARE your true Self(Id-Entity)--what your really saying is "deepen your relationship with your Conditioned Identity" as to you the Conditioned Identity is your "true self"-the MCI is NOT and Never can be Id-Entity.
It is IMPOSSIBLE to "heal something in yourself"-as you(Id-Entity) are really Deconditioning and reconditioning with Knowledge!!
To gain understanding of your)Id-Entity-that which you mistakenly call the "true self") read in my Ebook about THE ID-ENTITY"-that is You( the Id-Entity-a small part of CREATION incarnated in the Foetus at Conception) but taught to believe it the Id-Entity) is the Conditioned Identity by the Parenters in a life long process begining just after birth that is controlled by the Mind(which begins to form from the transmission of the GroupMind energy field that surrounds each and every baby from birth onwards.Familial,Medical.Societal GroupMinds energy fields surround each baby from birth-
I do describe your state of Being accurately but as you rely on the Mind for analysis then of course the Mind will NOT accept the truth because it is a Parasite living on you the Host.
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 13, 2008 5:14:01 GMT -5
You(that believes she is "sophia)-thanks for the patronisation-your quite good at it-pity it doesnt add to your attractiveness or advancement-though Id guess you will refuse to admit it exists.Strength comes from admitting you are wrong at times-If one doesnt make mistakes One wont make anything-Mistakes are part of the Learning/Growing process that you are on.
YES YES YES Im definitely living(but NOT LOST)in my own world .the world of Union with CREATION in the State of Two-Way UNCONDITIONAL LOVE--RUMI never had it this perfect--though I accept that he loved CREATION but only as he Anthropomorphised it!
AS for my occasional "barbarianism"-well in the late 1960s as a wandering Samana I lived on the Capo di Berberia(cape of Barbarians) on Formentera -an Island next to Ibiza(the world Hippie Headquarters--brown Rice and Afghan Hash and Magic Mushrooms and Nudist Beaches and Playing Flute sitting naked at the waters edge-fruit salads--PEACE AND LOVE)
I can only say that youve lived in "sophias" fantasy world for so long that my truthfulness about this "self-deception will probably "shock" her and you--Im NOT even trying to hurt your "feelings-(these are your Emotions dearie)but you will as life goes on mature and have your "feelings" hurt in more ways than you can imagine possible at the moment-get used to CHANGE Love!!Here in Yorkshire it is a folk custom to call each other Love!!-rather charming eh??
As for this world being built to host all kinds of people I agree but EVERYONE one alive has the same Physiological processes and Mind/Conditioned Identity controls those Physiological processes-there are ONLY three kinds of people alive-
1)those who are posessed by Mind and its puppet the Conditioned Identity-living in the state of Conditional Love in DUALITY-chasing "gods" and "religions" and "enlightenment"
Not EVER able to enter the state of UNION with CREATION or to realise their true Nature as a small part of CREATION itself because of Mind and its puppet the Conditioned Identity
2)those who are posessed by Mind and its puppet the Conditioned Identity living in the state of Conditional love and wrongly believing they live in the state of self deceptive mentally created state of Non-Duality(enlightenment/gnosis/awakendness)
3)those who have consciously dissolved totally and permanently Mind and its puppet the Conditioned Identity and have thereby realised that they are the "nature" of the Id-Entity as a small part of CREATION itself incarnated in the Vehicle /Body in the permanent state of UNCONDITIONAL LOVE with CREATION both internally and externally-Separate and Merged-beyond Duality and Non-Duality(these two,Duality and Non-Duality constitute together a higher form of Duality that the lower form of Duality (which is Good/Bad--Insane/Sane--Wrong/Right ety etc)forms a malevolent counterpoint to.
so ALL kinds of people really means THREE kinds only but with many attributes and skills and just plain old stupidities and vices and sins(yes vices and sins beset Humanity-the vices of Greed and Envy and desire and violence and ignorance and CONDITIONAL LOVE)
Out of 6.6 billion alive at least 6 billion will live and die and Never have the slightest intimation of CREATION due to the Mind and its puppet the Conditioned Identity holding them prisoners in the many various GroupMinds on this Planet.
The sea-beds will rise(leaving Virgin lands in their wakes) soon, displacing thousands of Billions of tones of corrosive salt water over the low lying land(which will sink to form new sea-beds) where most of the worlds inhabitants live at present--1000mtre high Sunamis wil smash ALL the useless cities and civilisations before them and the corrosive waters that will form new oceans
wil dissolve the detrius of this corrupt age of Kali-an age of god-worshippers who have turned their backs on CREATION and not attempted to discover for themselves the answer to the Riddle of Life set us by CREATION--this 6billion that have chosen the CONDITIONAL love of Materialism over the UNCONDITIONAL LOVE of CREATION.
the hand has written and moves on
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Post by Peter on Nov 13, 2008 7:31:50 GMT -5
Afternoon Swami
Richard Rose - something of a founding father in the collection of websites that this board belongs to - had a nice analogy that said that spiritual progress is like a ladder, and that we can only help someone who is on the rung directly below us, and we can only be helped by someone on the run immediately above us. I can't tell if you're out of sight above, or out of sight below, or using a different piece of climbing equipment altogether. I've a strong suspicion that Free-will (or more specifically The Law of Confusion) means that I am not allowed to know for sure.
You really want me to be a sad lonely addict living in some run-down place don't you? Where is that coming from? Does it make you "more" (in your head), to make less of me (in your head)? You're so far off the mark that I must admit, your Psychic Powers are being seriously called into question.
Come on, show some genuine and accurate insight to prove that you've really found something worth following. Otherwise I'm just going to have to label you an attention seeking Troll, and stop spending time on you.
If you don't play mind games, then why did you write to Sophia: "Pity it doesn't add to your attractiveness"? You wouldn't write that to me now, would you? Why the sudden display of manipulative sexism?
Well yes that's one possibility. The other possibility is that you are being genuinely offensive. It is possible to speak the Truth, provide helpful insight to others, without being unpleasant about it. Really, self-discovery and spiritual progress within a group forum can be an exciting, life-affirming and energising experience.
Your abusive words, your habit of calling people you don't like "thingy", your wish to see cities consumed by floods. For someone who's so much one with Creation, you don't seem to like it - other than enjoying your golden body of light - very much?
It's quite true to say that I must be "addicted", in a sense, to have incarnated at this time - needing physicality and "Self". But then so did you, and remained so for most of your life as I read in your biography. How many hundreds or thousands of lifetimes do you think you've been addicted for? How quick you are to mock and taunt others for their addiction! Did you use this approach when you were running your half-way houses? I think you'll remember that addicts need encouragement, compassion and support. They do not need someone goading them about how great it is not to be addict, and how lost and pityful they are.
It is an unfortunate place you are in now. You believe you have nothing more to learn. Your cup is full, you listen to no-one, and you have come to spiritual dead end.
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Post by Peter on Nov 13, 2008 7:41:48 GMT -5
Is there anything that's not shocking? I think it's his method that is so unconventional. I'd have no problem with it being unconventional if it was also useful, but I haven't got much positive from it so far. Certainly not enough to justify the thousands of words that have been written this week. If he's happy and content with where he is I certainly won't try to change him, although I wouldn't mind changing one thing - his occasional barbarianism. It takes more than he can do to hurt my feelings, but I'm worried about how other people will take him. I don't like to see anyone's feelings hurt. Ahh now that is something interesting that's come from this, and I saw it in myself this morning. That need to change the world to "How it Should Be". I think that's probably one of the most difficult spiritual questions to be answered in this incarnation: To what extent do we accept that the world is here for a purpose and accept what is around us, and to what extent do we say: This sucks, lets change it for the better. I haven't answered that for myself yet - the position I'm taking currently is to take each situation as it comes. It's silly to try and make some blanket decision of "Accept Anything, no matter how wrong it might seem" or "Change Everything, mold the world to your vision". Why would you protect others from such an opportunity for spiritual growth? Swami is obviously immune to any backlash, and apparently quite unable to give any piercing insight that might do some genuine harm to someone's self view. |
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Post by lightmystic on Nov 13, 2008 11:35:17 GMT -5
Swami, it's not something from a new-age book I've read, it's my experience. I was sad that the world was hurting, and it was because I was sad, and the mind was saying that the world needed to be changed. That was the association. Heal the sadness, healed the world. Now the world is fine. There can be suffering, really anything, and it is right.
You're nondual experience with Creation, as you describe it, still has some very limited programs running. It's clear that you are not digesting it.
Does the world really need to be changed? Why are you doing what you're doing? "The way it is" just a concept, like everything else. If the totality is really beyond all duality, nonduality, isness, non-isness, etc. (which seems to be both our experiences) then anything you say is is not going to be the whole truth. Because it's beyond that. Thus, your special brand of attempting to point isn't any better than anyone else's who gets it. How do you know that the wars going on shouldn't be? I'm mean, really, that's just some serious judgment if you actually believe that. How do you know that everyone should be mindless? Isn't your oneness with Creation enough? If it isn't, then you're not really experiencing the oneness you're talking about in an integrated way.
I should accept your version of truth instead of my own inner guru? Really?
That exposes you as the fraud you are right there.
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 13, 2008 12:09:37 GMT -5
Lm-there is "no Inner Guru" but there is you(the Id-Entity"-that small part of CREATION incarnated in each and every body at Conception(along with the Good and Bad Karma accumulated in previous lifetimes)You made yourself feel good but the world is still enormously sick and the vast majority of Humanity in pain and suffering-Babies are being raped as I write as you read,People are being tortured,hungry,miserable,unhappy and no amount of Happy Clappy stuff is going to "heal" their pain for them--face reality man and grow up.
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Post by lightmystic on Nov 13, 2008 13:16:44 GMT -5
So babies are not supposed to be raped. You know that that's true? How do you know? What evidence do you have that says babies should not be raped?
There is good and bad karma. How do you know THAT? Are you sure? How do you know that definitively? What in your experience shows that as the reality?
People should not be tortured, hungry, or miserable? They should be otherwise? How do you know that? How does it make you feel when you think about those things?
If other's saying something to the effect of "you're a thingy" to your rude responses is them reacting, how is all the things that make the world sick according to you (babies being raped, etc.) not a reaction of your own?
Perhaps YOU are not facing reality. You want to live in a world where babies are not raped, where there is not torture, where everyone is happy clappy. That is not the world, at least not right now, and crying about it and saying it shouldn't be that way doesn't change anything. The sages say that reality is free from suffering. That is my experience. As one who is familiar with yoga, do you disagree with pretty much every sage throughout time?
I don't recall a single integrated being who really believed that the world was broken. I've seen many do things to help heal the world, and I have my role as well, as I want nothing but what's best for the world, but it's not out of the idea that something is lacking, that something is missing, that something is needed, or that something is wrong. How do I know that what's happening now is not best for the world? I don't. In fact, it seems to be exactly what the world needs right now most for it's growth. Both individually and personally on every level. That is my experience.
I'm not advocating people suffering or people hurting, and I work to alleviate suffering, because that is what feels right for me. Nonetheless, I am not deluded enough to know how things "should" be. Because my experience is that there is no specific way things need to be for freedom, and that's just the truth. It's beyond anything limited.
I'd love to see you respond to each of those points, but I don't believe you have the capacity to do it. It will expose your limitations, so you would not dare, as I have dared to answer you point for point. But I hope you do, or else I will be forced to consider you a coward.
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 14, 2008 1:42:55 GMT -5
Peter-PLEASE do that! PLEASE stop sending your neo-NEO attempts at seeming to be the ONE--I have no intention of EVER responding to your immature attempts to involve me in the childish Mond Games you play--I dont give a S***who you quote--I dont give a S*** for any of your invalid opinions-Go back to your "Spoon that doesnt exist"-go back to your ankle length black coat--go back to your fantasies of being NEO-go back to your fantasies of a Trinity coming into your life
Say what you like-I support freedom of speech but PLEASE dont say anything to me anymore-your just a boring inexperienced MindGames player with nothing of value either in you lonely life or nothing of value to say
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 14, 2008 1:53:57 GMT -5
LM-YES YES YES
I AM A FRAUD
I AM A COWARD
YOU ARE SO INSIGHTFUL
yOU ARE ENLIGHTENED
yOU ARE wONDERFUL
i grovel before your magnificence
YOU HEAL THE WORLD
YOU ARE FULL OF s888
I am NOT responsible for Babies being raped
but unlike YOU I do NOT claim to Heal the World
I do NOT torture people
But unlike you I do NOT claim to HEAL the World
You are deluded in these fantasies you keep posting
I notice that NOT once have you actually tried to debate
anything Ive written --ALL you do is the same as Peter--just POSE as a World Healer full of COMPASSION and ACCEPTANCE-What utter Bullsh**!!-Your just a confused little man playing MINDGAMES here like the rest including Richard Rose(whoever he is--just another MindGame player like you)So PLEASE now that youve EXPOSED me for the COWARD and FRAUD that you say I am --PLEASE dont write back to me EVER again with your Immature MindGames as anything you post in future I SHALL IGNORE whilst ROARING with LAUGHTER at you STUPIDITY.
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 14, 2008 4:19:25 GMT -5
LM-oh I forgot
By your own writing you are a SAGE too.
And you accept babies being raped as do your other Sages
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Post by Peter on Nov 15, 2008 11:32:06 GMT -5
Well I really wasn't going to reply, but then your last post to me had a 42 in the posting time, which is something of a spiritual marker for me.  NOT once have you actually tried to debate anything Ive written I think it's clear that everyone contributing here has had some form of spiritual experience that put them in touch with something outside of concensual reality, but experience is just that - a very personal experience - it can never be proven. I see that as a good thing since it protects our free will and allows us to believe just about anything we want to believe. I personally wouldn't like to live in a world where God proved he exists! It also means that there is little point in debating these beliefs. Light Mystic will never be able to prove you "wrong", neither can I prove myself "right". We're just talking, saying how we see it. Presenting what we are, what we have, by how we we are. So when searching for a spiritual teacher - or even just someone to help us along the spiritual path - after we've loooked at the logic of their work (does it make sense, is it helpful), all we've got to go on is how that person touches us, what sense we can get of their presence, their state of being. And in this forum, all we've got to go on is how they present themselves through their writing. And saying things like "I don't give a s***" speaks volumes about your state of being. I think you're being so excessively rude because you can. It's giving you an outlet for emotions that you're perhaps not dealing with in other ways. Like Sophia giving the finger to other motorists while she's safe in the glass and steel cage of her car, you think your internet connection insulates you from the rest of the world. You don't see how intimately you're joined to it. I'm sure you wouldn't talk to anyone like this on the streets of Copmanthorpe now, just like Sophia (I hope) wouldn't give the finger to someone she was in a lift with! |
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Post by lightmystic on Nov 15, 2008 18:26:08 GMT -5
No Peter, you're wrong! There is an Absolute Truth and I have it and you don't! You know nothing of truth! You're just an ego! I hate you! *sob* Okay, but seriously, my experience is that the only thing that can really be known for sure is pure subjectivity. That is, the only thing that one can really know is that there IS no objective reality. Any appearance of objective reality is just another thing within one's subjective perception. Even a color like RED, cannot be proven to be perceived the same way as others, although what we all CALL red is the same thing. And that's even before getting into the meaning and feeling or red, and the list goes on. That's not a great example, but how can one really give an objective example about pure subjectivity?  That has been my only point the whole time, nothing can be known definitively except pure subjectivity itself. What do you think? |
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sophia
Full Member
...the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. ~Plato
Posts: 146
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Post by sophia on Nov 16, 2008 0:03:24 GMT -5
Not having to see a real face makes it tempting for some to give in to their sadistic impulses.
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 16, 2008 2:25:07 GMT -5
Read my Free Ebook--www.experientialknowingness.co.uk--
oh and cease the stupid speculating that you keep on doing--CREATION exists-IT proves it existence to one who is Mindless and Conditioned Identityless--NONE of you writing here are MCI less--but you sure di like to babble
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Post by Peter on Nov 16, 2008 6:23:19 GMT -5
That has been my only point the whole time, nothing can be known definitively except pure subjectivity itself. What do you think? I don't know, Light Mystic. I have this idea that Enlightenment means seeing what IS, but since it can only be pointed to and never discribed... The fact that we can measure a frequency of light and (those that aren't colour blind) agree that it's Red suggests that there may be something objective underneath it all. If it is all subjective, it is at least consistently so Read my Free Ebook--www.experientialknowingness.co.uk-- oh and cease the stupid speculating that you keep on doing--CREATION exists-IT proves it existence to one who is Mindless and Conditioned Identityless--NONE of you writing here are MCI less--but you sure di like to babble Well that's your experience. Proof is generally taken to be something that can be used to convince others. There are people in the world to whom "God" has proven his existence; other people have "proof" that aliens exist. Since you can't PROVE this to others, all that can judged is you yourself, your writing and how you interact with others. Ho Ho. You know Swami, if you really were the ONLY person on the planet (along with your two chums) to have discovered CREATION, I would sort of have expected you to sound a little different. I'd have expected some...otherness...to come through in your writing. Instead you rant and insult and set yourself up as "special", just like any of the thousands of internet trolls dragging down the spirit of free enquiry. You seem...ordinary. I read your e-book, remember? I didn't take anything helpful from it. You know, even the worst books to get published get the benefit of editorial assistance. Has anyone looked over your work? How many drafts and revisions has it gone through? I can tell you from first hand experience that seeing the Truth in no way means that you're automatically granted any ability as an author. |
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