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Post by lightmystic on Nov 10, 2008 12:50:53 GMT -5
haha, definately not the only one.
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 10, 2008 14:20:51 GMT -5
Light Mystic-Still unable to live in the difference between unconditional love and conditional love??-The mind has you in its grasp--as for the World being a "cesspit"--do you seriously "believe" it isnt?--you more gullible than you try to appear-this Planet is rent with suffering and over 20 wars being fought out--there is poverty and starvation everywhere-Religions have separated person from person-religions persuede teenagers to kill by being human bombs-- leaders of ALL speak strings of fine-sounding meaningless associated words and gullible people like you defend "spirituality"--The Planet is ruled by GROUPMINDS(of which you are amember of several-Religions Politics Nationalism Racialism Familial Tribal --
wake up and smell the decaff
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 10, 2008 14:22:47 GMT -5
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Post by lightmystic on Nov 10, 2008 14:58:18 GMT -5
I thought you're without mind. What "other people?" Who is gullible that is separate from you? How is what you're talking about unconditional love? In short, what are you talking about? Light Mystic-Still unable to live in the difference between unconditional love and conditional love??-The mind has you in its grasp--as for the World being a "cesspit"--do you seriously "believe" it isnt?--you more gullible than you try to appear-this Planet is rent with suffering and over 20 wars being fought out--there is poverty and starvation everywhere-Religions have separated person from person-religions persuede teenagers to kill by being human bombs-- leaders of ALL speak strings of fine-sounding meaningless associated words and gullible people like you defend "spirituality"--The Planet is ruled by GROUPMINDS(of which you are amember of several-Religions Politics Nationalism Racialism Familial Tribal -- wake up and smell the decaff |
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sophia
Full Member
...the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. ~Plato
Posts: 146
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Post by sophia on Nov 10, 2008 16:10:38 GMT -5
Swami,
I could be wrong but I think that so far, everyone's intentions in this forum is to break away from the dogma of religion and to go within themselves to find God, Creation, the Self, Christ-consciousness, cosmic-consciousness, whatever you want to call it. And, no matter how mindless we become we'll always be part of a familial tribe. Are not you, Grene and your friend Ben part of your own version of GroupMind? Unless we close-up shop and move into a cave alone and permanently we'll always have some attachment to the GroupMind.
I am a little bit confused by things, myself, because I wonder how GroupMind is separate from Creation. How is anything at all separate from Creation?
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sophia
Full Member
...the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. ~Plato
Posts: 146
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Post by sophia on Nov 10, 2008 16:44:50 GMT -5
Hi Peter, Just so you know, I have no problem with honesty. In fact, I have more respect for people who are completely honest with me, no matter how shocking it can be. I looked at the link (still need to read it in detail, though). It brought to mind something that happened last year. When "changes" started happening I went through a sort of panic, because my perspective of the world was starting to change (i.e. it seemed reality had made some shifts). I told a close friend that I was going crazy. At one point, I even thought the end of the world was coming. Those in the psychology industry would no doubt say I have a problem (and they do say that, in case you're wondering!). But I've learned that sometimes the "changes" can be mistaken for a psychological crisis. In fact, many spiritual "feelings" are mistaken for psychological problems. However, I know that psychological problems do exist and might not have anything whatsoever to do with spirituality. In some cases, the spiritual process could even be more than the person can handle and might push them over the edge if they were already in a bad position to begin with. (My friend assured me that I was not going crazy. I think he knew exactly what was happening. He was the "trigger" for my spiritual journey.) In the Rosicrucianism yahoo group they are currently talking about the movie "Fight Club". Some there say that the movie is symbolic of a spiritual process while others there say that the movie is simply a story about insanity. Before I end, I wanted to mention that Master Meher Baba spent a lot of his time working with "Masts". Masts are God-intoxicated pilgrims, seen by the rest of the world as "crazies". Masts can be in varying degrees of the states of salik or majzoob. Salik means more in touch with outward surroundings -- grounded and ordinary. Majzoob refers to that state of being immersed in the inner plane and divorced from the outside world. See en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mast_(Sufism) for more information. These words like "Salik" and "Majzoob" are words not from our culture but I think the idea is global. Yeah....o...kay.... Well I'm having some fairly ambivalent reactions to our discussion this week and that 'ol ego wants to jump in and be all judgemental and give out my Opinion. But I'll reign myself in and just post a wee link that I found interesting, even if you may not agree that it's relevant: biologyofkundalini.com/article.php?story=KundaliniandSchizophreniaOkay. Then just so that I'm not forcing myself to be in balance I'll ask: Am I the only person who's found a few posts bordering on the sinister lately? |
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 11, 2008 2:18:49 GMT -5
Light Mystic-You are gullible because you are a member of GroupMind --You say you "thought" I am without MIND--To "think" is to be in MIND--the GROUPMIND rules through playing upon the gullibility of those ruled by MIND--you are ruled by mind--MIND can ONLY experience CONDITIONAL LOVE--ONLY the MINDLESS can be UNCONDITIONAL LOVE but of course ,as seen on these threads,those in MIND can use any words(and do) in their self-Deception--Words have no shame or Morality-LIEING is endemic by those in MIND--Projecting a Self-Image is the lingua-franca of those,like you are and Sophia,who are in MIND
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Post by Peter on Nov 11, 2008 8:29:28 GMT -5
Swami
What was your intention when you wrote the above, what were you trying to achieve? What did you think the effect of your writing would be on those that read it? What emotional state were you in when you wrote it?
Regards,
Peter
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Post by lightmystic on Nov 11, 2008 11:31:32 GMT -5
You are coming from a certain perspective Swami. To even have a body and function in reality requires coming from a certain perspective. You may realize that you That which is running all things and not limited to the individual, but, nonetheless, the individual is still coming from a perspective. Any perspective is wrong by definition (or only partially right) because it's saying that it's one thing but not other, thus excluding some things. Therefore it can't be the whole thing. A perspective can point to the whole thing, but so can the opposite perspective, because the whole thing is whole. It excludes nothing.  That's the joke. Thus, it's putting any stock in individual perspectives as anything other than thoughts that causes problems. The mind makes suggestions, gives advice and simulated scenarios. It's taking those scenarios to be real, binding, and limiting that causes suffering. How can you possible have THE "right" opinion? There's no way to express the experience, and everyone already is That. Every is a thought, or a suggestion, or a perception. Whether they are okay or not is several extra layers of belief stemming from your own feelings. I'm totally working on this too. Fundamental experience is immutably non-duality. But I'm looking at all the old patterns that appear to behave in duality and seeing them as false. I think you experienced me doing that process with you first hand on a different thread. You are lying swami, telling partial truths. The truth cannot be said, you cannot but lie. As soon as you say, "I" or "you" you are lying. Shameful, really swami. What can't you just speak nondually!? (That is, of course, impossible by definition, as every sentence requires a subject and object). Here: I'll attempt to speak nondually: I Iing I. Ha! Didn't work. "I" is still a limited conception that doesn't fit experience ultimately. hehe. Light Mystic-You are gullible because you are a member of GroupMind --You say you "thought" I am without MIND--To "think" is to be in MIND--the GROUPMIND rules through playing upon the gullibility of those ruled by MIND--you are ruled by mind--MIND can ONLY experience CONDITIONAL LOVE--ONLY the MINDLESS can be UNCONDITIONAL LOVE but of course ,as seen on these threads,those in MIND can use any words(and do) in their self-Deception--Words have no shame or Morality-LIEING is endemic by those in MIND--Projecting a Self-Image is the lingua-franca of those,like you are and Sophia,who are in MIND |
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Post by Peter on Nov 11, 2008 11:56:58 GMT -5
Something I have been guilty of in the past is avoiding confrontation because I want to be liked. However I also think there's a lot to be said (especially when contributing to an un-moderated public forum where flame wars can erupt at the drop of a hat) for considering if what you're writing is helpful to the recipient. If honest communication causes offence and knee-jerk reaction (although that isn't something I've seen you indulge in so far), then it is of limited usefulness. And something I think we need to be mindful of in making spiritual progress is discernment - is such-and-such a useful thing for me? We have a limited amount of time in these bodies after all.
Something that you might find helpful is to look through your posts to Swami and notice the changing tone from positive to negative and back again. Why do you think they do that? What was your intention?
Yes indeed. My own experience was of the end of time/space itself. Very interesting, but difficult to navigate the 'real' world at the same time!
Well the medical establishment do like to label anyone experiencing anything other than consensual reality as having a problem. But then that's what spiritual experience is all about, isn't it! I'm glad you had a friend to assure you that you weren't crazy.
The thing is that a spiritual emergency (good phrase to Google!) is that it ticks all the medical establishment's boxes for having you taken away. That said, an emergency is an emergency and being forced to spend a week sleeping properly and not doing very much can be very helpful in terms of making life more manageable - even if you do come out of the situation with a Bipolar label, which is completely meaningless in any event. A wise person once told me that if you let go of the reins of your life, it can be very difficult to get them back again. I wonder if there's a point of no return in terms of opening those doors to the infinite and being overwhelmed with architypal energys - so Majzoob you can't find your way home.
Good discussion. Symbolic of spiritual progress, or can we say that Edward Norton's Narrator makes actual spiritual progress? Lots of thoughts jumping around about (re)integration of the self reflecting Oneness with the Universe as above so below. Something for a new thread perhaps.
I think what's really positive there is Baba not using "crazy" as a label, but instead accepting that seeing reality in a different way may have some merit.
That said, I think what I want from spiritual progress is to be able to choose. Choose my state of consciousness, choose how I react to any given situation, choose what I do with my life. I see having choice as being an indication of spiritual advancement. It's no good me being lost in an experience of Oneness if I'm also trying to buy rail tickets. Believe me, it's difficult to remember your PIN number at a time like that! And we also have bodies that need to be looked after, which unfortunately means needing an income, cooking, cleaning.
Out of time, enough for now.
Cheers,
Peter
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 11, 2008 12:07:05 GMT -5
Light"mystic"-still dribbling out Chains of fine sounding but Meaningless associated words
Read my Ebook-www.experientialknowingness.co.uk
I point out the only way-you debate the colour of the Path as do all others her--Peter and Sophia and others
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 11, 2008 12:24:51 GMT -5
Peter-I was listening to Erik Saties Trois Gymnopaedies or Winter Song by Bill Dixon when I wrote I was in a "balanced state of "emotions as I always am"-emotions are there to be used and listened to and appreciated and NOT as "religions"LIE to be repressed-the trick is Balance--Not wobbling to either side of DUALITY. Like so many others you confuse Robust Passion with "anger" or other Emotions that you conditioned yourself to repress- this repression you learn from reading the "religious twaddle"that you ,like others,stuff your heads full of in the vain hope that the "wisdom" in these Books with their "glorious descriptions"willyou get "there"--the WAY is through understanding the Physiological and Psychological makeup of the Human Body(the Ancient Yogis and Yoginis strove towards this but unfortunately did not have our Vocabulary to describe the Internal world to them SELVES-and so became slaves to Ignorance-unfortunately. The State of Separate and Merged can ONLY be "experienced"-I do NOT attempt to describe it as various writers and Ecclesiastics in the Past and Present try to do for to do so is not only IMPOSSIBLE but misleading!!-the State can ONLY be "experienced" and the ONLY way to that Experience is by following the Path of the Six Fundamental Yogas written in my FREE Ebook www.experientialknowingness.co.ukI only point the WAY-it is your choice to ignore or ridicule or try to debate-I am too busy/absorbed/"knocked out enjoying my Permanent state of Separate and Merged with CREATION to waste time on the trivialities of ALL "religions" that you and nearly ALL of Humanity fill your lives with. MANNgrene@yahoo.co.uk |
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Post by Peter on Nov 11, 2008 13:03:04 GMT -5
Hmm, see, you managed to answer the question about your emotional state (before rushing off to repeat yourself about how right you are, and how wrong everyone else is - which is becoming neither more convincing or more interesting with reiteration), but what about intention and expected effect on others?
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Post by swamicollins on Nov 11, 2008 14:13:13 GMT -5
Peter-I do NOT give a FLYING F+++ about the effect I have on others--It is for them to "make up their Minds"-I am in Permanent UNION with CREATION and thats enough for me so your verbal play is just NOT interesting to me(or CREATION)-- As for being CORRECT(not right or wrong) this is what I am--CORRECT -You are Wrong that is what you are-so its simple to me(youll debate that as youll debate anything as long as you can express it in words). You have no understanding of CREATION and No experience of CREATION either-I speak truthfully about you-you would and will tell LIES- I point out the way but cannot tell you about the experience for I AM THE EXPERIENCE and you are the Mind confused Conditioned Identity lost in conjecture and supposition and presumption(fed by the books you waste your life reading.)(possibly also the Narcotic Addictive Drugs that ONLY feed and strengthen the Mind/Conditioned Identities grip over the BrainCentre of the Vehicle/Body that "you" are incarnated in --simple?? Read my latest Post--CREATION read my Free Ebook www.experientialknowingness.co.uk |
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Post by lightmystic on Nov 11, 2008 14:14:44 GMT -5
Everything you say is also a lie Swami. The best you can do is give pointers. Any pointer if course a concept. Are you bringing people closer to truth? It doesn't seem so with the closed off attitude you have. You're just another mind doing mind-like things. Of course I am too, but you are not different. It would be nice though right? It would be nice if you were special and everyone else was wrong. Good luck with that though, you won't find it in duality. Light"mystic"-still dribbling out Chains of fine sounding but Meaningless associated words Read my Ebook-www.experientialknowingness.co.uk I point out the only way-you debate the colour of the Path as do all others her--Peter and Sophia and others |
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That's the joke.