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Post by silver on Nov 25, 2013 14:42:16 GMT -5
Ah, I was just watching him in Casting Shadow on the tube -- he looks like a plucked chicken to me, heh. Not so attractive, but all that matters to me with these teachers is that their vids are reasonable quality so I can hear what the f they're saying. It sounds interesting so I plan on listening to the whole thing.
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Post by zendancer on Nov 25, 2013 14:43:08 GMT -5
Silver: The "path to freedom" is just a pointer to what is already and always free and at peace. It is who you ARE. In the video satsang with Mooji I mentioned yesterday (google "Mooji anybody can be nobody") Mooji interacts with a woman who is obviously "spun up." You can sense her uptightness just by watching her. Mooji recognizes her situation, and searches for a way to stop her mind. He says, "No sadhana for you," because he recognizes that she will latch onto any kind of spiritual practice he might mention and run with it--thereby missing what he wants her to see.
He therefore tells her to relax for a few moments and just "be nobody." The woman says, "But I want to be special," which is amazingly honest. Mooji understands, and keeps pointing her back to what she is if she is a nobody instead of a somebody. It takes a while, but you can see the point where the woman "gets it," relaxes, and begins to laugh. Later, she begins to re-enter the mind, and begins to worry that she will "lose it." In her case, Mooji has given her a tool--"just be nobody"--to help her find what she glimpsed for a few minutes. The video is well worth watching.
Becoming free from the mind is........freeing. Don;t take anyone's word for this; check it out for yourself.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2013 14:43:28 GMT -5
You totally crack me up, JB. Love it. Packaging -- it's all about the packaging / marketing, heh. I'll have to check out Wilber -- haven't seen him. Well here's the virile Ken Wilbur in bed, stopping his brainwaves it's actually pretty cool, though I wouldn't know if it's true or not. Is this PIAD? Of course it's real, if FREEDOM can pretend to be a separate person SEEKING something it never lost, which is FREEDOM... Pretending to be a separate person who can stop their brainwaves is a piece of cake...
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Post by ???????? ???????????? on Nov 25, 2013 14:46:40 GMT -5
You totally crack me up, JB. Love it. Packaging -- it's all about the packaging / marketing, heh. I'll have to check out Wilber -- haven't seen him. Have no illusions. That's how it works. Even scientifically proved. If you look at a beutiful face then body releases happy chemicals and you feel good. Every morning when I read the news sometimes they have articles that I'm not interested at all, i don't even read title, but it has pretty young woman picture, so I click it just to look at the woman. Then I ask, that's retarded article, who reads that? Nobody of course. 50% just click to look at the face. In the science lab they showed picturs of political candidates to random people who weren't interested in politics at all and didn't know the peole on the pictures. They showed a lot of pictures, always two together, then they has to quickly choose which one is trustworthier. And then the shocking result that test people usually chose the prettier face, and the really shokcing result is that who they choose usually won the election. So people trust pretty people more, and most politicians win because the opponent is uglier. People are stupid stupid disgusting creatures. It's the same thing everywhere. Especially in spirituality. Because think about it. What do spiritual teachers always say? Follow your intuition. Pick the teachers that "feels right" to you. What does it mean when something feels good? Brain releases happy chemicals. And when does the brain release these chemicals? When people look at pretty faces. That's why it will always be hard for ugly people to become successful spiritual teacher.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2013 14:46:49 GMT -5
Well here's the virile Ken Wilbur in bed, stopping his brainwaves it's actually pretty cool, though I wouldn't know if it's true or not. Is this PIAD? I don't want to watch the video Max but did he slow his brain waves down? Like a delta wave or something? Oh yea he hits several different EEG patterns and narrates the whole thing in his uniquely geeky verbose way. It's worth a watch -- sort of like watching a good juggler, except the opposite -- he's putting everything down (hardy har).
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2013 14:49:33 GMT -5
Silver: The "path to freedom" is just a pointer to what is already and always free and at peace. It is who you ARE. In the video satsang with Mooji I mentioned yesterday (google "Mooji anybody can be nobody") Mooji interacts with a woman who is obviously "spun up." You can sense her uptightness just by watching her. Mooji recognizes her situation, and searches for a way to stop her mind. He says, "No sadhana for you," because he recognizes that she will latch onto any kind of spiritual practice he might mention and run with it--thereby missing what he wants her to see. He therefore tells her to relax for a few moments and just "be nobody." The woman says, "But I want to be special," which is amazingly honest. Mooji understands, and keeps pointing her back to what she is if she is a nobody instead of a somebody. It takes a while, but you can see the point where the woman "gets it," relaxes, and begins to laugh. Later, she begins to re-enter the mind, and begins to worry that she will "lose it." In her case, Mooji has given her a tool--"just be nobody"--to help her find what she glimpsed for a few minutes. The video is well worth watching. Becoming free from the mind is........freeing. Don;t take anyone's word for this; check it out for yourself. Understanding or having CLARITY about freeing ONESELF, or the sense of a SELF from the MIND is DUALITY... It isn't FREEDOM...
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2013 14:50:41 GMT -5
Well here's the virile Ken Wilbur in bed, stopping his brainwaves it's actually pretty cool, though I wouldn't know if it's true or not. Is this PIAD? Of course it's real, if FREEDOM can pretend to be a separate person SEEKING something it never lost, which is FREEDOM... Pretending to be a separate person who can stop their brainwaves is a piece of cake... The all caps SCHTICK is GOOD.
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Post by silver on Nov 25, 2013 14:52:51 GMT -5
You totally crack me up, JB. Love it. Packaging -- it's all about the packaging / marketing, heh. I'll have to check out Wilber -- haven't seen him. Have no illusions. That's how it works. Even scientifically proved. If you look at a beutiful face then body releases happy chemicals and you feel good. Every morning when I read the news sometimes they have articles that I'm not interested at all, i don't even read title, but it has pretty young woman picture, so I click it just to look at the woman. Then I ask, that's retarded article, who reads that? Nobody of course. 50% just click to look at the face. In the science lab they showed picturs of political candidates to random people who weren't interested in politics at all and didn't know the peole on the pictures. They showed a lot of pictures, always two together, then they has to quickly choose which one is trustworthier. And then the shocking result that test people usually chose the prettier face, and the really shokcing result is that who they choose usually won the election. So people trust pretty people more, and most politicians win because the opponent is uglier. People are stupid stupid disgusting creatures. It's the same thing everywhere. Especially in spirituality. Because think about it. What do spiritual teachers always say? Follow your intuition. Pick the teachers that "feels right" to you. What does it mean when something feels good? Brain releases happy chemicals. And when does the brain release these chemicals? When people look at pretty faces. That's why it will always be hard for ugly people to become successful spiritual teacher. I know it's true. When Bill Clinton was running the first time, me and an older woman friend were talking about the upcoming election, and she flat out said she was more than likely going to vote for him because of his good looks. I was more than a little stunned. Can you imagine some of the ancient US presidents getting elected these days? Like Lincoln -- wouldn't stand a chance. Before the media really took hold, that is.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2013 14:56:31 GMT -5
This reminds of Sailor Bob's 'Full Stop.' At some point in the conversation here there was talk about hitting the Pause button. The trick with PIAD and Full Stop and the Pause button is that thoughts immediately arise that are pretty much like "what?" "how do I do that?" "where's the Pause button?" "How do I know if it's fully stopped?" All these absurd thoughts come up. Or even after a while of 'no thinking' there's a thought that comes up like "was that Full Stop?" yada yada yada. "Now I'm just whining." Maybe after the fact, after some sort of realization, the ability to just Full Stop or Pause or PIAD is obvious. I'm not seeing it right now. The thing about ATA is that it gives attention something to do besides ride the next thought horse that comes along. It's a substitute of sorts. Max: Yes, PIAD, full stop, and the pause button are all pointing to the space between thoughts or prior to thoughts. And yes, ATA is a way of shifting attention to that space of non-conceptual awareness. Thinking usually begets thinking, and silence usually begets silence. The more time one spends in silence the clearer "what is" appears without the usual conceptual overlay. Realization is not necessary for Full Stop to be recognized, but a certain degree of silence is usually necessary--an amount that is largely dependent upon how spun up the mind's condition is. If humans had a sensing device on their heads that measured ideas per minute (IDP), sort of like a tachometer on a car's engine, and this idea-ometer? was connected to a wrist-watch readout, they could use it like a biofeedback device and thereby see how to lower their IDP (much like BF blood pressure machines). If you read the posts on this forum, you will notice that some posters are "spun up" to a high degree. They have so many ideas spinning out of their intellects that they stay "revved up" all the time. Sages say that their "cups are full" (no more will go in), and they are therefore less likely to hear anything that doesn't conform to their incessantly-repeated ideas. These kinds of folks will usually have a much harder time attaining Full Stop or even slowing down the rate of IDP. The good news is that even people who have highly-revved up intellects can sometimes have moments of clarity and see that there is something that is always free of thought--something that simply sees thoughts, but doesn't have to stay entranced in thoughts. One moment of clarity can sometimes illuminate the path to freedom. It seems like there's something else, though. The state of being absent a milieu of thinking is one I'm familiar with. The thing I don't get is the bliss talk about it. Pure bodily sensation with minimal commentary or reflection or whatever. Going from resisting what is -- basically having comments and arguments with what's happening, or just being more into daydreams, planning or memories than what's happening -- to 'loving' what is, seems like a big leap. To me, what is, is just plain living. There's not really anything extraspecial about it at all.
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Post by silver on Nov 25, 2013 14:57:53 GMT -5
Silver: The "path to freedom" is just a pointer to what is already and always free and at peace. It is who you ARE. In the video satsang with Mooji I mentioned yesterday (google "Mooji anybody can be nobody") Mooji interacts with a woman who is obviously "spun up." You can sense her uptightness just by watching her. Mooji recognizes her situation, and searches for a way to stop her mind. He says, "No sadhana for you," because he recognizes that she will latch onto any kind of spiritual practice he might mention and run with it--thereby missing what he wants her to see. He therefore tells her to relax for a few moments and just "be nobody." The woman says, "But I want to be special," which is amazingly honest. Mooji understands, and keeps pointing her back to what she is if she is a nobody instead of a somebody. It takes a while, but you can see the point where the woman "gets it," relaxes, and begins to laugh. Later, she begins to re-enter the mind, and begins to worry that she will "lose it." In her case, Mooji has given her a tool--"just be nobody"--to help her find what she glimpsed for a few minutes. The video is well worth watching. Becoming free from the mind is........freeing. Don;t take anyone's word for this; check it out for yourself. Thanks, ZD. I'm the kind to skip to the end of the book, so I probably won't watch it -- his voice dips down so low a lot of the time and can't understand what he's saying -- too slow-speaking for my tastes, but I can appreciate what it's about, yeah. I sometimes forget it's about who we are and not just stopping or slowing down the thinking. If this stuff were easy to grok, would we still all be here talking about it?
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Post by zendancer on Nov 25, 2013 14:58:29 GMT -5
Silver: The "path to freedom" is just a pointer to what is already and always free and at peace. It is who you ARE. In the video satsang with Mooji I mentioned yesterday (google "Mooji anybody can be nobody") Mooji interacts with a woman who is obviously "spun up." You can sense her uptightness just by watching her. Mooji recognizes her situation, and searches for a way to stop her mind. He says, "No sadhana for you," because he recognizes that she will latch onto any kind of spiritual practice he might mention and run with it--thereby missing what he wants her to see. He therefore tells her to relax for a few moments and just "be nobody." The woman says, "But I want to be special," which is amazingly honest. Mooji understands, and keeps pointing her back to what she is if she is a nobody instead of a somebody. It takes a while, but you can see the point where the woman "gets it," relaxes, and begins to laugh. Later, she begins to re-enter the mind, and begins to worry that she will "lose it." In her case, Mooji has given her a tool--"just be nobody"--to help her find what she glimpsed for a few minutes. The video is well worth watching. Becoming free from the mind is........freeing. Don;t take anyone's word for this; check it out for yourself. Understanding or having CLARITY about freeing ONESELF, or the sense of a SELF from the MIND is DUALITY... It isn't FREEDOM... That's rather obvious, but that's also why most of us constantly say, "Look where the words are pointing and don't get attached to the words." (sigh)
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Post by andrew on Nov 25, 2013 14:59:41 GMT -5
I don't want to watch the video Max but did he slow his brain waves down? Like a delta wave or something? Oh yea he hits several different EEG patterns and narrates the whole thing in his uniquely geeky verbose way. It's worth a watch -- sort of like watching a good juggler, except the opposite -- he's putting everything down (hardy har). Okay, thanks, I'll give it a go. Reason I asked is because I have played with brain waves over the years, and have found the real slow delta ones nice....but after a while it begins to feel like I've had a lobotomy. Its not still mind clarity, its fuzzy, can't think even if I wanted to. Sometimes, oddly enough, a Beta wave, which is normally associated with high thinking activity and anxiety, can be good for people with very active minds. For some reason, speeding things up a bit can actually sooth the mind. Gamma wave is also interesting, those that meditate a lot are said to be high in Gamma, it is associated with unity consciousness and compassion. But that's a very high brain wave. Almost like its too high for typically analyzing self-referential thoughts to arise. I'm no expert on this stuff by the way, I just find it kinda interesting.
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Post by zendancer on Nov 25, 2013 15:01:29 GMT -5
Max: Yes, PIAD, full stop, and the pause button are all pointing to the space between thoughts or prior to thoughts. And yes, ATA is a way of shifting attention to that space of non-conceptual awareness. Thinking usually begets thinking, and silence usually begets silence. The more time one spends in silence the clearer "what is" appears without the usual conceptual overlay. Realization is not necessary for Full Stop to be recognized, but a certain degree of silence is usually necessary--an amount that is largely dependent upon how spun up the mind's condition is. If humans had a sensing device on their heads that measured ideas per minute (IDP), sort of like a tachometer on a car's engine, and this idea-ometer? was connected to a wrist-watch readout, they could use it like a biofeedback device and thereby see how to lower their IDP (much like BF blood pressure machines). If you read the posts on this forum, you will notice that some posters are "spun up" to a high degree. They have so many ideas spinning out of their intellects that they stay "revved up" all the time. Sages say that their "cups are full" (no more will go in), and they are therefore less likely to hear anything that doesn't conform to their incessantly-repeated ideas. These kinds of folks will usually have a much harder time attaining Full Stop or even slowing down the rate of IDP. The good news is that even people who have highly-revved up intellects can sometimes have moments of clarity and see that there is something that is always free of thought--something that simply sees thoughts, but doesn't have to stay entranced in thoughts. One moment of clarity can sometimes illuminate the path to freedom. It seems like there's something else, though. The state of being absent a milieu of thinking is one I'm familiar with. The thing I don't get is the bliss talk about it. Pure bodily sensation with minimal commentary or reflection or whatever. Going from resisting what is -- basically having comments and arguments with what's happening, or just being more into daydreams, planning or memories than what's happening -- to 'loving' what is, seems like a big leap. To me, what is, is just plain living. There's not really anything extraspecial about it at all. Yes. Ignore the bliss part and any other similar words implying specialness.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2013 15:14:17 GMT -5
Understanding or having CLARITY about freeing ONESELF, or the sense of a SELF from the MIND is DUALITY... It isn't FREEDOM... That's rather obvious, but that's also why most of us constantly say, " Look where the words are pointing and don't get attached to the words." (sigh) Obviously it isn't obvious, it's the fundamental misconception of so called non-dual teachers, that there is a separate me that has choice, freewill and volition... You are affirming an 'I' (subject) that LOOKS at where the words are POINTING(object). You are affirming an ILLUSION. There is just Wholeness and Wholeness doesn't see objects... There is NOBODY LOOKING... There is NOBODY typing this post and NOBODY reading it... There is however WHAT IS HAPPENING, but it isn't HAPPENING TO A SOMEBODY...
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Post by ???????? ???????????? on Nov 25, 2013 15:14:35 GMT -5
I know it's true. When Bill Clinton was running the first time, me and an older woman friend were talking about the upcoming election, and she flat out said she was more than likely going to vote for him because of his good looks. I was more than a little stunned. Can you imagine some of the ancient US presidents getting elected these days? Like Lincoln -- wouldn't stand a chance. Before the media really took hold, that is. I am different though. I don't trust pretty people one bit. First of course becasue of envy and I hate them, escpecially if you're male and pretty then I'll hate you and want to punch you in the face for stealing all the girls. I can'T be friends with someone who is pretty, because think about it you go to a party or something together and then you'll always in his shadow, wtf I don't need that. I also dont understand women when one is fat and ugly and the other is really pretty and they go out together, I think like wtf is wrong with the ugly one, how stupid is she, doesn't she understand that her friend only accencuates her ugliness? So I really hate pretty males, but I don't mind pretty women, I would never buy something from them, except their body if I had the money, my brain still works in that sense, but the chemicals also still work and I can't really hate them no matter what. So if they sell something, especially in politics if someone is pretty then I get extremely suspicious.
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