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May 10, 2011 12:47:14 GMT -5
Post by onehandclapping on May 10, 2011 12:47:14 GMT -5
Just be. No plans because that leads to disappointment when they are not accomplished. Just be. Thoughts come and go and life just happens. Let it unfold in front of you. No thought of it should be different than it is at this moment. Just be.
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May 10, 2011 13:47:55 GMT -5
Post by mamza on May 10, 2011 13:47:55 GMT -5
Please don't get attached to my words. I used the word 'plan' because without it the sentence would sound awkward and make very little sense.
As fun as the word games were a month or two ago, I'm about done with the semantics of it all. At this point the majority of this business is understood far more than it probably should be, and it's just a matter of figuring out what to do when it comes to sleep.
A lot of energy (for semantic games: no energy, nobody using it) is put into ATA, and it's strange that it's pretty much impossible to fall asleep without drifting off into dream-land first.
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May 10, 2011 15:01:37 GMT -5
Post by enigma on May 10, 2011 15:01:37 GMT -5
I guess what I tried to say is you're letting go of the conscious awareness that you use to attend, and I don't see a problem with this. In deep sleep, there's nobody there to attend to anything, and that's where you're going every night.
It's just a personal perspective, but I say when your head hits the pillow, stop trying to do or not do anything. Punch the time clock and check out.
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May 10, 2011 15:18:53 GMT -5
Post by enigma on May 10, 2011 15:18:53 GMT -5
They no longer believe their thoughts to be true, which can't actually be a conclusion derived from thought. So, basically you're saying that time is the movement of consciousness, or more simply, the movement of thought- and that the true self (for lack of a better label) existing in the ever-renewing eternal now, is neither an observer nor an object of observation? I'm asking because I've always wondered what happens in meditation when I slip into the gap between thoughts. The mantra just disappears, and I'm not aware of it until I'm aware of it, and return to the mantra. When it happens like that, what sometimes feels like a 15-20 minute meditation actually had a duration much longer- 30 minutes to an hour at times. It is stranger than we can think, for sure. Well, what I'm hearing you talk about sounds like a mind state, and that can be anything or nothing, so who knows? What I was saying is much simpler. When folks turn to their experience for verification that what they believe is true, they find that it's always true because they believe it is, until they don't, and then there's the experience of something else, like maybe the experience of discovering that what they thought is true isn't really true. Hehe. It's just another experience. I would say what you really are IS an observer. How would observing happen otherwise?
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May 10, 2011 15:45:09 GMT -5
Post by Portto on May 10, 2011 15:45:09 GMT -5
Why do mind, body, and spirit feel separate when they are not? (This one sometimes keeps me awake at night) Because the thought pops up.
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May 10, 2011 15:47:12 GMT -5
Post by Portto on May 10, 2011 15:47:12 GMT -5
Because the thought is believed. Hehe. What if the thought "I can fly" is believed?
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May 10, 2011 16:24:09 GMT -5
Post by ivory on May 10, 2011 16:24:09 GMT -5
Because the thought is believed. Hehe. What if the thought "I can fly" is believed? Just don't jump off of a tall building. Maybe test that belief on something smaller.
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May 10, 2011 16:25:46 GMT -5
Post by Portto on May 10, 2011 16:25:46 GMT -5
What if the thought "I can fly" is believed? Good question, Porto. I say that because there's a whole bunch of yogic flyers who, through one-pointed focused intention, defy gravity. They don't fly like birds, but the Wright brothers didn't either in the beginning. I sense evolution will have the final say. Wow, I wouldn't mind levitating either. But I didn't see any human able to do that. Those yogi reports are most likely anecdotal.
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May 10, 2011 16:27:03 GMT -5
Post by Portto on May 10, 2011 16:27:03 GMT -5
What if the thought "I can fly" is believed? Just don't jump off of a tall building. Maybe test that belief on something smaller. Haha, yes, even Enigma suggested people should try taking off instead of jumping off. ;D ;D
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May 10, 2011 16:28:27 GMT -5
Post by Portto on May 10, 2011 16:28:27 GMT -5
Gypsywind and Ivory: My post was meant as an example that believing something to be true doesn't make it necessarily so.
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May 10, 2011 16:30:02 GMT -5
Post by Portto on May 10, 2011 16:30:02 GMT -5
A TV crew in Boston actually got the yogic flyers on camera. I've often wondered if it has been posted on youtube. Interesting. That would keep people busy for a long while, if it were true...
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May 10, 2011 17:01:13 GMT -5
Post by enigma on May 10, 2011 17:01:13 GMT -5
Because the thought is believed. Hehe. What if the thought "I can fly" is believed? Can you really believe it? (Don't try it until you can. Hehe.) There are folks (I believe) who believe they don't have to eat, and they don't (Bretharians) There are some who (I believe) believe they can float in the air, and so they can. There are those who believe (I believe) that they can throw somebody across the room with energy, and so they can. I believe I can alter somebody's energy anywhere on the planet with a thought, and so in my experience I can. I can eat pretty much anything I want these days and not gain weight because I've come to believe that the body can throw off what it doesn't need, and so it does. These things are accomplished by continually pushing the boundaries of what seems possible until it is believed that it's possible through our experience of it. It's not always spiritually correct to say in a nondual context that all things are possible, but in fact there are no boundaries anywhere. It's a dream. The boundaries are imagined, and it's those boundaries that define the borders of our lives.
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Deleted
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May 10, 2011 17:01:43 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on May 10, 2011 17:01:43 GMT -5
Wow, I wouldn't mind levitating either. But I didn't see any human able to do that. Those yogi reports are most likely anecdotal. A TV crew in Boston actually got the yogic flyers on camera. I've often wondered if it has been posted on youtube. video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3825056345770693923#looks a bit more frog like to me. still, that takes some effort!
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May 10, 2011 17:04:48 GMT -5
Post by mamza on May 10, 2011 17:04:48 GMT -5
I guess what I tried to say is you're letting go of the conscious awareness that you use to attend, and I don't see a problem with this. In deep sleep, there's nobody there to attend to anything, and that's where you're going every night. It's just a personal perspective, but I say when your head hits the pillow, stop trying to do or not do anything. Punch the time clock and check out. This is what I do, actually. I don't see a problem with a whole lot of anything, but I was curious to know if there was a way to fall asleep while ATA or if it were even that beneficial. Probably not considering it only takes a few minutes to fall asleep, haha. Thanks for the help, yet again!
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May 10, 2011 17:06:49 GMT -5
Post by enigma on May 10, 2011 17:06:49 GMT -5
"I still don't think that mind, body, and spirit feeling separate when they are not has anything to do with a thought being believed. It's more like a lack of awareness."
They seem separate because you had the idea that they are separate, and you believed that idea. Ever since then, it all SEEMS separate in spite of the idea that it is not, which is NOT believed.
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