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Post by enigma on Jun 13, 2013 18:41:31 GMT -5
Well, that's one of the topics we discuss here on a regular basis. The idea that all ideas are equally true or equally false or irrelevant is another topic. I don't see all ideas as being equally true, valid or useful. Maybe I'm about to lose my nondualist card? Does non-volition mean to you that knowing something can't result in change? Not change that "you" or "I" Can affectuate. Why is there an issue about who is causing the change? Why isn't it enough that change results from knowledge? If 'you' can't take credit for a change, then it's useless?
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Post by enigma on Jun 13, 2013 18:44:20 GMT -5
I can offer evidence that it's more truthy that it's Thursday than Monday, so I guess some kinds of truthiness are more truthy than others? Do you see this trail leading down the bunny hole? You can offer truthy evidence that its Thursday for you, and in this case quite a few other people, but that's no evidence of a truth that's always true, even today, on Thursday ;-) What day is it in Singhapor right now :-) Also, I can pull out some Quantum Mechanics mathematics that "Prove" with as much certianty as 1+1=2 that we live in a hyper dimensional universe with infinite variability, and that someplace, right now, it's Monday for you at this moment. Just sayin....
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Post by andrew on Jun 13, 2013 18:45:33 GMT -5
If truth isn't arbritrary, or relative, then where or what is it? Well, that's one of the topics we discuss here on a regular basis. The idea that all ideas are equally true or equally false or irrelevant is another topic. I don't see all ideas as being equally true, valid or useful. Maybe I'm about to lose my nondualist card? Does non-volition mean to you that knowing something can't result in change? Its the same topic. In the context in which we say that form is emptiness and emptiness is form, all ideas are equally true/false, valid/invalid, useful/not-useful.
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Post by andrew on Jun 13, 2013 18:50:06 GMT -5
You can prove that its true that its a Thursday? How are you going to prove that? Don't get me wrong, I experience it to be true that its Thursday but just because I experience it to be true, doesn't make it necessarily the truth. You claim that it really actually IS Thursday? I know, I know, I'm going way out on a limb here. Always the skeptical eye. Good on you. Its not a case of skeptism, its about disidentification from thought. You're going out on a limb by saying that you can prove its Thursday, yes. It's saying that ideas have a solid foundation. Tsk!
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Post by enigma on Jun 13, 2013 18:52:41 GMT -5
You want me to prove that it's Thursday?? I want you to prove that it's more than just "Truthy" that it's Thursday ;-) Ultimately, the consensus will likely be determined by who does the best lawyering. Can we assign surrogates for that lol I call dibs on Blue ;-) But will take Question or Top if he's not available hehehe Sorry Laffy, you'd be top of the list if I wasn't worried you'd spray the jurors in the eye with wunna those squirt got flowers on your lapel while giving oral arguments :-) So whether or not it's Thursday is a matter of debate?......Okay, I think I'm done here.
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Post by enigma on Jun 13, 2013 18:56:06 GMT -5
Well, that's one of the topics we discuss here on a regular basis. The idea that all ideas are equally true or equally false or irrelevant is another topic. I don't see all ideas as being equally true, valid or useful. Maybe I'm about to lose my nondualist card? Does non-volition mean to you that knowing something can't result in change? Its the same topic. In the context in which we say that form is emptiness and emptiness is form, all ideas are equally true/false, valid/invalid, useful/not-useful. That doesn't sound like the Thursday context.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2013 18:58:21 GMT -5
It struck me as something "to do". To look at the world and its people, including myself, as innocent. Takes a whole lotta judgement away. Kinda scary. Bit it feels like it's what's "needed". Any thoughts? I like it. I ran across something the other day pointing at the same insight... Question: I have read and heard this many times to love one self. I am unable to understand loving myself...Is this statement body related or spirit related? Response: In a spiritual context this means accepting and appreciating all aspects of yourself as valuable and good. Not just the spiritual, but the mental, the emotional and the physical as well. It is about seeing all parts of yourself as necessary. It means you accept all the good the bad, the light the dark in you for what they are, without judgment, with kindness and respect. Everything is part of your wholeness and everything in you is there for a reason and has a role to play in your well-being, learning and self-realization. All of these attitudes: acceptance, kindness, respect, understanding, they all go together to constitute real self love. Love, Deepak Makes sense to me
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Post by andrew on Jun 13, 2013 18:58:37 GMT -5
See, it all stems from your belief in the 'ultimate', which goes hand in hand with you imagining there to be some kind of fixed contexts in which knowledge is true.
No belief in 'ultimate', no fixed contexts, no 'really IS true its Thursday'.
Instead, someone asks what day it is, the information arises that its Thursday, and the information is shared. No story that it is true in a context which can be collapsed into an alleged greasy spot. Its TMT. In fact, non-duality as a whole is TMT, on the other hand, it can be useful to break conditioning.
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Post by andrew on Jun 13, 2013 19:06:36 GMT -5
Its the same topic. In the context in which we say that form is emptiness and emptiness is form, all ideas are equally true/false, valid/invalid, useful/not-useful. That doesn't sound like the Thursday context. Yes, but I only play with the idea of context (just as I might play with the idea of ultimate/absolute). I don't think it really IS true that there really IS a context in which it really IS Thursday!
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Post by andrew on Jun 13, 2013 19:11:08 GMT -5
I want you to prove that it's more than just "Truthy" that it's Thursday ;-) Ultimately, the consensus will likely be determined by who does the best lawyering. Can we assign surrogates for that lol I call dibs on Blue ;-) But will take Question or Top if he's not available hehehe Sorry Laffy, you'd be top of the list if I wasn't worried you'd spray the jurors in the eye with wunna those squirt got flowers on your lapel while giving oral arguments :-) So whether or not it's Thursday is a matter of debate?......Okay, I think I'm done here. That's the point. Any idea can be debated, not least because meaning is fluid and subjective. Such is the nature of ideas.
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Post by tzujanli on Jun 13, 2013 19:22:02 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. I wish you were capable of understanding the absurdity of your statement.. Well, at least you seem open to the possibility. Hehe. The evidence suggests, with no evidence to the contrary, that your contortions to create the illusion that you are 'right', are founded in absurdity, but.. i am open to open honest discussions where your evidence is verifiable, not just more of your beliefs about your imagined ideas.. i do understand why you believe that "it's all imagination", though, that seems to be the source of your 'truth' beliefs.. Be well..
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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 19:26:36 GMT -5
It's a pointer to the fact that ideas are just ideas. What it is not is an invitation to spin with it and say, 'But that's just an idea.....and that.....and that! What if we replace "No idea is ultimately true" with "Nothing lasts forever" ? Any chance the word-lawyers will be more lenient with it? This is partly in honor of Q's return but also it's just to share a really good laugh that's semi-applicable in reply here on two different counts. So I'm watching the news and one particular story actually caused me to get up and exclaim to my wife: "Hey, Clarence Thomas comin' through! The Supreme Court just decided a case against a claim for ownership of a gene ... this should make it harder for corporations to lay claim to ownership to parts of the genome." She replied: "Oh! Wow! thats ..... temporary ...." cracked me up man
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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 19:29:06 GMT -5
To look upon the world with innocence is to see the world AS innocence. hear hear!
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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 19:32:26 GMT -5
Greetings.. Perception's a b!tch.. you see "the slightest of disagreement", i see retreat from honesty and openness through statements of absolute certainty.. you see the "merest hint of a grin:, and i see mockery and ridicule disguised as humor.. all i ask for is open and honest discussions, preferably one-on-one, but.. that's not the way, here, several aligned members move in from different angles,and.. honestly, i can't keep-up, and i'm not interested in that sort of 'spiritual gang violence', so.. step away from the campfire, here's plenty of what you perceive as fuel, and what i perceive as open honesty.. Be well.. Dear Dude/Dudette, Sincerely, The Great Blue Hole Of Belize
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Post by Beingist on Jun 13, 2013 19:34:31 GMT -5
That doesn't sound like the Thursday context. Yes, but I only play with the idea of context (just as I might play with the idea of ultimate/absolute). I don't think it really IS true that there really IS a context in which it really IS Thursday! Yanno, you two really do crack me up, sometimes. Glad to see you back, A. Was missing the entertainment.
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