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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 19:41:17 GMT -5
How can ambiguity escape the turn of the wheel? If everything is ambiguous, then nothing is. Right, ambiguous needs a non-ambiguous reference. Noticing that ideas are essentially imagination doesn't necessarily result in the uncertainty of not knowing whether something is true or not. It is whatever it is as defined within that imagined contextual structure, which may or may not be known. Is it true that it's Thursday in the US? The correct answer is not 'Gosh, I don't know, and I don't know that I don't know, and it's all an ambiguous paradox'. The correct answer is yes, it's true. It is not, however, true in other parts of the world, and it's also not some divinely ordained truth beyond these imagined structures of ideas. In a larger context, time itself is seen as an illusion, w hich doesn't make Thursday false, it makes it irrelevant. Well it's garbage night here and although it's been a cool summer so far this is still relevant to me!
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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 19:44:46 GMT -5
I 've never directly sought you out, Andrew, though I don't generally have an issue with chatting. The Abdrewbat signal was a joke. When I mention you I'm not trying to get your attention, just using you or our conversation as an example to make a point for some who may be trying to put the pieces together. When I said that, I didn't mean anything significant by it. I just meant that you challenge me as much as I challenge you. But Im pretty confident that there are times when I'm not around when you are looking for a bit of Andrew-action hehe. ok haven't read the response to this but there's more than a colonel of non-absolute truthiness here ... (... ha! more bearbouancy as I obviously presianimantly inunexplicanably also channeled Colbert independantly ...)
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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 19:46:00 GMT -5
Haha, yeah, the universal relativity of stuff seems to render it irrelevant :-) I like that place. Right, it doesn't become mysteriously unknowable and ambiguously paradoxical, it just becomes irrelevant. And there can be absolute certainty about that. It is this irrelevance that is quite relevant to the overall conversation on the forum! Greasy spots unite!
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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 19:48:28 GMT -5
Right, ambiguous needs a non-ambiguous reference. Noticing that ideas are essentially imagination doesn't necessarily result in the uncertainty of not knowing whether something is true or not. It is whatever it is as defined within that imagined contextual structure, which may or may not be known. Is it true that it's Thursday in the US? The correct answer is not 'Gosh, I don't know, and I don't know that I don't know, and it's all an ambiguous paradox'. The correct answer is yes, it's true. It is not, however, true in other parts of the world, and it's also not some divinely ordained truth beyond these imagined structures of ideas. In a larger context, time itself is seen as an illusion, which doesn't make Thursday false, it makes it irrelevant. Let's that that practical example. I have no issue at all with saying that its true that it's Thursday in the US (and UK). But I am not invested in the 'truth' of that idea. NOT because I think ideas are not ultimately true, but because I have a) realized the absolutely subjective nature of ideas/things and b) I have released the need to buy into the truth/falsity of ideas. I have no need or interest in collapsing ideas down to an alleged 'ultimate'. Okay, so maybe I'm not totally free of conditioned need and fear, but that's okay, and just because I'm not totally free doesn't make my argument wrong. And there is little interest here in trying to NOT know stuff when knowing stuff happens. Someone asks me whether its Thursday and I say 'yes'. Simple. Unless I am on a spiritual forum and trying to illustrate the absolutely subjective nature of ideas. o fer crissakes ... it's thrusday ...
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Post by Beingist on Jun 13, 2013 19:51:51 GMT -5
Let's that that practical example. I have no issue at all with saying that its true that it's Thursday in the US (and UK). But I am not invested in the 'truth' of that idea. NOT because I think ideas are not ultimately true, but because I have a) realized the absolutely subjective nature of ideas/things and b) I have released the need to buy into the truth/falsity of ideas. I have no need or interest in collapsing ideas down to an alleged 'ultimate'. Okay, so maybe I'm not totally free of conditioned need and fear, but that's okay, and just because I'm not totally free doesn't make my argument wrong. And there is little interest here in trying to NOT know stuff when knowing stuff happens. Someone asks me whether its Thursday and I say 'yes'. Simple. Unless I am on a spiritual forum and trying to illustrate the absolutely subjective nature of ideas. o fer crissakes ... it's thrusday ...
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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 20:00:11 GMT -5
You want me to prove that it's Thursday?? I want you to prove that it's more than just "Truthy" that it's Thursday ;-) Ultimately, the consensus will likely be determined by who does the best lawyering. Can we assign surrogates for that lol I call dibs on Blue ;-) But will take Question or Top if he's not available hehehe Sorry Laffy, you'd be top of the list if I wasn't worried you'd spray the jurors in the eye with wunna those squirt got flowers on your lapel while giving oral arguments :-) good call!
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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 20:04:01 GMT -5
You can prove that its true that its a Thursday? How are you going to prove that? Don't get me wrong, I experience it to be true that its Thursday but just because I experience it to be true, doesn't make it necessarily the truth. You claim that it really actually IS Thursday? I know, I know, I'm going way out on a limb here. Always the skeptical eye. Good on you. how did you manage this Phil? This has got to be the most diabolical bit of comic genius that I've ever witnessed ...
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Post by silence on Jun 13, 2013 20:30:18 GMT -5
That's the most ridiculous nonsense I've read in a while. Note to self: Don't make any appointments with Andrew. Andrew has wrestled his common sense to the ground and is currently strangling it to death.
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Post by enigma on Jun 13, 2013 21:16:13 GMT -5
Yes, but I only play with the idea of context (just as I might play with the idea of ultimate/absolute). I don't think it really IS true that there really IS a context in which it really IS Thursday! Yanno, you two really do crack me up, sometimes. Glad to see you back, A. Was missing the entertainment. Yeah, but do you know what day it is?
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Post by enigma on Jun 13, 2013 21:21:27 GMT -5
Right, it doesn't become mysteriously unknowable and ambiguously paradoxical, it just becomes irrelevant. And there can be absolute certainty about that. It is this irrelevance that is quite relevant to the overall conversation on the forum! Greasy spots unite!
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Post by laughter on Jun 13, 2013 21:22:29 GMT -5
kinda' looks like snoopy!
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Post by enigma on Jun 13, 2013 21:24:28 GMT -5
I know, I know, I'm going way out on a limb here. Always the skeptical eye. Good on you. how did you manage this Phil? This has got to be the most diabolical bit of comic genius that I've ever witnessed ... I've got the best straight man in the biznis.
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Post by enigma on Jun 13, 2013 21:27:31 GMT -5
Note to self: Don't make any appointments with Andrew. Andrew has wrestled his common sense to the ground and is currently strangling it to death.
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Post by enigma on Jun 13, 2013 21:29:43 GMT -5
kinda' looks like snoopy! Doing a twirl on the ice pond?
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Post by Reefs on Jun 13, 2013 21:36:10 GMT -5
I 've never directly sought you out, Andrew, though I don't generally have an issue with chatting. The Abdrewbat signal was a joke. When I mention you I'm not trying to get your attention, just using you or our conversation as an example to make a point for some who may be trying to put the pieces together. When I said that, I didn't mean anything significant by it. I just meant that you challenge me as much as I challenge you. But Im pretty confident that there are times when I'm not around when you are looking for a bit of Andrew-action hehe. Why haven't you been around? Why the hiatus?
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