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Post by Portto on Sept 23, 2011 16:48:32 GMT -5
Well, I could just tell you but that will probably lead to further analysis so it seems to me that the simplest option is for you to tell me what you think talking is, then I will tell you what a talker is in relation to that. Who is analyzing more? I (Porto) or you (Andrew)? The contest is on! Electronic talking is what you see on the screen. Sound talking is when your wife is coming to get you for forgetting to vacuum. |
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Post by andrew on Sept 23, 2011 16:49:17 GMT -5
Following up from the EFT/practices thing.
The way I see it is that illusions are inevitable. The question is, are the illusions we are creating joyful ones? If not, then create a different illusion. If we are struggling to do that, then create an intermediate illusion which enables us to release the illusionary need for a poor quality illusion. Creating these intermediate illusions is not ideal, but sometimes its just the best option available if the structure of our illusions is such that we cannot create a joyful one straight away. Very few people can create joyful illusions straight away (its a work in progress for me too) and those that do tend to be people that experience a dramatic falling away in the structure of their old illusions. Most of us who create the illusion of illusions have to create intermediate illusions and work towards creating joyful ones.
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Post by Portto on Sept 23, 2011 16:51:29 GMT -5
Aren't we bringing more stuff in when we learn how to use these tools? The mind is moving already...it can move outward to either internal or external phenomena, which is the process of creation, or it can move inward by observing and releasing phenomena and undoing....by undoing, either by stopping or releasing, we can come back to being aware of our full nature, Becuase all that's happening when we are not aware of our full nature, is that we are focused on a specific part to the exclusion of the whole... So the mind is moving anyway, its moving into a focus of awareness on specific parts, one part after another....tools are like the steering wheel that turns the focus from outward to inward, and in so doing we unfocuse on the parts and expand our awareness ultimately to the whole, once we come back into direct awareness of the whole we can then move beyond awareness of the whole to pure nonbeing beeing.....there are lots of differant kinds of steering wheels. Yes, and this would be a tropical storm. |
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Post by Portto on Sept 23, 2011 16:54:31 GMT -5
Following up from the EFT/practices thing. The way I see it is that illusions are inevitable. The question is, are the illusions we are creating joyful ones? If not, then create a different illusion. If we are struggling to do that, then create an intermediate illusion which enables us to release the illusionary need for a poor quality illusion. Creating these intermediate illusions is not ideal, but sometimes its just the best option available if the structure of our illusions is such that we cannot create a joyful one straight away. Very few people can create joyful illusions straight away (its a work in progress for me too) and those that do tend to be people that experience a dramatic falling away in the structure of their old illusions. Most of us who create the illusion of illusions have to create intermediate illusions and work towards creating joyful ones. You're building a stairway to heaven! |
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Post by andrew on Sept 23, 2011 16:54:38 GMT -5
Yes, but I think sometimes its worth creating an illusion to release a more problematic persistent one. In a sense, every time a teacher points beyond form s/he is creating an illusion. Not if you run into someone who twists your nose or pokes you with a stick! (I know, you are an exception to this) Yeah, you see, I would say that what is perceived is subjective. Im not quite sure how what you said relates to what we were talking about though. In some ways I am extremely practical and I look at what I think is going to work for someone. If someone says to me that they want to give up binge eating I dont point them to the formless, I point them to EFT or hynotherapy. In the end, I think abiding peace is just a string of peaceful moments, and I take each moment at a time for myself and others. |
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Post by andrew on Sept 23, 2011 16:55:26 GMT -5
Well, I could just tell you but that will probably lead to further analysis so it seems to me that the simplest option is for you to tell me what you think talking is, then I will tell you what a talker is in relation to that. Who is analyzing more? I (Porto) or you (Andrew)? The contest is on! Electronic talking is what you see on the screen. Sound talking is when your wife is coming to get you for forgetting to vacuum. So talking is a form of meaningful communication? |
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Post by andrew on Sept 23, 2011 16:56:27 GMT -5
Following up from the EFT/practices thing. The way I see it is that illusions are inevitable. The question is, are the illusions we are creating joyful ones? If not, then create a different illusion. If we are struggling to do that, then create an intermediate illusion which enables us to release the illusionary need for a poor quality illusion. Creating these intermediate illusions is not ideal, but sometimes its just the best option available if the structure of our illusions is such that we cannot create a joyful one straight away. Very few people can create joyful illusions straight away (its a work in progress for me too) and those that do tend to be people that experience a dramatic falling away in the structure of their old illusions. Most of us who create the illusion of illusions have to create intermediate illusions and work towards creating joyful ones. You're building a stairway to heaven! Yes. For most people currently thats the only way, though there are a few that can do without the illusionary stairs. |
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Post by Portto on Sept 23, 2011 16:59:43 GMT -5
Electronic talking is what you see on the screen. Sound talking is when your wife is coming to get you for forgetting to vacuum. So talking is a form of meaningful communication? No, it's what I said before. |
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Post by Portto on Sept 23, 2011 17:00:24 GMT -5
You're building a stairway to heaven! Yes. For most people currently thats the only way, though there are a few that can do without the illusionary stairs. How far is heaven? |
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Post by andrew on Sept 23, 2011 17:01:29 GMT -5
So talking is a form of meaningful communication? No, it's what I said before. Well, what you did is give me examples just as I think I did hehe. If you can give me a simple definition, I can probably tell you want I think a talker is in relation to that. |
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Post by Portto on Sept 23, 2011 17:04:46 GMT -5
If someone says to me that they want to give up binge eating I dont point them to the formless, I point them to EFT or hynotherapy. And which one works better: taking away the food or continuing to eat between and during hypnosis sessions? |
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Post by Portto on Sept 23, 2011 17:08:05 GMT -5
Well, what you did is give me examples just as I think I did hehe. If you can give me a simple definition, I can probably tell you want I think a talker is in relation to that. Talking is when we imagine a red thingy going towards a green thingy. |
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Post by andrew on Sept 23, 2011 17:08:54 GMT -5
Yes. For most people currently thats the only way, though there are a few that can do without the illusionary stairs. How far is heaven? Practically speaking, that depends on the person - it can be no distance at all for one person, or it can be a long way for another, because although the distance is illusionary it is experienced as actual. Creating an illusion that the distance is illusionary is an intermediate illusion in itself, though Im not sure that that its one I would recommend creating repeatedly with the intent of getting to heaven. I think there are better illusions to create to get 'there'. |
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Post by andrew on Sept 23, 2011 17:11:37 GMT -5
If someone says to me that they want to give up binge eating I dont point them to the formless, I point them to EFT or hynotherapy. And which one works better: taking away the food or continuing to eat between and during hypnosis sessions? You've lost me. There arent many people that I am in a position with to take away their food even if I thought that that would be a good thing to do. |
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Post by andrew on Sept 23, 2011 17:12:52 GMT -5
Well, what you did is give me examples just as I think I did hehe. If you can give me a simple definition, I can probably tell you want I think a talker is in relation to that. Talking is when we imagine a red thingy going towards a green thingy. Cant you just give me a definition? Im sure you could get one off an online dictionary. |
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