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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2013 19:40:44 GMT -5
I claim fair use! Full Circle
Wind whistling through the trees Rose Quartz Endless starry skies The smell of a summer night Wafting through my bedroom window
Oh to have the simple wonder The unchained thoughts The unfettered heart Of a foolish child In a world still too big To fit in a shoe box
Just once more God I promise I won't be careless with it This time -- pg 27 of Satsang Poetry, Copyright 2012 (c) Phil Beaumont (a.k.a., Enigma), all rights reserved A nice poem, unfortunately it contains the misconception of a me that seeks the need for ideas and answers, so that it can become Being/Knowing. The me seeks to dissipate the sense of the self and its fear of unconditional freedom, which is impossible for an illusion. The problem for the me is that what is sought remains hidden from the seeker by already being everything.
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Post by laughter on Nov 5, 2013 20:09:09 GMT -5
I claim fair use! Full Circle
Wind whistling through the trees Rose Quartz Endless starry skies The smell of a summer night Wafting through my bedroom window
Oh to have the simple wonder The unchained thoughts The unfettered heart Of a foolish child In a world still too big To fit in a shoe box
Just once more God I promise I won't be careless with it This time -- pg 27 of Satsang Poetry, Copyright 2012 (c) Phil Beaumont (a.k.a., Enigma), all rights reserved A nice poem, unfortunately it contains the misconception of a me that seeks the need for ideas and answers, so that it can become Being/Knowing. The me seeks to dissipate the sense of the self and its fear of unconditional freedom, which is impossible for an illusion. The problem for the me is that what is sought remains hidden from the seeker by already being everything. You have analyzed a poem.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2013 20:20:59 GMT -5
A nice poem, unfortunately it contains the misconception of a me that seeks the need for ideas and answers, so that it can become Being/Knowing. The me seeks to dissipate the sense of the self and its fear of unconditional freedom, which is impossible for an illusion. The problem for the me is that what is sought remains hidden from the seeker by already being everything. You have analyzed a poem. No I didn't analyze a poem... nobody analyzed a poem...
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Post by enigma on Nov 5, 2013 21:27:48 GMT -5
It's funny, I was going to write a thread asking whether it is more useful to be aware of perceptions, or to attempt to extinguish the existence of perception.For me, it is a part of my spiritual practise to be aware of my perceptions. that awareness gives me responsibility for how I use my perceptions. So rather than becoming lost in them, I can view them honestly for what they are. As in death or permanent void?? Why would anybody want that?
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Post by enigma on Nov 5, 2013 22:03:40 GMT -5
It's funny, I was going to write a thread asking whether it is more useful to be aware of perceptions, or to attempt to extinguish the existence of perception. For me, it is a part of my spiritual practise to be aware of my perceptions. that awareness gives me responsibility for how I use my perceptions. So rather than becoming lost in them, I can view them honestly for what they are. I don't think we can fiddle with our perceptions, only our interpretation of perception. The doorways to perception are what can be opened or not. Full on, 100% unobstructed perception, the doors wide open, is how I understand Tzu's 'still mind' and is ATA at it's finest. Obstructed perception is mostly the case and the project as I see it is to remove the obstructions. It's a trick, though, and I have no advice or expertise on the matter. It seems to me the obstructions to just pure perception are mostly unconscious. So how does one consciously clean out unconscious obstructions? Folks talk about seeing through beliefs, letting go of attachments...but these seem like descriptions of what happens and not prescriptions.It's a good question, and I've never found an answer. Opportunity certainly isn't the answer. And yes, the seeing through and letting go is description rather than prescription.
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Post by enigma on Nov 5, 2013 22:12:24 GMT -5
It's funny, I was going to write a thread asking whether it is more useful to be aware of perceptions, or to attempt to extinguish the existence of perception. For me, it is a part of my spiritual practise to be aware of my perceptions. that awareness gives me responsibility for how I use my perceptions. So rather than becoming lost in them, I can view them honestly for what they are. Hi Autumn, Regarding being aware of perceptions, do you mean being 'self' aware of perceiving? Though this is a poor conceptualization, there seems to be a 'Good', 'Better', and 'Best'. 'Good' would be being consciously aware of your perceptions as opposed to being lost or unconsciously absorbed in them. 'Better' would be being consciously aware of the perceiver perceiving. 'Best' would be perceiving in a manner absolutely free of reasoning, knowing, naming, and identifying. Perceiving directly and openly, with the cognitive lens removed so to speak....Perceiving without 'knowing', identifying, and defining, removes the blinders to the obviousness of the infinite that Blake pointed to. I'm of the experience that spending at least a few moments randomly and often throughout the living of daily life perceiving in that 'Best' manner, informs the mind in ways that are wonderful in our existence, and helps to integrate our consciousness as an infinite Being functioning in a sphere of manifesting phenomena. I agree with the 'good, better, best scenario, though maybe it generally plays out more like a chronology. First, one must become reasonably conscious or the observer mode is not possible. If one has not 'stepped back' in such a way that mind is being observed rather than continuously engaged, stilling the mind seems unlikely as one is regularly being pulled into it.
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Post by enigma on Nov 5, 2013 23:12:59 GMT -5
I claim fair use! Full Circle
Wind whistling through the trees Rose Quartz Endless starry skies The smell of a summer night Wafting through my bedroom window
Oh to have the simple wonder The unchained thoughts The unfettered heart Of a foolish child In a world still too big To fit in a shoe box
Just once more God I promise I won't be careless with it This time -- pg 27 of Satsang Poetry, Copyright 2012 (c) Phil Beaumont (a.k.a., Enigma), all rights reserved A nice poem, unfortunately it contains the misconception of a me that seeks the need for ideas and answers, so that it can become Being/Knowing. The me seeks to dissipate the sense of the self and its fear of unconditional freedom, which is impossible for an illusion. The problem for the me is that what is sought remains hidden from the seeker by already being everything. Gnaw, it's just a longing for lost innocence.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2013 0:55:01 GMT -5
A nice poem, unfortunately it contains the misconception of a me that seeks the need for ideas and answers, so that it can become Being/Knowing. The me seeks to dissipate the sense of the self and its fear of unconditional freedom, which is impossible for an illusion. The problem for the me is that what is sought remains hidden from the seeker by already being everything. Gnaw, it's just a longing for lost innocence. For me it is Being/Knowing dreaming that it is apart from itself, looking all over the place for that which is already Everything.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2013 2:04:07 GMT -5
I don't think we can fiddle with our perceptions, only our interpretation of perception. The doorways to perception are what can be opened or not. Full on, 100% unobstructed perception, the doors wide open, is how I understand Tzu's 'still mind' and is ATA at it's finest. Obstructed perception is mostly the case and the project as I see it is to remove the obstructions. It's a trick, though, and I have no advice or expertise on the matter. It seems to me the obstructions to just pure perception are mostly unconscious. So how does one consciously clean out unconscious obstructions? Folks talk about seeing through beliefs, letting go of attachments...but these seem like descriptions of what happens and not prescriptions.It's a good question, and I've never found an answer. Opportunity certainly isn't the answer. And yes, the seeing through and letting go is description rather than prescription. Hi Enigma, I did go on to reply to these posts. The rest of the conversation is on page one (sorry don't know how to link to multiple posts)
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Post by enigma on Nov 6, 2013 2:45:42 GMT -5
It's a good question, and I've never found an answer. Opportunity certainly isn't the answer. And yes, the seeing through and letting go is description rather than prescription. Hi Enigma, I did go on to reply to these posts. The rest of the conversation is on page one (sorry don't know how to link to multiple posts) Yes, I've read all the posts in this thread.
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Post by quinn on Nov 6, 2013 17:19:49 GMT -5
Obstructed perception is mostly the case and the project as I see it is to remove the obstructions. It's a trick, though, and I have no advice or expertise on the matter. It seems to me the obstructions to just pure perception are mostly unconscious. So how does one consciously clean out unconscious obstructions? Folks talk about seeing through beliefs, letting go of attachments...but these seem like descriptions of what happens and not prescriptions. One way is by turning towards, instead of away from, anything uncomfortable. The hard part is to do that in a welcoming way - openly welcoming. In order to be able to do that, a lot of misconceptions have to have already been unloaded. So there's a bit of a catch-22 there. I can see the value in another way, too, which is to basically quiet the mind however you can do that; ATA, "resting in awareness", mindfulness, whatever. The snag: if there's a lot of unconscious emotional energy (fears, guilt - that sort of thing), those quiet-the-mind practices don't get very far. I agree with Andrew on this, (I think - assuming I'm understanding Andrew), that everyone's mental configuration is so complex and unique that how one sees, let alone cleans out, unconsciousness is also unique. Silence (Mr. Keep-it-Simple) always has the good advice of being honest with oneself. To be able to manage that kind of radical honesty, though...well, I think that's an even more difficult-to-answer question. Maybe it comes down to courage. And intent.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2013 19:03:47 GMT -5
Meditate...reside centered in your essential nature.
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Post by silver on Nov 6, 2013 19:10:10 GMT -5
Could you briefly (?) describe how to recognize this essential nature thingy?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2013 10:26:35 GMT -5
Obstructed perception is mostly the case and the project as I see it is to remove the obstructions. It's a trick, though, and I have no advice or expertise on the matter. It seems to me the obstructions to just pure perception are mostly unconscious. So how does one consciously clean out unconscious obstructions? Folks talk about seeing through beliefs, letting go of attachments...but these seem like descriptions of what happens and not prescriptions. One way is by turning towards, instead of away from, anything uncomfortable. The hard part is to do that in a welcoming way - openly welcoming. In order to be able to do that, a lot of misconceptions have to have already been unloaded. So there's a bit of a catch-22 there. I can see the value in another way, too, which is to basically quiet the mind however you can do that; ATA, "resting in awareness", mindfulness, whatever. The snag: if there's a lot of unconscious emotional energy (fears, guilt - that sort of thing), those quiet-the-mind practices don't get very far. I agree with Andrew on this, (I think - assuming I'm understanding Andrew), that everyone's mental configuration is so complex and unique that how one sees, let alone cleans out, unconsciousness is also unique. Silence (Mr. Keep-it-Simple) always has the good advice of being honest with oneself. To be able to manage that kind of radical honesty, though...well, I think that's an even more difficult-to-answer question. Maybe it comes down to courage. And intent. Yes. I have a good friend who's mother died. It was late November on a blustery day pretty far up the coast of Maine. She stripped her clothes off and stood out in the wind and rain on a rocky outcropping for a long time, taking it all in. Folks who incessantly complain of the weather miss the life it is.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2013 10:28:27 GMT -5
Obstructed perception is mostly the case and the project as I see it is to remove the obstructions. It's a trick, though, and I have no advice or expertise on the matter. It seems to me the obstructions to just pure perception are mostly unconscious. So how does one consciously clean out unconscious obstructions? Folks talk about seeing through beliefs, letting go of attachments...but these seem like descriptions of what happens and not prescriptions. What I've been doing is watching my motives. Like, "why am I talking to this person? "What do I want from him?" Then I find my motive and maybe my motive for my motive. That way at least one knows their real motive. I think thats where honesty comes in. I think that is very useful. There is a dead-end to it, however. What do you do then?
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