Post by tzujanli on Aug 25, 2013 22:56:15 GMT -5
Greetings..
This is an interesting belief, what is Veanta? why does Vedanta hold sway over direct experience or still minded observation?.. what is it about "this" that suggests that it doesn't "actually exist"? What does 'non-dual' mean? I'm asking these questions because if seems like these descriptions reference intangible beliefs 'about' that which 'is'..
Be well..
Some thoughts and it's good to remember Vedanta is a 2000 year old system solely designed to discover who you really are etc.Never a need to re-invent the wheel it worked then and works perfectly now..
Example
What is your current desire? You wrote … " to become really awaken".
But what does that mean to you? What is hidden or you in the meaning of the word awaken. … and then one progresses from there.
Selfinquiry does not mean: Thinking the question "who am I" 24x7 like a parrot. It means inquiring into the experience of the moment. What is there? And what does it mean?
And then you may find that there are ideas and concepts which create suffering. … ideas like "I will die. I am alone. I need love. I need money. etc."
And it is vedanta and its tools which help you to inquire into those areas.
The tool for understanding who you are is Vedanta itself. That is what the word Vedanta means: It is the knowledge that ends the search for knowledge.
Now in terms of tools, there are many. There are Tools to:
- help you prepare your mind for self-knowledge (Qualifications)
- help you understand: “Who you are not”.
- help you understand: “Who you are”
- help you reconcile the apparent duality of the above
But the tools/teachings should be taught by a qualified teacher and they should be taught in a specific order and sequence.
Vedanta removes any doubts or vagueness or misconceptions about that in the mind for good.
This understanding ends the search for yourself and ends any feelings of being limited.
All limiting misconceptions about yourself such as “ l am a limited body, limited mind, limited witness, I am unenlightened, I am enlightened, etc.” are just concepts arising in me: Awareness.
Vedanta works because it is the firm removal of all misconceptions and doubts about yourself in your mind.
Who you are then becomes obvious, because you are with yourself 24x7 and actually you already know who you are. The knowledge of who you are is subtler than the Intellect and the mind.
You cannot but understand the smell of the rose. You do not have to think about it. That is how Vedanta works. Once this knowledge operates through your intellect and mind without any misconceptions, suffering based on limitation for you will end. Example: You believe you need Love from someone to be happy. If you find out that the source of all Love is yourself.
You will never again need love from anyone. The knowledge operates in your intellect and your emotional center/heart from then on.
So that's it in a nutshell so to speak. It's best to inquire more from a Vedanta teacher not from me.
I will tell you this it works. James Swartz has lots of free material on his website. Also Vedanta costs nothing to learn all Vedanta teachers has their own source of income they teach out of willing to be of service. You can donate if you wish but their is never a fee and the teaching is priceless.
Nowhereman
Cool, it sounds like you might work for the Vedanta Marketing Department.. but, what if i'm not 'searching for who/what i am', and i have no doubts about what 'i am'.. i experience pains, but i am not suffering.. i am constantly paying attention, and i am not seeking anything other than the absence of obstacles to paying attention with clarity.. this Vedanta sounds like it has a lot of 'beliefs' about what people 'think', and about what 'it' thinks people's "misunderstandings" are..
I don't need anything to 'be happy', i am happy because i 'am'.. 'i' am not ideas about anything, and i am not 'thoughts', i am 'that' which 'is', which does the 'thinking', and.. i am 'that' which realizes that the 'thinking' is an obstacle to the clarity of seeing/experiencing what 'is', even thinking about someone else's beliefs like Vedanta is a degree of separation from what 'is'..
There are quite a few belief systems that are thousands of years old, and they will tell you what you 'are', from an 'illusion' to a 'child of God', and.. belief systems, from Vedanta, to neo-advaita, to Judaism, to Christianity, to Taoism, to so many others, are BELIEF systems.. conceptual mind-play, and attachment to ancient practices, which tell you a 'story' about 'what you are', then tell that story is right/true.. which belief system asks you to 'not' believe a story 'about' who/what you 'are'? the most certain revelation of who/what 'you' are, is through your own direct experience of the 'you' that you 'are'.. i trust those that trust me to experience who/what 'i am' without a 'story' to influence me.. i trust those that offer the tools of clarity and direct unconditional experience, and then trust me to find my own way to 'me' ('that' which IS)..
When 'belief systems', any belief system, has so little faith in its own validity that it has to 'tell' others what to believe, what to 'see/experience' in order for that 'system' to be believed, there is a fundamental flaw.. that which 'is', is self-evident, as you say there are no doubts.. i am so certain of that which 'is' that i will simply offer the way to see/experience 'it' yourself, without telling you 'what' to see or believe, without labeling it or telling you what is false or an illusion.. i trust you and anyone that is unconditionally sincere about experiencing who/what they 'are' to have that direct experience.. it's brilliantly simple, stop thinking, just look and see for yourself what is actually happening.. pay attention, look, and if you think you know what's happening, stop thinking and keep looking..
For as long as long as you can, suspend the mind's active thinking processes.. when you do this, there are no distortions between 'you' and what you are experiencing.. what is actually happening is what you are experiencing, rather than what you 'think' you are experiencing, or what you have been conditioned to believe you are experiencing.. every time you think you 'know', let it go.. just be present for what is actually happening, be unconditionally curious and attentive about what is happening right here and right now, then.. there is no doubt or hesitation, you 'are'..
It's helpful to be aware that belief-systems do not want people to have authentic direct experiences, it undermines the 'belief' process that the 'belief-systems' depend on.. belief-systems try to direct and manipulate the people's awareness, telling them this/that is true/false, but.. i'm certain that if you are given the tools to find your own way through the beliefs and illusions, you will..
Be well..
Greetings..
This is an interesting belief, what is Veanta? why does Vedanta hold sway over direct experience or still minded observation?.. what is it about "this" that suggests that it doesn't "actually exist"? What does 'non-dual' mean? I'm asking these questions because if seems like these descriptions reference intangible beliefs 'about' that which 'is'..
Be well..
Example
What is your current desire? You wrote … " to become really awaken".
But what does that mean to you? What is hidden or you in the meaning of the word awaken. … and then one progresses from there.
Selfinquiry does not mean: Thinking the question "who am I" 24x7 like a parrot. It means inquiring into the experience of the moment. What is there? And what does it mean?
And then you may find that there are ideas and concepts which create suffering. … ideas like "I will die. I am alone. I need love. I need money. etc."
And it is vedanta and its tools which help you to inquire into those areas.
The tool for understanding who you are is Vedanta itself. That is what the word Vedanta means: It is the knowledge that ends the search for knowledge.
Now in terms of tools, there are many. There are Tools to:
- help you prepare your mind for self-knowledge (Qualifications)
- help you understand: “Who you are not”.
- help you understand: “Who you are”
- help you reconcile the apparent duality of the above
But the tools/teachings should be taught by a qualified teacher and they should be taught in a specific order and sequence.
Vedanta removes any doubts or vagueness or misconceptions about that in the mind for good.
This understanding ends the search for yourself and ends any feelings of being limited.
All limiting misconceptions about yourself such as “ l am a limited body, limited mind, limited witness, I am unenlightened, I am enlightened, etc.” are just concepts arising in me: Awareness.
Vedanta works because it is the firm removal of all misconceptions and doubts about yourself in your mind.
Who you are then becomes obvious, because you are with yourself 24x7 and actually you already know who you are. The knowledge of who you are is subtler than the Intellect and the mind.
You cannot but understand the smell of the rose. You do not have to think about it. That is how Vedanta works. Once this knowledge operates through your intellect and mind without any misconceptions, suffering based on limitation for you will end. Example: You believe you need Love from someone to be happy. If you find out that the source of all Love is yourself.
You will never again need love from anyone. The knowledge operates in your intellect and your emotional center/heart from then on.
So that's it in a nutshell so to speak. It's best to inquire more from a Vedanta teacher not from me.
I will tell you this it works. James Swartz has lots of free material on his website. Also Vedanta costs nothing to learn all Vedanta teachers has their own source of income they teach out of willing to be of service. You can donate if you wish but their is never a fee and the teaching is priceless.
Nowhereman
Cool, it sounds like you might work for the Vedanta Marketing Department.. but, what if i'm not 'searching for who/what i am', and i have no doubts about what 'i am'.. i experience pains, but i am not suffering.. i am constantly paying attention, and i am not seeking anything other than the absence of obstacles to paying attention with clarity.. this Vedanta sounds like it has a lot of 'beliefs' about what people 'think', and about what 'it' thinks people's "misunderstandings" are..
I don't need anything to 'be happy', i am happy because i 'am'.. 'i' am not ideas about anything, and i am not 'thoughts', i am 'that' which 'is', which does the 'thinking', and.. i am 'that' which realizes that the 'thinking' is an obstacle to the clarity of seeing/experiencing what 'is', even thinking about someone else's beliefs like Vedanta is a degree of separation from what 'is'..
There are quite a few belief systems that are thousands of years old, and they will tell you what you 'are', from an 'illusion' to a 'child of God', and.. belief systems, from Vedanta, to neo-advaita, to Judaism, to Christianity, to Taoism, to so many others, are BELIEF systems.. conceptual mind-play, and attachment to ancient practices, which tell you a 'story' about 'what you are', then tell that story is right/true.. which belief system asks you to 'not' believe a story 'about' who/what you 'are'? the most certain revelation of who/what 'you' are, is through your own direct experience of the 'you' that you 'are'.. i trust those that trust me to experience who/what 'i am' without a 'story' to influence me.. i trust those that offer the tools of clarity and direct unconditional experience, and then trust me to find my own way to 'me' ('that' which IS)..
When 'belief systems', any belief system, has so little faith in its own validity that it has to 'tell' others what to believe, what to 'see/experience' in order for that 'system' to be believed, there is a fundamental flaw.. that which 'is', is self-evident, as you say there are no doubts.. i am so certain of that which 'is' that i will simply offer the way to see/experience 'it' yourself, without telling you 'what' to see or believe, without labeling it or telling you what is false or an illusion.. i trust you and anyone that is unconditionally sincere about experiencing who/what they 'are' to have that direct experience.. it's brilliantly simple, stop thinking, just look and see for yourself what is actually happening.. pay attention, look, and if you think you know what's happening, stop thinking and keep looking..
For as long as long as you can, suspend the mind's active thinking processes.. when you do this, there are no distortions between 'you' and what you are experiencing.. what is actually happening is what you are experiencing, rather than what you 'think' you are experiencing, or what you have been conditioned to believe you are experiencing.. every time you think you 'know', let it go.. just be present for what is actually happening, be unconditionally curious and attentive about what is happening right here and right now, then.. there is no doubt or hesitation, you 'are'..
It's helpful to be aware that belief-systems do not want people to have authentic direct experiences, it undermines the 'belief' process that the 'belief-systems' depend on.. belief-systems try to direct and manipulate the people's awareness, telling them this/that is true/false, but.. i'm certain that if you are given the tools to find your own way through the beliefs and illusions, you will..
Be well..