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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2013 13:01:22 GMT -5
I'm sorry, perhaps I missed it, but did you highlight anything other than the use of personal pronouns or what you call and stoic response that was equally there in both mine and TRF's posts to each other, and in most of your posts as well? If so, I asked if you could highlight anything that was not equally there in TRF's posts, or your own posts for that matter? Which leaves the question about why you selected my posts for commentary, does it have anything to do with this "performing on stage and taking a bow" stuff that you keep talking about? Or is it for some other reason? What can you say about this? I understand that these questions are causing you some irritation. In order to release the questions, it might be helpful to explore why they are arising for you. What evidence do you have, other than your own personal opinions and assumptions, which most would agree are a product of ego, that I am in some way irritated by the questions that are being asked of you? In the off chance that you may decide to ask that as a question, instead of offering it as a declarative, no my friend, the questions that I am asking you are not irritating me LOL Are they irritating you? (Notice how I asked you, instead of saying something like: No they are not! , My questions are irritating YOU.) :-)
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2013 13:15:48 GMT -5
lets try to make this more simple
Topology:
What have you pointed out in this interaction that is not equally true of both you and TRF?
If you feel like there is something that you have said that is not equally true of both you and TRF, what evidence can you offer that this is other than your personal ego driven opinion, that cannot be equally pointed to in both your's and TRF's posts?
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Post by topology on Jul 18, 2013 13:36:09 GMT -5
lets try to make this more simple Topology: What have you pointed out in this interaction that is not equally true of both you and TRF? If you feel like there is something that you have said that is not equally true of both you and TRF, what evidence can you offer that this is other than your personal ego driven opinion, that cannot be equally pointed to in both your's and TRF's posts? Don't hurt yourself on the Fourth Wall there, Brony.
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Post by silver on Jul 18, 2013 13:41:15 GMT -5
Interesting.....what evidence can you point to that you cannot point to with equality in TRF's posts relating to this "increased polar" tension other than your own opinions and assumptions? Is there any evidence that you can point to in my posts, that are not there in TRF's posts, that would indicate a higher polar tension over than your own feelings? Also, perhaps I can agree that a public forum is a kind of stage, but one does not have to be "performing" on stage, are you constantly aware of this as being a stage and the requirement that as a part of being on a stage you MUST put on a performance? Seems like there are many ways in which a stage can be used, for example, it could just be the location of happenstance for a group meeting, or it could be an educational seminar etc....for me, this does not feel like a venue of "performance", what can you say about your character that would lend toward seeing this place as a stage that is for putting on a performance and taking bows? Your reasonableness is preventing you from seeing that top is pointing out your awareness. Your ego is a perception to that awareness, and the defense of your ego is the folly of reasoning... Which you can easily be aware of... Hey trf, not everything you say is that funny, bro.
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Post by laughter on Jul 18, 2013 17:42:19 GMT -5
lets try to make this more simple Topology: What have you pointed out in this interaction that is not equally true of both you and TRF? If you feel like there is something that you have said that is not equally true of both you and TRF, what evidence can you offer that this is other than your personal ego driven opinion, that cannot be equally pointed to in both your's and TRF's posts? Steven -- if you're on this I'm sincerely sorry to see you go. PM me if you can, ok?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2013 3:53:23 GMT -5
It's not about who gives you a choice of two, well it is kinda, it's about seeing if you are aware of reason. Are you aware of anything when you read these words? sure, you seem a reasonable person, that has something to share with me, if I understand your words you have texted.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2013 11:01:35 GMT -5
It's not about who gives you a choice of two, well it is kinda, it's about seeing if you are aware of reason. Are you aware of anything when you read these words? sure, you seem a reasonable person, that has something to share with me, if I understand your words you have texted. The only thing that I'm sharing is what you already are and have forgotten, that you are awareness... What you are aware of on your computer is a perception, it is your attention on reason which says there is a reasonable person called trf that has something to share with me... Your attention is being held by the reason of your perception... You are awareness or a perceiver and not the percieved or the perception.
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Post by tzujanli on Jul 19, 2013 20:08:15 GMT -5
Greetings.. sure, you seem a reasonable person, that has something to share with me, if I understand your words you have texted. The only thing that I'm sharing is what you already are and have forgotten, that you are awareness... What you are aware of on your computer is a perception, it is your attention on reason which says there is a reasonable person called trf that has something to share with me... Your attention is being held by the reason of your perception... You are awareness or a perceiver and not the percieved or the perception. You are 'that' which is aware.. awareness is not 'something', it is a state of consciousness.. the general understanding and use of the term is sufficient for all purposes, i.e.: from Wikipedia: Why distort such simple clarity? Why redefine such a clear and functional term? to claim that " you are awareness" is just more 'woo woo' speak, dependent upon conceptualization and beliefs.. there is only what is actually happening, redefining common language to suit desired beliefs creates confusion, separation, and ambiguity in the relationships between people's private mindscapes and understandings.. simplify, "if it ain't broke don't fix it".. it is directly experiencable and self-evident that you are not awareness. Be well..
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2013 21:48:50 GMT -5
Greetings.. The only thing that I'm sharing is what you already are and have forgotten, that you are awareness... What you are aware of on your computer is a perception, it is your attention on reason which says there is a reasonable person called trf that has something to share with me... Your attention is being held by the reason of your perception... You are awareness or a perceiver and not the percieved or the perception. You are 'that' which is aware.. awareness is not 'something', it is a state of consciousness.. the general understanding and use of the term is sufficient for all purposes, i.e.: from Wikipedia: Why distort such simple clarity? Why redefine such a clear and functional term? to claim that " you are awareness" is just more 'woo woo' speak, dependent upon conceptualization and beliefs.. there is only what is actually happening, redefining common language to suit desired beliefs creates confusion, separation, and ambiguity in the relationships between people's private mindscapes and understandings.. simplify, "if it ain't broke don't fix it".. it is directly experiencable and self-evident that you are not awareness.Be well.. That bit in red....others would say that it is directly experienceable and self evident that you ARE Awareness, and say it and experience it with the same Clarity of What IS that you do..... So are you absolutely 100% sure that your Clarity is accurate while theirs is not? How can you be so sure that your Clarity is clearer than other folks Clarity? Also, do you claim to know what you are if not Awareness? What is your most essential nature Tzu?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2013 22:32:45 GMT -5
Greetings.. The only thing that I'm sharing is what you already are and have forgotten, that you are awareness... What you are aware of on your computer is a perception, it is your attention on reason which says there is a reasonable person called trf that has something to share with me... Your attention is being held by the reason of your perception... You are awareness or a perceiver and not the percieved or the perception. You are 'that' which is aware.. awareness is not 'something', it is a state of consciousness.. the general understanding and use of the term is sufficient for all purposes, i.e.: from Wikipedia: Why distort such simple clarity? Why redefine such a clear and functional term? to claim that " you are awareness" is just more 'woo woo' speak, dependent upon conceptualization and beliefs.. there is only what is actually happening, redefining common language to suit desired beliefs creates confusion, separation, and ambiguity in the relationships between people's private mindscapes and understandings.. simplify, "if it ain't broke don't fix it".. it is directly experiencable and self-evident that you are not awareness. Be well.. Your here on this forum for a reason and it's due to the fact that something in you is rallying, maybe after a life time or two... It wishes to relinquish for just a moment the hold that reason has on your attention. And in that moment you will be what you have always been, aware...
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Post by tzujanli on Jul 19, 2013 22:43:25 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. You are 'that' which is aware.. awareness is not 'something', it is a state of consciousness.. the general understanding and use of the term is sufficient for all purposes, i.e.: from Wikipedia: Why distort such simple clarity? Why redefine such a clear and functional term? to claim that " you are awareness" is just more 'woo woo' speak, dependent upon conceptualization and beliefs.. there is only what is actually happening, redefining common language to suit desired beliefs creates confusion, separation, and ambiguity in the relationships between people's private mindscapes and understandings.. simplify, "if it ain't broke don't fix it".. it is directly experiencable and self-evident that you are not awareness.Be well.. That bit in red....others would say that it is directly experienceable and self evident that you ARE Awareness, and say it and experience it with the same Clarity of What IS that you do..... So are you absolutely 100% sure that your Clarity is accurate while theirs is not? How can you be so sure that your Clarity is clearer than other folks Clarity? Also, do you claim to know what you are if not Awareness? What is your most essential nature Tzu? "Awareness" is a concept, a description.. i am not a description.. I am not interested in the idea of a "most essential nature", that is a self-referencing thought loop.. i am interested in what is actually happening, 'now'.. I am 'that' which 'is', experiencing its own existence through itself as you/me/we/us/Life.. i am what is left when the illusions, and beliefs, and descriptions fall away.. My understanding of clarity is the ability to observe, experience, or realize what is actually happening without distortion or influence.. clarity reveals, without contradiction or conflict, what 'is'.. Be well..
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Post by tzujanli on Jul 19, 2013 22:54:38 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. You are 'that' which is aware.. awareness is not 'something', it is a state of consciousness.. the general understanding and use of the term is sufficient for all purposes, i.e.: from Wikipedia: Why distort such simple clarity? Why redefine such a clear and functional term? to claim that " you are awareness" is just more 'woo woo' speak, dependent upon conceptualization and beliefs.. there is only what is actually happening, redefining common language to suit desired beliefs creates confusion, separation, and ambiguity in the relationships between people's private mindscapes and understandings.. simplify, "if it ain't broke don't fix it".. it is directly experiencable and self-evident that you are not awareness. Be well.. Your here on this forum for a reason and it's due to the fact that something in you is rallying, maybe after a life time or two... It wishes to relinquish for just a moment the hold that reason has on your attention. And in that moment you will be what you have always been, aware... You are not fully present.. you are attached to ideas and meanings and beliefs, you see/experience through those beliefs, which distorts your 'awareness'.. just look and see what is actually happening, stop thinking that the 'description' is what's happening.. you have mistaken the menu for the meal, 'awareness' describes a function of 'that' which 'is'.. I am 'that' which 'is', awareness comes and goes.. aware/awareness is a 'function' of what you/me/we/us/Life 'are'.. apart from 'that which 'is' there is no awareness.. Be well..
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2013 22:56:31 GMT -5
Greetings.. That bit in red....others would say that it is directly experienceable and self evident that you ARE Awareness, and say it and experience it with the same Clarity of What IS that you do..... So are you absolutely 100% sure that your Clarity is accurate while theirs is not? How can you be so sure that your Clarity is clearer than other folks Clarity? Also, do you claim to know what you are if not Awareness? What is your most essential nature Tzu? "Awareness" is a concept, a description.. i am not a description.. I am not interested in the idea of a "most essential nature", that is a self-referencing thought loop.. i am interested in what is actually happening, 'now'.. I am 'that' which 'is', experiencing its own existence through itself as you/me/we/us/Life.. i am what is left when the illusions, and beliefs, and descriptions fall away.. My understanding of clarity is the ability to observe, experience, or realize what is actually happening without distortion or influence.. clarity reveals, without contradiction or conflict, what 'is'.. Be well.. Some people just call that bit in red "Awareness" as a kind of short hand for what you typed put in a whole paragraph....would you prefer that folks wrote out that whole paragraph when communicating here, instead of just using the word Awareness in the same context that you typed out in that sentence?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2013 22:59:11 GMT -5
Seems like that just typing the words "I am Awareness" is a lot easier than typing:
"I am 'that' which 'is', experiencing its own existence through itself as you/me/we/us/Life.. i am what is left when the illusions, and beliefs, and descriptions fall away.. "
Everytime...
just the added punctuation marks alone would seem to make communication in this written forum a bit tedious...
Is what words you use the mist important thing, or os the meaning thats implied the most important thing?
If you had ASKED TRF what meaning he assigned to the word "Awareness", I think you would have discovered that he would have described Awareness almost exactly as you did in that longer paragraph.
So a good question might be: How come you didn't ask him what he MEANT by the use of the word Awareness, instead of telling him that he was wrong and you were right, when really you are talking about the exact same thing?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2013 23:01:34 GMT -5
Greetings.. Your here on this forum for a reason and it's due to the fact that something in you is rallying, maybe after a life time or two... It wishes to relinquish for just a moment the hold that reason has on your attention. And in that moment you will be what you have always been, aware... You are not fully present.. you are attached to ideas and meanings and beliefs, you see/experience through those beliefs, which distorts your 'awareness'.. just look and see what is actually happening, stop thinking that the 'description' is what's happening.. you have mistaken the menu for the meal, 'awareness' describes a function of 'that' which 'is'.. I am 'that' which 'is', awareness comes and goes.. aware/awareness is a 'function' of what you/me/we/us/Life 'are'.. apart from 'that which 'is' there is no awareness.. Be well.. Ooops my mistake, your reasonableness has your nuts in a vice... My perception of your attention relinquishing it's fixation on your perceptions was actually premature and off by a lifetime or two...
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