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Post by Reefs on Aug 13, 2020 1:54:32 GMT -5
How can both of these be right? A very intense guy who has had a very deep search for most of his life carefully has crafted his question for Abraham, he has written it in advance, a few minutes long. It is a question I have raised here several times, zd usually answers. Why are certain individuals, and even groups of people, squeezed into a corner where there is unavoidable suffering? If we all create our own reality, how can this be? (Nobody would create such a reality). Abraham doesn't shrink from the question, t(he)y answer it very aptly, without disagreeing with the guy with the hat, without disallowing his view. So how can two such divergent views both be right? Yet they are both right. Ya know, when first reading about Don Juan's cubic centimeter of chance, that phrase has always stuck in my mind. The hat-guy-questioner is almost there, at understanding, just a tiny shift needed. But he is ATST he's a million miles away. This is a very powerful dialogue. I remember that dialog. To me the dialog illustrates two things: 1) the tragic consequences of a purely intellectual approach to life 2) the enormous amount of effort it takes to stay out of alignment permanently... |
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Post by Reefs on Aug 13, 2020 2:04:15 GMT -5
I found that interesting, and touching. The crux of the issue, seems to me, to be the question of where one individual's reality ends and another's begins... how they intersect and relate. I'm not a solipsist, so I believe in co-creation, but I also love Abe, and am in a few facebook Abe groups. I don't think they explain this aspect well. (by the way, 'Palm Springs' is a fun new film with philosophical undertones) As Seth teaches, the lines drawn are more or less arbitrary. |
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Post by Reefs on Aug 13, 2020 2:08:17 GMT -5
After posting earlier a great example of this occurred to me, the great Viktor Frankl. He decided that being in a Concentration camp was not going to defeat him. I think Viktor Frankl trumps hat-guy's argument. (No matter what happens externally, it cannot defeat one's internal attitude to life). Yes, if you can't control the circumstances, you at least can control your reaction to these circumstances (which in return will eventually change these circumstances). |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Aug 13, 2020 10:41:49 GMT -5
After posting earlier a great example of this occurred to me, the great Viktor Frankl. He decided that being in a Concentration camp was not going to defeat him. I think Viktor Frankl trumps hat-guy's argument. (No matter what happens externally, it cannot defeat one's internal attitude to life). Yes, if you can't control the circumstances, you at least can control your reaction to these circumstances (which in return will eventually change these circumstances). sdp likes twice. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2020 11:14:04 GMT -5
After posting earlier a great example of this occurred to me, the great Viktor Frankl. He decided that being in a Concentration camp was not going to defeat him. I think Viktor Frankl trumps hat-guy's argument. (No matter what happens externally, it cannot defeat one's internal attitude to life). Yes, if you can't control the circumstances, you at least can control your reaction to these circumstances (which in return will eventually change these circumstances). This is something very well written. This is the very first thing I observed very long time ago when I was practicing this reality creation techniques. And this knowing placed me to control my emotion to change the world around me but later I found that that change as a result of your change in emotion is not permanent because controlling your reaction towards the situation is another creation. Real change comes on our way only through clarity, Only when change happens by itself, it's permanent, otherwise it would be back to where you were. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2020 11:17:01 GMT -5
Okay. That's the way it works for me. But the desire goes with strong expectation freezes that future(It wouldn't happen). What does that mean? Can you give an example? I sometimes desires particular future so strongly but afterwards I would forget about that but sooner or later I will be there. But when I desire so strongly and expecting it to happen, that surely wouldn't happen. But I also observed that having the very strong desire is also not in my hand, it just happens. What I feel is, strong desire is the indication for upcoming future but not a strong desire with expectation. |
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Post by andrew on Aug 28, 2020 9:44:58 GMT -5
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Post by Reefs on Aug 29, 2020 11:57:18 GMT -5
Yes, if you can't control the circumstances, you at least can control your reaction to these circumstances (which in return will eventually change these circumstances). This is something very well written. This is the very first thing I observed very long time ago when I was practicing this reality creation techniques. And this knowing placed me to control my emotion to change the world around me but later I found that that change as a result of your change in emotion is not permanent because controlling your reaction towards the situation is another creation. Real change comes on our way only through clarity, Only when change happens by itself, it's permanent, otherwise it would be back to where you were. If the jump is too far in terms of vibration, the change is less likely to last. Quantum leaps usually don't last. People tend to go back to their most practiced vibration (see lottery winners who rise from poverty and soon end up poor again). Changes are most likely to last when it feels like the next logical step, i.e. somewhat like a natural evolution. |
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Post by Reefs on Aug 29, 2020 12:03:43 GMT -5
What does that mean? Can you give an example? I sometimes desires particular future so strongly but afterwards I would forget about that but sooner or later I will be there. But when I desire so strongly and expecting it to happen, that surely wouldn't happen. But I also observed that having the very strong desire is also not in my hand, it just happens. What I feel is, strong desire is the indication for upcoming future but not a strong desire with expectation. This is the quantum leap vs. the next logical step thing. And yes, you can't really choose your desires. Just ask people here why and how they chose to become seekers.  |
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Post by Reefs on Aug 29, 2020 12:09:05 GMT -5
Abe: Don't let big smiling faces and people jumping up and down be your definition of joy. Excellent point. Something similar could be said about popular definition's of enlightenment. |
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Post by andrew on Aug 30, 2020 7:10:57 GMT -5
This is something very well written. This is the very first thing I observed very long time ago when I was practicing this reality creation techniques. And this knowing placed me to control my emotion to change the world around me but later I found that that change as a result of your change in emotion is not permanent because controlling your reaction towards the situation is another creation. Real change comes on our way only through clarity, Only when change happens by itself, it's permanent, otherwise it would be back to where you were. If the jump is too far in terms of vibration, the change is less likely to last. Quantum leaps usually don't last. People tend to go back to their most practiced vibration (see lottery winners who rise from poverty and soon end up poor again). Changes are most likely to last when it feels like the next logical step, i.e. somewhat like a natural evolution. yes, the shift in vibration, beliefs, feeling etc happens before the manifestation 'falls into place'. At which point, it feels natural...an obvious next step. Might not even really notice it. It's also why I've believed for a long time that 'the world' is radically transforming into something pretty cool.....I can easily track my own internal changes over a long time, and see where the natural reflection/expressioon of those internal changes are heading. I put 'the world' in parenthesis because it's not quite correct to say that. (To add, a major internal change can happen quickly, it's just the case with me that I can see a gradual long term shift) |
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Post by Reefs on Aug 30, 2020 10:40:02 GMT -5
If the jump is too far in terms of vibration, the change is less likely to last. Quantum leaps usually don't last. People tend to go back to their most practiced vibration (see lottery winners who rise from poverty and soon end up poor again). Changes are most likely to last when it feels like the next logical step, i.e. somewhat like a natural evolution. yes, the shift in vibration, beliefs, feeling etc happens before the manifestation 'falls into place'. At which point, it feels natural...an obvious next step. Might not even really notice it. It's also why I've believed for a long time that 'the world' is radically transforming into something pretty cool.....I can easily track my own internal changes over a long time, and see where the natural reflection/expressioon of those internal changes are heading. I put 'the world' in parenthesis because it's not quite correct to say that. (To add, a major internal change can happen quickly, it's just the case with me that I can see a gradual long term shift) As Abe keep saying, 99.9% of all creation is done before there is any physical evidence. That's why constantly taking score can be so counter-productive. The way you feel about your desires can actually give you hints in that regard, how far or close your desires are from manifesting right now. So, that's how we should take score, by how we feel about it, not by what's already manifested and what we can show others as proof. Abe once presented some kind of score card about how your desire feels to you and where that puts you in the manifestation process: hopeful - 30% complete trust/faith - 50% optimism - 70% belief - 85% anticipation - 95% So it's basically just applying the logic of the emotional guidance scale. Let's take financial abundance as an example. According to Abe, your feelings about money determine the flow of dollars to you. Which means, if you mostly feel worried --> no dollars; eager --> easy flow of dollars; angry --> dollars can make it to you only the hard way; despair --> no dollars at all; hopeful --> dollars flowing; believing --> dollars flowing comfortably. Yes, there isn't really 'the' world. It would probably be more appropriate to say 'the world as it presents itself to you' because there are always people that thrive in hard times and people that suffer in the best of times. But this currently global shift has been predicted a long time ago. This goes deeper than anything we've seen before. As I've mentioned a few months ago, at the end of the year, we will be living in a totally different world. A lot of parameters will have changed forever. And if that world is going to be heaven or hell, that's up to the individual, as usual. What I have noticed is that those who took Abe's advice, somewhat expected it because they could feel it. Those who didn't take that advice and only trust the 'hard facts' physical manifestations, were mostly taken by surprise. From my perspective, the transformation has already happened, it's a done deal. But as with all physical manifestations, there's always a time lag. And physical manifestation seems to be catching up right now with what has already happened on another level. So if you just look at what's physically manifested right now, it may feel like in the twilight zone right now or in the middle of the tunnel, but if you follow Abe's advice, you already know what's waiting on the others side, or at the end of the tunnel. You'll just wait for everyone to catch up. So in that sense, if we pay attention to our inner guidance, there will never be any surprises about what is going to happen. Because what is manifesting in our experience always matches our vibration. Where I usually see the surprise factor is in how it is going to manifest. Which seems to depend on the circumstances of the moment, or as Abe says, what our path of least resistance is. Funny story I've heard being told repeatedly in A-H workshops, people wanting to manifest a large sum of money, let's say 100k USD, and it didn't seem to happen. Until they forgot about it and one day they set about to cross the street and got run over by a car or truck. They didn't suffer any or only minor injuries but they all got the exact sum of money they wanted to manifest from the insurance company. Talk about a path of 'least' resistance! |
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Post by andrew on Aug 30, 2020 12:05:21 GMT -5
yes, the shift in vibration, beliefs, feeling etc happens before the manifestation 'falls into place'. At which point, it feels natural...an obvious next step. Might not even really notice it. It's also why I've believed for a long time that 'the world' is radically transforming into something pretty cool.....I can easily track my own internal changes over a long time, and see where the natural reflection/expressioon of those internal changes are heading. I put 'the world' in parenthesis because it's not quite correct to say that. (To add, a major internal change can happen quickly, it's just the case with me that I can see a gradual long term shift) As Abe keep saying, 99.9% of all creation is done before there is any physical evidence. That's why constantly taking score can be so counter-productive. The way you feel about your desires can actually give you hints in that regard, how far or close your desires are from manifesting right now. So, that's how we should take score, by how we feel about it, not by what's already manifested and what we can show others as proof. Abe once presented some kind of score card about how your desire feels to you and where that puts you in the manifestation process: hopeful - 30% complete trust/faith - 50% optimism - 70% belief - 85% anticipation - 95% So it's basically just applying the logic of the emotional guidance scale. Let's take financial abundance as an example. According to Abe, your feelings about money determine the flow of dollars to you. Which means, if you mostly feel worried --> no dollars; eager --> easy flow of dollars; angry --> dollars can make it to you only the hard way; despair --> no dollars at all; hopeful --> dollars flowing; believing --> dollars flowing comfortably. Yes, there isn't really 'the' world. It would probably be more appropriate to say 'the world as it presents itself to you' because there are always people that thrive in hard times and people that suffer in the best of times. But this currently global shift has been predicted a long time ago. This goes deeper than anything we've seen before. As I've mentioned a few months ago, at the end of the year, we will be living in a totally different world. A lot of parameters will have changed forever. And if that world is going to be heaven or hell, that's up to the individual, as usual. What I have noticed is that those who took Abe's advice, somewhat expected it because they could feel it. Those who didn't take that advice and only trust the 'hard facts' physical manifestations, were mostly taken by surprise. From my perspective, the transformation has already happened, it's a done deal. But as with all physical manifestations, there's always a time lag. And physical manifestation seems to be catching up right now with what has already happened on another level. So if you just look at what's physically manifested right now, it may feel like in the twilight zone right now or in the middle of the tunnel, but if you follow Abe's advice, you already know what's waiting on the others side, or at the end of the tunnel. You'll just wait for everyone to catch up. So in that sense, if we pay attention to our inner guidance, there will never be any surprises about what is going to happen. Because what is manifesting in our experience always matches our vibration. Where I usually see the surprise factor is in how it is going to manifest. Which seems to depend on the circumstances of the moment, or as Abe says, what our path of least resistance is. Funny story I've heard being told repeatedly in A-H workshops, people wanting to manifest a large sum of money, let's say 100k USD, and it didn't seem to happen. Until they forgot about it and one day they set about to cross the street and got run over by a car or truck. They didn't suffer any or only minor injuries but they all got the exact sum of money they wanted to manifest from the insurance company. Talk about a path of 'least' resistance! LOL I can actually probably offer a fair few examples of this kind of thing from my own life! Straight up, a pattern of worry I've had arise at times in the past isn't whether my desires will manifest....but what in the good lord's name will precede their manifesting That was a very good read, I really don't have much to add. Yes I agree, the transformation is a done deal, and the physical manifestation is catching up. What I notice in my own experience, is that whereas in previous years I've been trying to tell people about a lot of what is happening and might happen, I'm slightly oddly far less 'conspiratorial' now it's all happening more obviously. I still have a bit to say to folks on other media, but I won't argue at this point. I just stay in my business, in my lane..the argument just isn't worth it for me. Abe-Hicks has been much more relevant to me this year than previous years....perhaps since...I don't know 2006/2007, when I first started paying attention to them. |
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Post by Reefs on Aug 30, 2020 13:02:03 GMT -5
LOL I can actually probably offer a fair few examples of this kind of thing from my own life! Straight up, a pattern of worry I've had arise at times in the past isn't whether my desires will manifest....but what in the good lord's name will precede their manifesting That was a very good read, I really don't have much to add. Yes I agree, the transformation is a done deal, and the physical manifestation is catching up. What I notice in my own experience, is that whereas in previous years I've been trying to tell people about a lot of what is happening and might happen, I'm slightly oddly far less 'conspiratorial' now it's all happening more obviously. I still have a bit to say to folks on other media, but I won't argue at this point. I just stay in my business, in my lane..the argument just isn't worth it for me. Abe-Hicks has been much more relevant to me this year than previous years....perhaps since...I don't know 2006/2007, when I first started paying attention to them. Well, Abe keep saying that what people tend to call miracles, from the non-physical perspective is just normal creating (as it should be for us, too). So following that logic, everything short of that is just unnecessary self-torture. However, the most direct route is not always the best (most satisfying) route. Abe keep pointing that out, too. There's enormous value in contrast. And it's not about the destination anyway, it's about the journey. Do you remember their 3 steps of creation? They've expanded that to 5 now. It's basically all about enjoying contrast. And they've replace the word joy with satisfaction, probably because of the misunderstandings they've addressed in the quote you've posted. I'm not up to speed with the latest Abe stuff but they've said earlier this year that there are some really good times ahead and that the upheaval we are going thru right now is absolutely worth it. Just for fun: |
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Post by andrew on Aug 31, 2020 9:16:55 GMT -5
LOL I can actually probably offer a fair few examples of this kind of thing from my own life! Straight up, a pattern of worry I've had arise at times in the past isn't whether my desires will manifest....but what in the good lord's name will precede their manifesting That was a very good read, I really don't have much to add. Yes I agree, the transformation is a done deal, and the physical manifestation is catching up. What I notice in my own experience, is that whereas in previous years I've been trying to tell people about a lot of what is happening and might happen, I'm slightly oddly far less 'conspiratorial' now it's all happening more obviously. I still have a bit to say to folks on other media, but I won't argue at this point. I just stay in my business, in my lane..the argument just isn't worth it for me. Abe-Hicks has been much more relevant to me this year than previous years....perhaps since...I don't know 2006/2007, when I first started paying attention to them. Well, Abe keep saying that what people tend to call miracles, from the non-physical perspective is just normal creating (as it should be for us, too). So following that logic, everything short of that is just unnecessary self-torture. However, the most direct route is not always the best (most satisfying) route. Abe keep pointing that out, too. There's enormous value in contrast. And it's not about the destination anyway, it's about the journey. Do you remember their 3 steps of creation? They've expanded that to 5 now. It's basically all about enjoying contrast. And they've replace the word joy with satisfaction, probably because of the misunderstandings they've addressed in the quote you've posted. I'm not up to speed with the latest Abe stuff but they've said earlier this year that there are some really good times ahead and that the upheaval we are going thru right now is absolutely worth it. Just for fun: That was actually lovely Yes, I think I'm right in saying that the subject of contrast has been given particular emphasis this year by Abe, and some of the things they've said have been both slightly surprising and quite delightful. I find it interesting how their message is evolving with the times. Obviously Abe-Hicks teachings aren't without their flaws....and I don't mean they are mistaken in what they say, I just mean that human individuality is complex and diverse and there are times when Abe-Hicks just isn't the 'right set of tools for job'. It's easy to fall into the trap of thinking that if one is manifesting...say....the seeming opposite of financial flow, that they are making a mistake, or failing, or something of the sort (the humorous example you gave before is illustrative). So I think their focus this year on enjoying contrast is a PARTICULARLY useful one....and for me too. |
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