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Post by enigma on Dec 1, 2019 23:40:59 GMT -5
He asked what is creating your perception. Do you need to tell him again that perception and creation are the same, or shall I do it this time? If we wait a little while, he'll tell himself again. He weaves with one hand and rends with the other.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2019 23:43:15 GMT -5
Do you need to tell him again that perception and creation are the same, or shall I do it this time? If we wait a little while, he'll tell himself again. He weaves with one hand and rends with the other. I have never denied that creation is perception,Did I ever do?
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Post by satchitananda on Dec 1, 2019 23:43:34 GMT -5
A point of perception. (Not an object or entity) That's not what he was saying, he was saying 'I am is an object in Awareness'
He thinks that perceiver and object both are arising in awareness and while he goes to sleep or some kind of samadhi, he believes that both perceiver and objects falls away.
What kind of sleep objects do you have?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2019 23:44:50 GMT -5
That's not what he was saying, he was saying 'I am is an object in Awareness'
He thinks that perceiver and object both are arising in awareness and while he goes to sleep or some kind of samadhi, he believes that both perceiver and objects falls away.
What kind of sleep objects do you have? I did not proclaimed to have any. I said your failure to recall the starting point of the dream tells me you can't conclude something is not present in the deep sleep.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2019 23:47:45 GMT -5
I am seeing you are continuously seeing your flaw and modifying while the argument is going on. Sometimes you were not realizing your mistake but while the argument moves, you are realizing and modifying your theory. Sometimes you got into some trap and then you are once again modifying. Even if you don't admit this to be true, that's what happening. For an example, you said I can take awareness as a creator, then when I asked 'you said you are not the doer, but now you say you are the doer', you are understanding your mistake and trying to escape by introducing another theory. It's okay if you are learning from your mistake. Let me continue to reply to this post in my next post.
Can you quote me where I said I was the doer? Now we are back to the old conversation now. At one point you said to me that I can take awareness as a creator. If you don't agree with this statement, then questions are back to you, who is creating the perception?
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Post by enigma on Dec 1, 2019 23:48:46 GMT -5
Do you need to tell him again that perception and creation are the same, or shall I do it this time? Creation is perception. Every perception is new creation.But you are only perceiving the perception you are not creating it. You have absolutely no control over whats arising. That's what Watch says he is not the doer. We're tripping over our own divisive concepts on our way to unity.
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Post by satchitananda on Dec 2, 2019 0:19:14 GMT -5
Can you quote me where I said I was the doer? Now we are back to the old conversation now. At one point you said to me that I can take awareness as a creator. If you don't agree with this statement, then questions are back to you, who is creating the perception? Why do you think someone is creating the perception if there is no doer?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2019 1:10:35 GMT -5
Creation is perception. Every perception is new creation.But you are only perceiving the perception you are not creating it. You have absolutely no control over whats arising. That's what Watch says he is not the doer. We're tripping over our own divisive concepts on our way to unity. May be!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2019 1:11:35 GMT -5
Now we are back to the old conversation now. At one point you said to me that I can take awareness as a creator. If you don't agree with this statement, then questions are back to you, who is creating the perception? Why do you think someone is creating the perception if there is no doer? Where does your perception come from then?
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Post by satchitananda on Dec 2, 2019 1:25:40 GMT -5
Why do you think someone is creating the perception if there is no doer? Where does your perception come from then? I do not have an answer for you. You are imposing your logically structured world view onto something beyond logic.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2019 1:59:43 GMT -5
Where does your perception come from then? I do not have an answer for you. You are imposing your logically structured world view onto something beyond logic. I can conclude anything from what I know. I simply can't speculate something.
You see there is a perception and you are looking at it. So who is creating it? And also you proclaimed to have known the greater fac that awareness is the only that exist. If so, who is creating other than awareness? What's the problem do you see here? Enigma somehow knows the truth that awareness is creating those perception but he doesn't know how because he is busy looking at those perceptions.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2019 2:02:38 GMT -5
Um, it’s your mind that’s starting and stopping the thinking. And it starts and stops based on conditioning. Absolutely. The next time you move your arm you will see there is no one doing it. How does the moving happens if no one is doing it? what kind of magic you are talking now?
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Post by satchitananda on Dec 2, 2019 2:06:04 GMT -5
Absolutely. The next time you move your arm you will see there is no one doing it. How does the moving happens if no one is doing it? what kind of magic you are talking now? So you think that you as the Gopal person entity are the doer?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2019 2:16:27 GMT -5
I do not have an answer for you. You are imposing your logically structured world view onto something beyond logic. I can conclude anything from what I know. I simply can't speculate something.
You see there is a perception and you are looking at it. So who is creating it? And also you proclaimed to have known the greater fac that awareness is the only that exist. If so, who is creating other than awareness? What's the problem do you see here? Enigma somehow knows the truth that awareness is creating those perception but he doesn't know how because he is busy looking at those perceptions.
Did you not see this post? Or are you missing it intentionally? Should I reply to you one post at a time?
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Post by tenka on Dec 2, 2019 3:19:23 GMT -5
Well you might want to investigate why such a theory doesn't create confusion .. and adds up under scrutiny . Objective World has it's own problem because the act of KNOWING can't be communicated to awareness through some way. For an example perceiving moon via your eyes. Awareness is simply the process of knowing,nothing else. It can't receive IMAGE from somewhere. You are separating knowing and awareness . There are so many problems with your model .
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