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Post by enigma on Aug 11, 2014 21:15:40 GMT -5
The second sentence of what? What about the second sentence?  The second sentence of my post he first responded "likewise" to. I suspect he was agreeing with the second sentence. "The word commitment comes to mind. I don't think it is a coincidence that those who have committed themselves to long periods of internal vigilance/exploration over long periods of time usually end up with a kind of indefinable authority and clarity that other so called teachers seem to lack. Niz, Ramana, Tolle, ZD, Adyashanti, Klein, Mooji to name a few who have that in common." Read more: spiritualteachers.proboards.com/user/1057/recent#ixzz3A8eUKmIzI considered that, but what he actually highlighted was "I don't think it is a coincidence that those who have commited themselves to long periods of internal vigilance/exploration over long periods of time" To that he declared "Likewise". |
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Post by laughter on Aug 11, 2014 21:15:54 GMT -5
That's it?  That's everything. |
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Post by enigma on Aug 11, 2014 21:19:22 GMT -5
Yes, but I think you are to do that naked.  What does the non-existent look like naked? Um...Likewise??  |
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Post by laughter on Aug 11, 2014 21:24:31 GMT -5
ah .. uhm .. he kinda' underlined it ... He still hasn't told me if I get an A+ for it. I guess I'll have to wait for the grades to come out.   |
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Post by laughter on Aug 11, 2014 21:25:58 GMT -5
Noticing and realization are interchangeable concepts to you? Likewise. It takes effort to climb a mountain but you wouldn't say it takes effort to fall off just because you couldn't have fallen if you didn't climb. It doesn't really matter if you say you efforted to fall off the mountain, but in the case of noticing, it's important to notice that noticing itself is effortless. It's important because at some point the effort must cease. If it ceases at the beginning, the beginning and the end are the same. You don't need to do anything. What is all the effort for but to end the effort? |
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Post by justlikeyou on Aug 11, 2014 21:26:09 GMT -5
What does the non-existent look like naked? Um...Likewise??  |
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Post by enigma on Aug 11, 2014 21:27:49 GMT -5
An unfortunate break between pages 5 & 6, the previous two posts were about conscious efforts, the comment likewise, likewise. (Although you could probably leave Ramana and Tolle off the list). sdp Tolle never mentioned a witnessing practice as part of his experience but (and this has been speculated on before, by ZD if I'm not mistaken), his adeptness at writing the prescription that he did might have been due to the way he spent the years on the park bench in between his experience of sudden ego collapse and writing his first book. He definitely, by his own description, used that time to effect what is referred to on the forum as "informing the mind". Technically, he did at least one moment of (split-minded) witnessing that led to the experience: "Am I one or two? If I cannot live with myself, there must be two of me: the 'I' and the 'self' that 'I' cannot live with. Maybe only one of them is real." I've always resonated with Tolle's split as there was a period when I experienced a similar split; one in terror of obliteration and one at peace, both quite apparent and available simultaneously. |
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Post by laughter on Aug 11, 2014 21:28:11 GMT -5
No self identification, no language. Is language a survival advantage? Well....yes.  |
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Post by laughter on Aug 11, 2014 21:31:25 GMT -5
Naked and bankrupt? I thought you were suppose to put the ax to it?  Yes, but I think you are to do that naked. (** facepalm **) now peeps are gonna' try it at home and someone's gonna lose an eye (or worse) and need a tetnus shot.  |
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Post by enigma on Aug 11, 2014 21:33:45 GMT -5
He still hasn't told me if I get an A+ for it. I guess I'll have to wait for the grades to come out. I'm not happy about that. Look at my face. Do I look happy about that?  |
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Post by enigma on Aug 11, 2014 21:36:28 GMT -5
Um...Likewise?? Cool pic.  |
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Post by enigma on Aug 11, 2014 21:37:53 GMT -5
Yes, but I think you are to do that naked. (** facepalm **) now peeps are gonna' try it at home and someone's gonna lose an eye (or worse) and need a tetnus shot. Oh, I'm thinkin much worse.  |
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Post by laughter on Aug 11, 2014 21:42:55 GMT -5
I'd argue that planning at the level of a tribe and passing cultural artifacts between generations such as how to make tools or follow the cycles of the moon and the tides or care for domesticated animals or plant and care for crops necessarily involve reflection based on the abstractions of the group and the individuals among which labor is divided -- all these were directly related to self-reference and led to higher survival rates for peeps. Now the question of advantage/disadvantage isn't one that is static over time. If we view the possibility of extinction as a sort of contest between a species and its environment, then a species that got really good at fighting and mastering it's environment would do well as long as it was small in proportion to it. The war with the world isn't one that humanity can ever hope to win in the long run. To the first paragraph, what if all these primitives were born 'enlightened' and never fell into illusory identification? They would be like a bunch of Niz's running around sharing their knowledge and cigarettes and arguing with each other, right? first off that's a hypothetical but I think there's a general idea that applies to it. One is that there is a difference between a child that hasn't fallen into self-reference yet and a used-up-old peep who's seen through it. That of course doesn't mean that children necessarily need to fall into self-reference, but could they skip it and still eventually function in society? Extrapolated to the species as a whole and applied to the hypothetical, would there ever have been a village or cigarettes or any language to argue with if not for evolutions invention of the ego? Recorded history paints an ugly picture of humanity by today's cultural context and standards and it's natural to question whether or not all of that bother was necessary, but in my opinion it's kinda' like asking what color our blood would be if plants breathed methane instead of oxygen. |
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Post by laughter on Aug 11, 2014 21:45:49 GMT -5
I'd thank you to keep that dull and rusted edge away from my nakedness kind sir. So yer okay with it if it's shiny and sharp?  Like the Gorn said to Capn' Kirk: "I will be merciful .. and QUICK! .. aaarrrggheharrrhs AAAARRRGG!!! (** drool drool drool ***) .,, slissssssssssssssssssssssssss!" |
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Post by laughter on Aug 11, 2014 21:47:18 GMT -5
nah, he's an evil frog. Evil frogs are people too, ya know. Nah-uh! all this stuff about how there ain't really no peeps and the peep must go and all sorts a' bad stuff 'bout peeps! Peeps don't like evil frogs! |
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