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Post by Reefs on Jan 31, 2013 12:00:22 GMT -5
Good morning.. Greetings.. No.. i have no 'case', that's your interpretation.. All is, well... Be well.. Dear Tzu: Then how can we help you here? All is well.. |
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Post by laughter on Jan 31, 2013 12:10:30 GMT -5
I skip ALL your text walls, laughter.  I do too. Sorry, dude.  Yeah, well, I figure that when I reach a critical word-mass I'm moving at escape-the-deconstruction velocity, so I forgive you E. Still love ya' anyway Reefs! |
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Post by Reefs on Jan 31, 2013 12:13:15 GMT -5
I do too. Sorry, dude. Yeah, well, I figure that when I reach a critical word-mass I'm moving at escape-the-deconstruction velocity, so I forgive you E. Still love ya' anyway Reefs! Oh, please continue. I just thought if it involves a lot of effort on your part I'll let you know where effort might be wasted. But I see Mr. Mountaineer replying, so if not everyone at least someone reads it. |
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Post by laughter on Jan 31, 2013 12:15:30 GMT -5
wasted effort .... hmmm .... nice little koan.
What effort isn't wasted? ... since all effort is a doing that is ...
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Post by tzujanli on Jan 31, 2013 12:35:55 GMT -5
Greetings.. Good morning.. Greetings.. No.. i have no 'case', that's your interpretation.. All is, well... Be well.. All is well.. If there is to be 'help', it will revel itself.. why do you suppose that you 'can' help? do you believe that it is your mission to help? I am here to share, and if 'help' is revealed while sharing, that will be received with gratitude.. So, if there is to be 'help', try sharing how your beliefs have made your existence clearer, more harmonious, or more peaceful.. Be well.. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2013 12:58:46 GMT -5
Here we go again. It's been described. Service. Deconstruction sounds like quite a project. What is service? Donating to a charity is pumps the ego up. More questions and a new twist- conclusions. Service involves awareness. I have some Teamster friends who may be interested in this deconstruction thingy. ;D |
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Post by enigma on Jan 31, 2013 13:21:39 GMT -5
I stumbled across some words by Lester Levinson that immediately caught my attention. (For those who don't know, the one who taught Hale and others, who then developed the Sedona Method) I'm also a member of Hale's forum, though I don't post there anymore. It's as clear to me that Lester 'gets it' as it is that Hale does not. I see no real relationship between the self help money maker Sedona Method, and what Lester discovered and sorta kinda tried to teach. (It's just an aside. I know you're talking about self help gurus.) I also see Lester as the real Mckoy. Hale.....hmmm....however, the book was good. Lester also experimented with manifestation though, there are some pretty crazy stories about that, I can't remember them off the top of my head though So have I. I don't see a problem with experimenting with manifestation. |
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Post by topology on Jan 31, 2013 13:28:15 GMT -5
What is service? Donating to a charity is pumps the ego up. More questions and a new twist- conclusions. Service involves awareness. I have some Teamster friends who may be interested in this deconstruction thingy. ;D If by service you mean in each moment serving to facilitate the greatest good of that moment, I leave that to spontaneous action. Its not something I have to worry about or complex over or something I have to make happen with effort. Be present, open and aware, and if there is a perceived dysfunction/fragmentation there will be a natural response to restore function/wholeness. As I gain experience with the world and greater understanding of how the world works, my capacity for responding and facilitating a return to wholeness increases. Again that is not something I have to intentionally or actively do any more. It's more a function of how much I am open and listening to what is happening. When I hear Arisha preach about Right Action, it sounds like she's advocating intentional activity, meaning operating from an idea in mind about what "good" is and making it happen. Having a pre-formed image in mind is not responding dynamically to the situation. My ability is a product of my listening empathically and responding intuitively. That to me is a non-doing. No prescription about what to do. edit: grammar |
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Post by enigma on Jan 31, 2013 13:29:24 GMT -5
I do too. Sorry, dude. You know, E, I've skipped your PDF which you recommend for reading. Just saw the very first sentence and it was enough. Such a trash ! For idiots. No, for mega-idiots. 'Just idiots' will through it to the garbage immediately. Why even to post the link? I Don't "recommend" it as I haven't read it myself, but I like his story and his approach. He was given a death sentence by his doctor, so he rolled up his sleeves and started looking to see what in blazes was really going on. No gurus, no satsangs, no ancient masters, no woo woo practices. We could say he was 'deadly serious' about it.  |
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Post by enigma on Jan 31, 2013 13:31:51 GMT -5
He didn't say anything about farting, did he?  No, he did. The whole book is just one weak farting. You got that from reading the first sentence? |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2013 13:35:03 GMT -5
Well, I guess I can say it's okay for you to be pushy then...I just don't want you to think that I will find your beliefs/practices tenable for me, personally - I can only consider them. There's the blackmail again. 'Behave yourself or I won't trust you.'
An observation and an opinion of someone.
One of the many reasons why you and i see things so differently enigma is i find your logic...~facepalm~
Yeah, and i don't expect or demand a response.
It is well documented that many wifebeating husbands actually love thier wives, even though they inflict physical and psychological wounds on them.
PLEASE NOTE: The analogy is hilighting the concept of blackmail, not the people involved.
So i am not suggesting the interactions between enigma and silver is like a husband and wife dynamic...ok.
Analogy of enigma's logic of the above dialogue between him and silver...
Husband: This is how to love someone.
(husband lists well thought out positive attributes, behaviors, attitudes of how to love a person. he did not put wifebeating on the list)
Wife: Well, if you would stop beating me, i would trust what you have to say.
Husband: Stop trying to blackmail me.
The wife is not trying to blackmail her husband, she loves him and simply would like her husband to stop hurting her.
Research shows that a percentage of wives actually love their abusive husbands.
The issue is the husband, for reasons i do not know, is unwilling or unable to stop beating his wife so does everything to justify that beating her is ok.
He avoids his issue by claiming she has the problem.
The claim of "blackmail" is a fear response the husband has of his wifebeating tendencies.
Claiming "blackmail" just because silver feels genuinely hurt by your communication style is simply ~facepalm~ in my book.
All silver is doing is expressing how she feels, which is a natural and common thing people do.
Judging this as blackmail smells of an exaggerated fear response, possibly connected to either an inabilty or unwillingness to change,
or an indepth self analysis that change is not required.
If the intent is to teach someone how to resolve their issues and they express that your style severely grates against them and that leads to having trouble listening to you,
what's so difficult about changing style, as style will not interfer with the helpful information one bit.
Consider this, regarding style.
A person when excited to share vital information, may talk extremely loudly when doing so.
For whatever reasons, the listener cringes amidst such noise and because of the pain,
is focused on the pain and not the information, even though the listener wants to hear the information.
So the listener, says, "Heeey, too loud, please speak quieter."
Speaker does so, doesn't feel manipulated, blackmailed, forced, etc.
Person wilingly chooses to speak quieter because message is important and wants listener to hear it.
So they speak quieter, shares the message and listener can hear it and is focused on it, takes it in.
Win win.
No one forcing anything onto anyone.
I cite RT 'cus it's such a powerful example, unlke RTers who use force to effect change. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2013 13:39:14 GMT -5
More questions and a new twist- conclusions. Service involves awareness. I have some Teamster friends who may be interested in this deconstruction thingy. ;D If by service you mean in each moment serving to facilitate the greatest good of that moment, I leave that to spontaneous action. Its not something I have to worry about or complex over or something I have to make happen with effort. Be present, open and aware, and if there is a perceived dysfunction/fragmentation there will be a natural response to restore function/wholeness. As I gain experience with the world and greater understanding of how the world works, my capacity for responding and facilitating a return to wholeness increases. Again that is not something I have to intentionally or actively do any more. It's more a function of how much I am open and listening to what is happening. When I hear Arisha preach about Right Action, it sounds like she's advocating intentional activity, meaning operating from an idea in mind about what "good" is and making it happen. Having a pre-formed image in mind is not responding dynamically to the situation. My ability is a product of my listening empathically and responding intuitively. That to me is a non-doing. No prescription about what to do. edit: grammar Welp. this conversation probably would have been of more value to ya if you had intuitively or spontaneously had it with, arisha. But after reading this, and a few other posts of yours this morning, I understand why it didn't happen. I'm guessing you're saying no to Teamsters on the deconstruction site. Non-union labor isn't always the best choice. ;D |
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Post by topology on Jan 31, 2013 13:44:11 GMT -5
There's the blackmail again. 'Behave yourself or I won't trust you.'
An observation and an opinion of someone.
One of the many reasons why you and i see things so differently enigma is i find your logic...~facepalm~
Yeah, and i don't expect or demand a response.
It is well documented that many wifebeating husbands actually love thier wives, even though they inflict physical and psychological wounds on them.
PLEASE NOTE: The analogy is hilighting the concept of blackmail, not the people involved.
So i am not suggesting the interactions between enigma and silver is like a husband and wife dynamic...ok.
Analogy of enigma's logic of the above dialogue between him and silver...
Husband: This is how to love someone.
(husband lists well thought out positive attributes, behaviors, attitudes of how to love a person. he did not put wifebeating on the list)
Wife: Well, if you would stop beating me, i would trust what you have to say.
Husband: Stop trying to blackmail me.
The wife is not trying to blackmail her husband, she loves him and simply would like her husband to stop hurting her.
Research shows that a percentage of wives actually love their abusive husbands.
The issue is the husband, for reasons i do not know, is unwilling or unable to stop beating his wife so does everything to justify that beating her is ok.
He avoids his issue by claiming she has the problem.
The claim of "blackmail" is a fear response the husband has of his wifebeating tendencies.
Claiming "blackmail" just because silver feels genuinely hurt by your communication style is simply ~facepalm~ in my book.
All silver is doing is expressing how she feels, which is a natural and common thing people do.
Judging this as blackmail smells of an exaggerated fear response, possibly connected to either an inabilty or unwillingness to change,
or an indepth self analysis that change is not required.
If the intent is to teach someone how to resolve their issues and they express that your style severely grates against them and that leads to having trouble listening to you,
what's so difficult about changing style, as style will not interfer with the helpful information one bit.
Consider this, regarding style.
A person when excited to share vital information, may talk extremely loudly when doing so.
For whatever reasons, the listener cringes amidst such noise and because of the pain,
is focused on the pain and not the information, even though the listener wants to hear the information.
So the listener, says, "Heeey, too loud, please speak quieter."
Speaker does so, doesn't feel manipulated, blackmailed, forced, etc.
Person wilingly chooses to speak quieter because message is important and wants listener to hear it.
So they speak quieter, shares the message and listener can hear it and is focused on it, takes it in.
Win win.
No one forcing anything onto anyone.
I cite RT 'cus it's such a powerful example, unlke RTers who use force to effect change.Enigma was pointing out something Silver was doing with me. To paraphrase: Silver was saying I hadn't been such a good/nice person to her recently because I was being confrontational and so she let me know I was about to fall out of her good graces. Enigma sees these tactics as subconscious manipulations to encourage or discourage behavior. The blackmail is Silver's loss of friendship/friendliness in order to discourage me from putting the scrutinizing eye on her. I would be the one "beating his wife" in the scenario. But it would be more like my wife was saying "Why are you beating me?" when all I did was try to help her adjust her posture. That is blackmail. |
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Post by laughter on Jan 31, 2013 13:48:22 GMT -5
No, he did. The whole book is just one weak farting. You got that from reading the first sentence? Just a language thing ... Arisha obviously meant to say it was a "week fart" as in a fart that was a week-long in the farting ... in this way it becomes clear why the stench arises from simply the first sentence. Disclaimer: I have no idea of what PDF is under discussion here. |
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Post by enigma on Jan 31, 2013 13:50:13 GMT -5
You know, E, I've skipped your PDF which you recommend for reading. Just saw the very first sentence and it was enough. Such a trash ! For idiots. No, for mega-idiots. 'Just idiots' will through it to the garbage immediately. Why even to post the link? So full of love. The irony is that what Lester discovered is that loving everything is the answer, which sounds a bit like Arisha talk, but looks nothing like Arisha walk. |
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Greetings..
