Copyright Issues

[zendancer]

I recently deleted a link that allowed anyone to download a copyrighted book that may or may not have had the author's permission to use. Some ebooks have been put on the internet by the authors or editors with explicit statements that no remuneration is needed or expected. Links to these kinds of free ebooks are fine.

Short excerpts, with citations of source and due credit, are allowed under the fair use for education part of the copyright law, but postings of entire copyrighted books without the author's or publisher's explicit permission is not allowed. For this reason, I would respectfully request that everyone refrain from posting anything on this website that would violate current copyright laws.

Some authors of spiritual books, and here I will use myself as an example, do not need any income from writing (I, for one, give it all away in the joyful service of Source), and therefore do not care if our writings are copied. Other authors, however, depend upon their writings as their only source of income and therefore do not want their material given away.

Prior to one of my own books being published I talked with two publishers and two professors of English (who had published numerous books), and learned that I would need to get written permission to use certain quotations. I obtained the necessary permissions, but they only pertained to a limited number of book copies. If I or the the publisher wished to print additional copies of the book, we would have had to request updated permissions to use the same quotations a second time.

There is no problem with anyone providing links to short quotations, preferably with the title of the source, author, and page number, of copyrighted materials, but there is a big problem with providing links to large bodies of copyrighted work without the author's permission to do so. Hopefully, everyone here will understand why such postings, if they appear on this website, will be deleted by the staff (uh oh, that means either Shawn or me).

[michaelsees]

Hi ZD,

Well for sure I will respect your site rules however with respect what you are saying about authors is very wrong. You see study after study has been done on this and all studies show when a author has published a hard copy real book that if he makes a ebook available for free it immensely helps his real book sales. The problem is with the people old habits die hard and this is one of them. Most people cannot let go of their own beliefs no matter how much info is shown that they are simply working with a wrong belief.
Another example was Napster selling music on line. They made such a big deal with the copyright stuff but the fact remains their record sales were never higher when people were downloading freely.

The honest truth is the only ones that actually benefit from copyrights are the attorneys that get paid to go after copyright violations. This s why we still have the old laws the attorneys lobby for it all the time. It's their job security they're watching out for not because the have morals and feel it's wrong.

Well my forum should be up in a few weeks I hope and it will be interesting to see how the public handles it.

Blessings to you and this forum
Michael

[Peter]

I replied to Michaelsees about this in another post.

I did something of an internet search and was able to find corroborating evidence that Paulo Coelho experienced increased sales after making a PDF version of The Alchemist available online in Russia:

www.digitalalchemy.tv/2008/01/stealing-ebooks-is-good-for-book-sales.html

...but then as a moral question, of course, it was his to give away in the first place. His publisher may disagree, I don't know.

I wasn't able to find any actual studies on this phenomenon.

Cheers,
P

[michaelsees]

Hi Peter

not ignoring you most of my keys on my keyboard do not work so I need to cut and paste the letters
Will write more soon.

All hard copies sales go up when a free ebook is given out.
People with hard heads are their own worst enemy.
Morals changes with time. We would all be dead now if we use the same Morals as was used as example during the dark ages.
peace
Michael

Nov 3, 2010 13:12:54 GMT -5 Peter said:

I replied to Michaelsees about this in another post.

I did something of an internet search and was able to find corroborating evidence that Paulo Coelho experienced increased sales after making a PDF version of The Alchemist available online in Russia:

www.digitalalchemy.tv/2008/01/stealing-ebooks-is-good-for-book-sales.html

...but then as a moral question, of course, it was his to give away in the first place. His publisher may disagree, I don't know.

I wasn't able to find any actual studies on this phenomenon.

Cheers,
P

[Portto]

Michael: there are free programs that allow you to display an on-screen keyboard and you can click the letters, although keyboards are pretty cheap (even less than $1 for used ones).

Regarding your statement about sales, I doubt it.
As people move away from printed books to e-readers, nobody will buy hard copies anymore.
The only way for these authors would be to sell e-books, which nobody will buy if they are available for free as well.
The author should choose some free excerpts to post online, and if people like them then they can buy the whole book.

[michaelsees]

thank you Poto I had one installed and did not know!
ebooks still increase sales of the hard copies.
The reason is quite most readers want a real book to hold in their hands.
Now the only time a ebook may not be helpful in sales is when the author has no hard copies to sell.

However this may not even be true. I still feel the best way to sell is to give it away for free.You need to understand the world today is a much different world than even 20 years ago. It has grown exponentially so the more buzz you make by giving it away free the more cash sales you will have. T's b far the best advertising you can have. There will n3ver be a shortage of paying customers. I understand for many people this concept sounds crazy,however as my Mom always said try it or you will never really know. Now she was speaking about some nasty looking veggie dish.
But it applies to everything esp. business.
Peace
Michael

[Peter]

Michael/Randy, I see now that you're not the second poster to create their own board, you're the first one doing it for a second time.

I'll remind you of your previous attempt here. I registered with your forum, got a few updates from it, then you seemed to get more interested in sharing recipes and then it all went quiet. What happened?

When you came back and re-introduced yourself, did you forget that you'd already racked up 147 posts as dwbh1953?

Nov 3, 2010 21:56:31 GMT -5 @michaelsees said:

ebooks still increase sales of the hard copies.

Randy...how can I put this constructively...my take on this is that you're currently manufacturing a particular view of reality to support something you want to do, which is give other people's material away for free in order to increase you/your forum's popularity. You've ignored requests for references, and you've dismissed feedback from your peers. You're failing to see what is real - the ordinary mundane in-front-of-your-nose real. Never mind any discussion about "Real".

Ask yourself: Are you giving, or taking by this venture? What are the transactions and how are they balanced?

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy your posts and I'd like you to stay with us. This is just a mirror that's come up - it's The Work, and I'm calling you on it.

Regards,
Peter

PS FrankShank> Happy?

[karen]

Personally the idea has been knocking around my head for a while that copyright should be no longer than a mechanical patent - so 20 years. After that, if a publisher wants to release a new version, then that new version would be 20 years, but not the old version (such as a remastered version being new and the old version being public domain). This would I'm thinking spark much more innovation than the current byzantine system allows.

But that's just an opinion. Such matters would need to be answered scientifically - does copyright help or harm innovation? What is the sweet spot for maximum innovation?

But we as a society don't look at things in a scientific way. We look at things in a supernatural way based on a continuum of "deserve-iness" based upon what we've done in the past.

[michaelsees]

Peter/

Let me give you a hint. As long as you exist in your body you will always manufacture you view of reality. Now the non evolved ones will just adopt what was done in the past without any new thinking on their part. This is why changes are so slow. Most people need to be beat to death with a new truth before the adopt it.

As far as allowing free downloads this has nothing to do with getting more members at all.
It has all to do with sharing everything. So get use to it the new paradigm is sharing or stay stuck in a obsolete past.

Karen
"
But we as a society don't look at things in a scientific way. We look at things in a supernatural way based on a continuum of "deserve-iness" based upon what we've done in the past."

Michael,

Excellent point this has a lot to do with the new paradigm of sharing is caring.

[oneiopen]

Michael,

You still haven't answered Peter's questions. You just keep saying the same thing over and over.

And no matter how you try to excuse or justify your actions, or ridicule those who don't agree with you, the bottom line is, it is still illegal.

Let me ask you this---will you indemnify all those people who download your "shared"(stolen) ebooks when you get charged with piracy and sued? Because they will be sued also. You break the law, you pay the price, and in this case, a very hefty price.

[justinian]

Michael (Randy?) - am I reading this correctly? So you're actually advocating wholesale theft of another's work product? Encouraging others to join you in this? And on a board supposedly dedicated to Enlightenment?!? Wow. Well, you've got chutzpah, no doubt about it. As the author of a good many published books and articles, I have to say that authors work very hard, and don't exactly appreciate an intermeddler like you giving them away without permission. It is the sheerest form of self-justifying fantasy to suggest that we sell more of our books because others have the gall to rip them off and post them. Well, at least authors and publishers you exploit will know where to send the process servers. Sure sounds like a "recipe" for disaster.

[michaelsees]

Hi Justinan,

Well more or less. Now if you really a author of "a good man published books" it's time for you to begin to think outside the box. Give this a real honest try and then report back. Here's my challenge take any book you may in hard copy make a ebook version if you do not have one already then on the same ads/internet place the ebook as free right next to the hard copy that you are selling and see what happens. I already know what will happen your real book sales will rise dramatically but you need to see this for yourself .

Now if you do not take my challenge then it's really you that is in a fantasy but with a big difference. Your thinking is not only hurting you its being selfish where my way will not only help to raise your profits but help people that cannot pay. I am more than surprise that many people are members of a spiritual site but have not a clue on how prosperity really works so try my way for 21 days then you can donate some of those profits to a charity.I have given you something immensely valuable don't mess it up just do it then report back in 21 days. If you do not take the challenge all you are doing is showing me and the readers that you are stuck in a self-defeating fantasy with no desire to shift to something that helps you and also you have a strong ego that's needs to be right even at the cost of your profits.
So lets see try to prove me wrong on this
Om shanti
Michael

[michaelsees]

I will never gt sued with anything that will hold up in court. Everything I do in the way I set it up is completely legal.So your questions ad comments are moot.
Here's a hint Joyce teach yourself to think outside the box if not you become your own victim with your own words
and open both eye not just one
peace
Michael

Nov 4, 2010 21:05:12 GMT -5 @oneiopen said:

Michael,

You still haven't answered Peter's questions. You just keep saying the same thing over and over.

And no matter how you try to excuse or justify your actions, or ridicule those who don't agree with you, the bottom line is, it is still illegal.

Let me ask you this---will you indemnify all those people who download your "shared"(stolen) ebooks when you get charged with piracy and sued? Because they will be sued also. You break the law, you pay the price, and in this case, a very hefty price.

[oneiopen]

Again with the ridicule, Michael? And the play on my username---very clever. Oh and by the way, you still haven't answered Peter's questions. I will leave you with one last thought:

hubris.

My dear Michael, you have it in spades.

[justinian]

I understand I'm not permitted to use the phrase, "what an a..hole" on this board, so I'll simply say, "fiddlesticks."