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Post by enigma on Dec 7, 2019 11:25:19 GMT -5
You're talking about a person. That's what 'your consciousness' refers to. I never said anybody is creating and perceiving. I don't have any such idea of what you are having. When I say my consciousness, I am pointing at the only one consciousness which exists. You refuse to capitalize it, and insist on using a personal pronoun and refuse to acknowledge the impersonal even though you are speaking of the one impersonal Consciousness. It's an excellent plan for creating confusion. Well done. The one Consciousness is not ONLY doing the job of perceiving. It is also creating.
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Dec 7, 2019 11:26:48 GMT -5
When people say that there is nothing in control.. they mean that what is 'in control' isn't a thing, as in it isn't anything that the human mind can successfully conceptualise, because it has no form, other than what's happening right now. Yes, the personalized "God" that micromanages the machinations the mind in all it's glory perceives in all that machine's fantastically unfathomable intricate detail is a fairytale relic of our existential childhood. Mind is a wonderful tool, and a horrible master. "God" doesn't micromanage. That would defeat the whole purpose of creation, the manifest.
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Post by enigma on Dec 7, 2019 11:28:45 GMT -5
I can't recall unfortunately. While I can't even recall the memories of beginning of my nightly, I can't definitely recall what had happened in deep sleep. I can't even know whether there is a gab between my falling into the sleep and start of the dream. Unfortunately I can't know. You can't know either. So for all you know God, consciousness, could have stopped existing in deep sleep. Right? God pops in and out of existence? That's a bit disconcerting.
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Dec 7, 2019 11:29:05 GMT -5
Yes. And for all that, and more, to arise and "say": To the ramparts, to battle! but then, not, is what I mean by submission. Ego can be *there*, yet not take over. Basically, if you don't see it, you are, it. The one actively looking for it is hiding by pretending to be the one to look. There is no way to engage another ego, even to the point of naming it, without embodying it. Nonsense.
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Post by laughter on Dec 7, 2019 11:30:12 GMT -5
Yes, the personalized "God" that micromanages the machinations the mind in all it's glory perceives in all that machine's fantastically unfathomable intricate detail is a fairytale relic of our existential childhood. Mind is a wonderful tool, and a horrible master. "God" doesn't micromanage. That would defeat the whole purpose of creation, the manifest. Any notion of " control" is a micromanagment 'dusty. The c0ckpit is empty, ain't noone at the wheel, and the state, is quite headless.
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Post by enigma on Dec 7, 2019 11:31:04 GMT -5
So for all you know God, consciousness, could have stopped existing in deep sleep. Right? Not possible otherwise I can't return back to life. The whole universe would cease to exist for all eternity. That would not be a good thing.
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Post by laughter on Dec 7, 2019 11:32:59 GMT -5
The one actively looking for it is hiding by pretending to be the one to look. There is no way to engage another ego, even to the point of naming it, without embodying it. Nonsense. Nope. No ego there. (.. ** ahem ** .. )
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2019 11:34:29 GMT -5
So for all you know God, consciousness, could have stopped existing in deep sleep. Right? God pops in and out of existence? That's a bit disconcerting. I was coaxing gopal toward the idea that there is a distinction between awareness and consciousness with objects.
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Dec 7, 2019 11:34:48 GMT -5
Yes, the personalized "God" that micromanages the machinations the mind in all it's glory perceives in all that machine's fantastically unfathomable intricate detail is a fairytale relic of our existential childhood. Mind is a wonderful tool, and a horrible master. Oh yeah I have no doubt that that God is psychological only. So there is no Originating Consciousness? You are essentially an atheist? So what is the meaning of Whole? What is the meaning of Source? What is the meaning of Ground? What is the meaning of the Absolute? If this world is merely a dream world (and I'm not sure where you stand on this), What's dreaming the dream? Anybody.
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Dec 7, 2019 11:37:06 GMT -5
"God" doesn't micromanage. That would defeat the whole purpose of creation, the manifest. Any notion of " control" is a micromanagment 'dusty. The c0ckpit is empty, ain't noone at the wheel, and the state, is quite headless. That's absurd. I'll ask again (post above) What's dreaming the dream? If we are all merely dream actors, then the Dreamer has all the control. Yes? No?
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Post by laughter on Dec 7, 2019 11:39:11 GMT -5
Any notion of " control" is a micromanagment 'dusty. The c0ckpit is empty, ain't noone at the wheel, and the state, is quite headless. That's absurd. I'll ask again (post above) What's dreaming the dream? If we are all merely dream actors, then the Dreamer has all the control. Yes? No? You're posing an existential question. It's possible to observe and agree with the fact that what appears to us is ordered - and beautifully and intricately so. But the implication that this was done deliberately by some sort of entity is a trick of the mind. It's simply false.
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Dec 7, 2019 11:39:44 GMT -5
Nope. No ego there. (.. ** ahem ** .. ) I have never claimed anywhere, even intimated, over ten years here, that there is no ego present here.
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Post by laughter on Dec 7, 2019 11:41:10 GMT -5
Nope. No ego there. (.. ** ahem ** .. ) I have never claimed anywhere, even intimated, over ten years here, that there is no ego present here. So then, how can you be so certain that it's possible to engage with another's ego without one?
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Dec 7, 2019 11:44:41 GMT -5
That's absurd. I'll ask again (post above) What's dreaming the dream? If we are all merely dream actors, then the Dreamer has all the control. Yes? No? You're posing an existential question. It's possible to observe and agree with the fact that what appears to us is ordered - and beautifully and intricately so. But the implication that this was done deliberately by some sort of entity is a trick of the mind. It's simply false. Then explain all this business about you going to church with your wife and your mention sometimes about that. Does your wife know you think all that's malarkey? There doesn't have to be either all control or no control. That's tiny mind thinking. You've never heard of Process Philosophy? Alfred North Whitehead? I didn't know you were wholly in E's camp.
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Dec 7, 2019 11:54:42 GMT -5
I have never claimed anywhere, even intimated, over ten years here, that there is no ego present here. So then, how can you be so certain that it's possible to engage with another's ego without one? Ramana, Niz, Bodhidharma, Buddha, Lao Tzu, Chuang Tzu, Seng-Ts'an, Jesus, Huineng, Hypatia, Simone Weil, Bernadette Roberts, Hui-k'o, Ju-ching. Give me some time, I'll think of more. Nobody here, that's for sure.
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