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Post by enigma on Mar 29, 2014 21:36:37 GMT -5
With any other teaching or teacher, we find we can get up. We can think, "Oh, I heard Adya said dah-dah-day, at it sounds good," and we find ourselves lifting up off the floor of surrender. So near the end of the chapter Ayda weaves together the notions of silence and resistance. There are many stories or spiritual myths that are created and continue to be perpetuated that portray this coming back to our true nature as a battleground, as if there is something about you that doesn't want to return to itself. Whether this is called the ego, or the me or the mind that doesn't really want to be quiet, spiritual people can buy into this myth that there is something about them that doesn't want to wake up and that there has to be some struggle. When you are really quiet, you can see that this is total nonsense.When you posted that quote over on the quote thread, I looked it up and read the section to see if I could understand where he's comin from. (Yes, I read the book and I have it. You wanna know how it ends? ) The notion of not involving oneself in the seeker's struggle is an odd one seeing as how the one involving himself with Adya's words is the seeker. OTOH, the odd thingy about seeing a 'battleground' is that both sides of the battle are being fought by the same mind. So, I guess I agree it's a nonsense, but not because the one seeking actually wants to find. He doesn't.
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Post by laughter on Mar 29, 2014 21:48:21 GMT -5
The notion of not involving oneself in the seeker's struggle is an odd one seeing as how the one involving himself with Adya's words is the seeker. OTOH, the odd thingy about seeing a 'battleground' is that both sides of the battle are being fought by the same mind. So, I guess I agree it's a nonsense, but not because the one seeking actually wants to find. He doesn't. Yes, that's exactly what I take him to mean by that and I see it as certainly related, if not exactly what we touched on here: I don't talk much about how conscious that game of being unconscious really is since, in the midst of that game, it's pretty pointless, but it IS interesting that mind can even pull it off, and it's also very much to the point when it comes to the issue of suffering, which is the only reason I address any of it. ... and what is meant by "head-banging". Seems to me to also be related to all the umbrage that gets expressed in response to the direct pointing about effort. (Yes, I read the book and I have it. You wanna know how it ends? ) evil frogspoiler!!
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Post by enigma on Mar 29, 2014 22:24:40 GMT -5
The notion of not involving oneself in the seeker's struggle is an odd one seeing as how the one involving himself with Adya's words is the seeker. OTOH, the odd thingy about seeing a 'battleground' is that both sides of the battle are being fought by the same mind. So, I guess I agree it's a nonsense, but not because the one seeking actually wants to find. He doesn't. Yes, that's exactly what I take him to mean by that and I see it as certainly related, if not exactly what we touched on here: I don't talk much about how conscious that game of being unconscious really is since, in the midst of that game, it's pretty pointless, but it IS interesting that mind can even pull it off, and it's also very much to the point when it comes to the issue of suffering, which is the only reason I address any of it. ... and what is meant by "head-banging". Seems to me to also be related to all the umbrage that gets expressed in response to the direct pointing about effort. (Yes, I read the book and I have it. You wanna know how it ends? ) evil frogspoiler!! The Buddhist done it.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2014 12:29:08 GMT -5
that's it? how did it end? did the hero find the courage to face his fears? did he find the grail? did he die in the end?
or did he stay in his cave, fuming and cursing, fretting and scheming, ascared of shadows on the wall?
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Post by enigma on Apr 20, 2014 15:16:05 GMT -5
that's it? how did it end? did the hero find the courage to face his fears? did he find the grail? did he die in the end? or did he stay in his cave, fuming and cursing, fretting and scheming, ascared of shadows on the wall? Just kidding about the Buddhist. They're actually a pretty peaceful lot overall. You'll have to read the book or wait for the movie to come out.....Shorry.
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Post by laughter on May 20, 2014 14:23:29 GMT -5
Part of the maturation is to realize that you don't just give up the negative perceptions, you give up the positive ones, too. You give up the whole framework that was used to tell you who and what you are. Then you realize this body-mind experiences whatever it experiences, and you are the conscious space for it to have all those experiences. It truly doesn't matter what the experience is. It just so happens that the more you do this, the body-mind tends to reflect this wisdom by feeling really good. But even when it feels very good and blissful, you can still fall into the seduction of identifying with those nice emotions. As soon as you get seduced and think that those emotions tell you anything about yourself, it's just a matter of time before you'll be caught in separation again. chap 9, para 38
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Post by enigma on May 20, 2014 18:35:32 GMT -5
Part of the maturation is to realize that you don't just give up the negative perceptions, you give up the positive ones, too. You give up the whole framework that was used to tell you who and what you are. Then you realize this body-mind experiences whatever it experiences, and you are the conscious space for it to have all those experiences. It truly doesn't matter what the experience is. It just so happens that the more you do this, the body-mind tends to reflect this wisdom by feeling really good. But even when it feels very good and blissful, you can still fall into the seduction of identifying with those nice emotions. As soon as you get seduced and think that those emotions tell you anything about yourself, it's just a matter of time before you'll be caught in separation again. chap 9, para 38Yes, it's a point that has been argued endlessly with those who believe the negative stuff falls away and the good stuff remains. Ultimately, that tells me what sort of game folks are currently playing.
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Post by silence on May 20, 2014 19:44:42 GMT -5
Yes, it's a point that has been argued endlessly with those who believe the negative stuff falls away and the good stuff remains. Ultimately, that tells me what sort of game folks are currently playing. Indeed. Recently I had my dog stolen from my back yard (I'm serious). It's been over three weeks since I've seen her. I've experienced a depth of sadness I don't think I've ever felt before. At the same time, I wouldn't and couldn't expect to feel anything different.
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Post by quinn on May 20, 2014 20:01:54 GMT -5
Yes, it's a point that has been argued endlessly with those who believe the negative stuff falls away and the good stuff remains. Ultimately, that tells me what sort of game folks are currently playing. Indeed. Recently I had my dog stolen from my back yard (I'm serious). It's been over three weeks since I've seen her. I've experienced a depth of sadness I don't think I've ever felt before. At the same time, I wouldn't and couldn't expect to feel anything different. Oh, what a heartbreak.
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Post by laughter on May 20, 2014 20:48:25 GMT -5
Yes, it's a point that has been argued endlessly with those who believe the negative stuff falls away and the good stuff remains. Ultimately, that tells me what sort of game folks are currently playing. Indeed. Recently I had my dog stolen from my back yard (I'm serious). It's been over three weeks since I've seen her. I've experienced a depth of sadness I don't think I've ever felt before. At the same time, I wouldn't and couldn't expect to feel anything different. That sucks. How long had you had him/her? What's the dogs name?
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Post by laughter on May 20, 2014 20:53:31 GMT -5
Yes, it's a point that has been argued endlessly with those who believe the negative stuff falls away and the good stuff remains. Ultimately, that tells me what sort of game folks are currently playing. Bliss roulette! ... but then again as soon you you call the game you're a nihilistic stuck ND fundie who can't stop thinking dualistically and who opposes joy, peace and ease and promotes strife.
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Post by enigma on May 21, 2014 3:14:52 GMT -5
Yes, it's a point that has been argued endlessly with those who believe the negative stuff falls away and the good stuff remains. Ultimately, that tells me what sort of game folks are currently playing. Bliss roulette! ... but then again as soon you you call the game you're a nihilistic stuck ND fundie who can't stop thinking dualistically and who opposes joy, peace and ease and promotes strife. Bliss bunny addicts will fight for their fix. It's in the bunny genes.
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2014 15:33:04 GMT -5
Yes, it's a point that has been argued endlessly with those who believe the negative stuff falls away and the good stuff remains. Ultimately, that tells me what sort of game folks are currently playing. Indeed. Recently I had my dog stolen from my back yard (I'm serious). It's been over three weeks since I've seen her. I've experienced a depth of sadness I don't think I've ever felt before. At the same time, I wouldn't and couldn't expect to feel anything different. sorry to hear, that is awful. why would someone steal her?
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Post by silence on May 22, 2014 18:28:31 GMT -5
Indeed. Recently I had my dog stolen from my back yard (I'm serious). It's been over three weeks since I've seen her. I've experienced a depth of sadness I don't think I've ever felt before. At the same time, I wouldn't and couldn't expect to feel anything different. That sucks. How long had you had him/her? What's the dogs name? Almost 4 years. Her name is Daisy.
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Post by silence on May 22, 2014 18:31:26 GMT -5
Indeed. Recently I had my dog stolen from my back yard (I'm serious). It's been over three weeks since I've seen her. I've experienced a depth of sadness I don't think I've ever felt before. At the same time, I wouldn't and couldn't expect to feel anything different. sorry to hear, that is awful. why would someone steal her? The reasons are tough to swallow. Turning a quick profit on the dog through ransom or resale. Selling the dog to a laboratory for all kinds of testing. Using the dog as bait in dog fighting rings or worse.
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