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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 12:16:02 GMT -5
Donovan's rendition seemed good to me: first there is a mountain, then there is no mountain, then there is. There is only mountain#1. It's called 'mountain.' Then, heywow, that really ain't what I think it is. Then, *hiking* or *picnicing* or *skijump* or whatever. Or mountain climbing? Oh yes of course -- also bivowacing, freebasing, mountaintopping,...
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Post by Reefs on Dec 4, 2014 0:25:46 GMT -5
So, in order to see that there are fundamentally no bodhy-trees, you have to go from mountain #3 back to mountain #2 again? Just curious how you figger that mountain stuff actually works. I actually came back to clarify the last post, but you responded already (good question), so I'll do it here. Mountain #3 is not the same mountain as mountain #1, as in, mountains are once again mountains. You do in a sense go back to mountain #2. When you are at mountain #3, you carry what you learned at #2 with you to #3. At mountain #1 you have no clue about mountain #2. At mountain #3 you see all of life through mountain #2. In a very real sense at mountain #3, you are actually still at mountain #2. How does this mountain stuff work? ...........ask zd Okay, I see you are just speculating. No, you don't 'learn' anything and don't switch back and forth. It's more like a total emptying out the full cup you were at mountain #1 until there isn't even any cup left. Which doesn't mean, however, that you cannot interact with other full cups anymore.
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Post by Reefs on Dec 4, 2014 0:32:02 GMT -5
At mountain #3 there are Bodhi-trees, mirror stands, and mirrors. The point was that stage 3 is a more advanced understanding, so why wasn't he at stage 3? To SDP, it's not clear what stage 3 is. It's not stage 1, it's not stage 2, and it's also not a mixture of stage 1 and stage 2.
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Post by Reefs on Dec 4, 2014 0:41:13 GMT -5
Donovan's rendition seemed good to me: first there is a mountain, then there is no mountain, then there is. There is only mountain#1. It's called 'mountain.' Then, heywow, that really ain't what I think it is. Then, *hiking* or *picnicing* or *skijump* or whatever. Or mountain climbing? Or playing sherpa.
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Post by laughter on Dec 4, 2014 9:37:39 GMT -5
Or mountain climbing? Or playing sherpa.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2014 9:55:22 GMT -5
Or playing sherpa. forgot to mention cannibalism
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Post by quinn on Jul 28, 2015 15:42:59 GMT -5
In a very simplistic way, the difference between those people who have had deep and profound spiritual awakenings to their true nature and those who are actually liberated and free is this very simple matter: those who are liberated and free have totally and absolutely let to of control. This is true because, if you let go of control, then you cannot help but be liberated and free. It's like jumping off a building. You can't help but go down; gravity pulls you that way If you totally let go of control, you end up in complete self-realization. In its most elementary form, the desire for control feels as if there is a clenched hand in your gut. What you find, when you have worked your way through all the various ways you would control experience, is this elemental closed fist. And when you get close to this closed fist, you will find it has a protector. The protector of our elemental sense of control is rage. Usually this rage is more destructive than any feeling you ever wanted to admit could possibly exist within you. It is the ultimate protector of control, because if you have ever been near somebody who is raging, you get away from them, unless you're stupid. You might be draw to lots of other things: somebody whose trip is victimhood or depression, or maybe someone who's a victimizer or has other patterns. People can be drawn into an attachment or enmeshment with all sorts of emotional patterns, but very few are actually really comfortable with or find much value in being drawn like a moth to the fire of rage. In that sense, it's a very good protector. It does its job very effectively. Many people never get to their rage because right above it is fear. Fear usually works. Most people who are terribly afraid will run away. But the few people who go through their fear will come out of it feeling like there is something seemingly tremendously destructive underneath. And if you can keep going through that tornado, you will find there is an existential grip, usually in the pit of the gut, which can survive even very profound spiritual awakenings. The fear may or may not survive, and the rage may or may not survive. Often they don't. But the grip sometimes does survive in its most elemental form. Chapter 15, Pages 106-107 excerpts From Silver's post in the quotes only E.D. thread
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