Fear in Relation to Self Realization (NAT)

[laughter]

Any danger that underlies a fear, whatever fear, is of no danger at all to that subject to the realization.

Who or what fears? Whatever that is, it is not what is subject to realization ... nor is it that which realizes.

While the question of fear being an opposite of love is of course great fodder for a TMT fueled debate, in some sense or another, the two are in opposition to one another.

It is love that points toward the ineffable, and fear that roots one to the chimeric ground of a false existence that is nothing more than a misperception wrapped around an assumption.

[Deleted]

Nov 30, 2013 19:10:21 GMT -5 laughter said:

Any danger that underlies a fear, whatever fear, is of no danger at all to that subject to the realization.

Who or what fears? Whatever that is, it is not what is subject to realization ... nor is it that which realizes.

While the question of fear being an opposite of love is of course great fodder for a TMT fueled debate, in some sense or another, the two are in opposition to one another.

It is love that points toward the ineffable, and fear that roots one to the chimeric ground of a false existence that is nothing more than a misperception wrapped around an assumption.

Hello Laughter,

I don't put much thought into real versus illusion.

It just doesn't matter much over here ;-) 

Either side of the fence that you fall on is just a mental position, something to hold onto so to speak...with the exception that continuously viewing the world and self as illusion is one of the ancient and effective techniques.

For me, fear seems to be the direct result of attachment, a wanting to keep something the same that is inevitably going to blossom into something new, while Love is the experiencing of the Grace of God in all its various forms, aspects, and presentations.

When we want something that is going to change to stay the same, we experience fear.

Cling to nothing, and accept change with serenity, and there is no fear.

"Here is the sphere of change change change, through change, consume change."

Everything that appears in this sphere was born of change and will pass on to something new through change, everything is in a continuous state of change....by recognizing this in all things, and accepting, observing, and allowing, without clinging to that which will inevitably change due to it's very nature of flowing and blossoming, we are centered in the changeless, the eternal that pervades all change....in the absence of attachment, living in full 'in-joyment' of the blossoming change, there is no fear, and much Grace.

[laughter]

Nov 30, 2013 21:21:41 GMT -5 @stevenc said:

Nov 30, 2013 19:10:21 GMT -5 laughter said:

Any danger that underlies a fear, whatever fear, is of no danger at all to that subject to the realization.

Who or what fears? Whatever that is, it is not what is subject to realization ... nor is it that which realizes.

While the question of fear being an opposite of love is of course great fodder for a TMT fueled debate, in some sense or another, the two are in opposition to one another.

It is love that points toward the ineffable, and fear that roots one to the chimeric ground of a false existence that is nothing more than a misperception wrapped around an assumption.

Hello Laughter,

I don't put much thought into real versus illusion.

It just doesn't matter much over here ;-) 

Either side of the fence that you fall on is just a mental position, something to hold onto so to speak...with the exception that continuously viewing the world and self as illusion is one of the ancient and effective techniques.

For me, fear seems to be the direct result of attachment, a wanting to keep something the same that is inevitably going to blossom into something new, while Love is the experiencing of the Grace of God in all its various forms, aspects, and presentations.

When we want something that is going to change to stay the same, we experience fear.

Cling to nothing, and accept change with serenity, and there is no fear.

"Here is the sphere of change change change, through change, consume change."

Everything that appears in this sphere was born of change and will pass on to something new through change, everything is in a continuous state of change....by recognizing this in all things, and accepting, observing, and allowing, without clinging to that which will inevitably change due to it's very nature of flowing and blossoming, we are centered in the changeless, the eternal that pervades all change....in the absence of attachment, living in full 'in-joyment' of the blossoming change, there is no fear, and much Grace.

Relating fear to change is an interesting route to take. I'll offer the opinion that not all resistance to change necessarily involves fear, but I do see how, at least without contemplating it too much, fear can always be associated with some sort of resistance to change, and thereby, attachment.

So how do you see that translating in the context of self-realization? What is the change that is subject to resistance in that context?

[silence]

Nov 30, 2013 19:10:21 GMT -5 laughter said:

Any danger that underlies a fear, whatever fear, is of no danger at all to that subject to the realization.

Who or what fears? Whatever that is, it is not what is subject to realization ... nor is it that which realizes.

While the question of fear being an opposite of love is of course great fodder for a TMT fueled debate, in some sense or another, the two are in opposition to one another.

It is love that points toward the ineffable, and fear that roots one to the chimeric ground of a false existence that is nothing more than a misperception wrapped around an assumption.

Fear for most is like a doorway that must be opened rather than a puzzle to be solved.

[andrew]

Nov 30, 2013 19:10:21 GMT -5 laughter said:

Any danger that underlies a fear, whatever fear, is of no danger at all to that subject to the realization.

Who or what fears? Whatever that is, it is not what is subject to realization ... nor is it that which realizes.

While the question of fear being an opposite of love is of course great fodder for a TMT fueled debate, in some sense or another, the two are in opposition to one another.

It is love that points toward the ineffable, and fear that roots one to the chimeric ground of a false existence that is nothing more than a misperception wrapped around an assumption.

A distinction between 'that which fears' and 'that which is subject to realization' eh. Hmmm. I could see myself, in a rare situation, say that it is ego that fears, and mind that is subject to realization.....but it would be very debatable. Or I might say that fear is mind, but You are never scared....but then I wouldn't say that this same 'You' also realizes stuff. Most times I would just say that 'I fear' and 'I realize'....the 'I' in this case being the totality of individual Self.

I might also say that a realization comes from higher mind and informs the conscious mind while impacting greatly on what's happening in the unconscious/subconscious. Whereas fear originates in the subconscious/subconscious and feeds into the conscious mind, while the higher mind waits and watches. In a sense, its a case of reverse directions.

[laughter]

Nov 30, 2013 23:19:47 GMT -5 silence said:

Nov 30, 2013 19:10:21 GMT -5 laughter said:

Any danger that underlies a fear, whatever fear, is of no danger at all to that subject to the realization.

Who or what fears? Whatever that is, it is not what is subject to realization ... nor is it that which realizes.

While the question of fear being an opposite of love is of course great fodder for a TMT fueled debate, in some sense or another, the two are in opposition to one another.

It is love that points toward the ineffable, and fear that roots one to the chimeric ground of a false existence that is nothing more than a misperception wrapped around an assumption.

Fear for most is like a doorway that must be opened rather than a puzzle to be solved.

Poignant, and inarguable.

[laughter]

Is there anything that one can read on one of the pages of this website that the reader should be afraid of?

Is there any benefit to a fear response to any of the words on the screen?

Short of having one's life situation hijacked by a cult, does an individual benefit from or have any other use for a fear response to an idea about spirituality?

For example, could Midnight have benefited from having been too afraid to watch the Mooji video he spoke about repeatedly or to have been too afraid to try the self-inquiry that Midnight said that Mooji suggested in the video?

[andrew]

Dec 1, 2013 7:32:19 GMT -5 laughter said:

Is there anything that one can read on one of the pages of this website that the reader should be afraid of?

Is there any benefit to a fear response to any of the words on the screen?

Short of having one's life situation hijacked by a cult, does an individual benefit from or have any other use for a fear response to an idea about spirituality?

For example, could Midnight have benefited from having been too afraid to watch the Mooji video he spoke about repeatedly or to have been to afraid to try the self-inquiry that Midnight said that Mooji suggested in the video?

Yes.

I would say that fear can be a healthy indicator that something might do more harm than good. It can also be an indicator that something just isn't resonating with love/joy.

It can be tricky working out though whether the fear is a healthy indictor to be heeded, or whether to take a position of 'feel the fear and do it anyway' kind of thing.

[laughter]

Dec 1, 2013 7:52:51 GMT -5 andrew said:

Dec 1, 2013 7:32:19 GMT -5 laughter said:

Is there anything that one can read on one of the pages of this website that the reader should be afraid of?

Is there any benefit to a fear response to any of the words on the screen?

Short of having one's life situation hijacked by a cult, does an individual benefit from or have any other use for a fear response to an idea about spirituality?

For example, could Midnight have benefited from having been too afraid to watch the Mooji video he spoke about repeatedly or to have been to afraid to try the self-inquiry that Midnight said that Mooji suggested in the video?

Yes.

I would say that fear can be a healthy indicator that something might do more harm than good. It can also be an indicator that something just isn't resonating with love/joy.

It can be tricky working out though whether the fear is a healthy indictor to be heeded, or whether to take a position of 'feel the fear and do it anyway' kind of thing.

To clarify I'll offer the distinction between something written on a one-on-one basis as opposed to something written to noone in particular.

The context I'm interested in here is content that's directed to noone in particular, rather than directed to an individual personally.

[justlikeyou]

There was once a period of time where I was plagued by a "strange entity" that would blow a puff of air at the nape of my neck just as I was falling off to sleep. My spine would crawl and I froze in fear until sleep came. Over the course of a year or more "it" would come unexpectedly. One day it occurred to me that when this happened I needed to turn around and face this "thing" full on. The next time it occurred I mustered the courage and turned around to look "hell" straight in the eye, and lo and behold, there was nothing there. Nothing at all. And in seeing this, nothing ever bothered me that way again. The way out of fear, in this case, was the way through it.

[silence]

Dec 1, 2013 7:32:19 GMT -5 laughter said:

Is there anything that one can read on one of the pages of this website that the reader should be afraid of?

Is there any benefit to a fear response to any of the words on the screen?

Short of having one's life situation hijacked by a cult, does an individual benefit from or have any other use for a fear response to an idea about spirituality?

For example, could Midnight have benefited from having been too afraid to watch the Mooji video he spoke about repeatedly or to have been too afraid to try the self-inquiry that Midnight said that Mooji suggested in the video?

Intense irrational fear can often be a catalyst for curiosity. The kind of curiosity that finally gets interested in what's going on, really. Of course it's not necessary though.

[silver]

Dec 1, 2013 11:51:33 GMT -5 silence said:

Dec 1, 2013 7:32:19 GMT -5 laughter said:

Is there anything that one can read on one of the pages of this website that the reader should be afraid of?

Is there any benefit to a fear response to any of the words on the screen?

Short of having one's life situation hijacked by a cult, does an individual benefit from or have any other use for a fear response to an idea about spirituality?

For example, could Midnight have benefited from having been too afraid to watch the Mooji video he spoke about repeatedly or to have been too afraid to try the self-inquiry that Midnight said that Mooji suggested in the video?

Intense irrational fear can often be a catalyst for curiosity. The kind of curiosity that finally gets interested in what's going on, really. Of course it's not necessary though.

Yeah, I'm thinking intense, and/or irrational fear...big yes to sentence #2.

[Deleted]

Nov 30, 2013 19:10:21 GMT -5 laughter said:

Any danger that underlies a fear, whatever fear, is of no danger at all to that subject to the realization.

Who or what fears? Whatever that is, it is not what is subject to realization ... nor is it that which realizes.

While the question of fear being an opposite of love is of course great fodder for a TMT fueled debate, in some sense or another, the two are in opposition to one another.

It is love that points toward the ineffable, and fear that roots one to the chimeric ground of a false existence that is nothing more than a misperception wrapped around an assumption.

I don't see any opposition between love and fear. They are names that we give to the same energy depending upon our perception of the situation.

Neither points to anything.

Don't get me wrong... if you say love leads to the ineffable, more people will follow the 'way' to the ineffable, than if you tell them fear will lead them there. But both are equal in their primordial manipulation in the mind. 

[Deleted]

Dec 1, 2013 15:16:36 GMT -5 @autumnleaf said:

Nov 30, 2013 19:10:21 GMT -5 laughter said:

Any danger that underlies a fear, whatever fear, is of no danger at all to that subject to the realization.

Who or what fears? Whatever that is, it is not what is subject to realization ... nor is it that which realizes.

While the question of fear being an opposite of love is of course great fodder for a TMT fueled debate, in some sense or another, the two are in opposition to one another.

It is love that points toward the ineffable, and fear that roots one to the chimeric ground of a false existence that is nothing more than a misperception wrapped around an assumption.

I don't see any opposition between love and fear. They are names that we give to the same energy depending upon our perception of the situation.

Neither points to anything.

Don't get me wrong... if you say love leads to the ineffable, more people will follow the 'way' to the ineffable, than if you tell them fear will lead them there. But both are equal in their primordial manipulation in the mind. 

Yes, Freedom as Love or Freedom as fear is Freedom...

It's all there is...

[silence]

Dec 1, 2013 15:16:36 GMT -5 @autumnleaf said:

Nov 30, 2013 19:10:21 GMT -5 laughter said:

Any danger that underlies a fear, whatever fear, is of no danger at all to that subject to the realization.

Who or what fears? Whatever that is, it is not what is subject to realization ... nor is it that which realizes.

While the question of fear being an opposite of love is of course great fodder for a TMT fueled debate, in some sense or another, the two are in opposition to one another.

It is love that points toward the ineffable, and fear that roots one to the chimeric ground of a false existence that is nothing more than a misperception wrapped around an assumption.

I don't see any opposition between love and fear. They are names that we give to the same energy depending upon our perception of the situation.

Neither points to anything.

Don't get me wrong... if you say love leads to the ineffable, more people will follow the 'way' to the ineffable, than if you tell them fear will lead them there. But both are equal in their primordial manipulation in the mind. 

Something I've found quite powerful is that all emotions will lead you back to love. At their core, without resistance they give way to something people call love. It's not the love between two people, it's not romance or attraction. It's utterly indescribable. Even fear in its most overwhelming state is coming forth from this love and melts back into it. This is hardly noticeable unless one is willing to look one's fear squarely head on. Sadness, joy and everything in between run into this love. The only requirement is that you must take what comes and be willing to go as deeply as it may go.