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Post by Beingist on Jul 22, 2013 11:59:25 GMT -5
Yes to the bold, and to add that that's the whole point. Looking inward highlights the thoughts and emotions that we are to look at and allow. Looking outward, NOT inward is the easiest thing in the world to do, which is why 99.9999999% of the global population does it.Sounds like you're just trying to better your experience. Yeah, that's one way for the 'I' to poke its head up. Otherwise, I get what you mean about 'being lousy at meditation'. Like you, I watch the thoughts constantly. Meditation, then, sorta becomes pointless, like drinking to get drunk when you're already drunk. I guess I am in the 0.000000001% then, such a special snowflake, I am. Okay, reflecting on past "process," looking outward used to be easy, then it got all freaky, because there was no separation and yet everyone kept insisting there was. Confusing. So I turned inward for awhile instead - that seemed safer. "something must be wrong with me" .. let the comparisons, fault finding, and personal growth hamster wheel begin! But as I looked and looked inward and searched for a compass I found no "there, there." (This is when the shrink told me I was having an "identity" crisis). So then I went back to looking outward. It worked for awhile, it was just normal every day looking. Actually my hubby takes some credit here because he's always had this marvelous way of interrupting my belly button gazing to make sure I don't miss the beautiful sunset or whatever. Everything was fine, but then it got freaky again. But this time, I decided to just roll with it, and try a different approach... That's when it became a huge exercise in exploring what the outward appearances were reflecting about the inward experience. There were some amazing revelations. It led me down all sorts of interesting areas of inquiry. Mostly, it was just a fun & entertaining game, until I took a long long detour into Messiah /magical woo woo land, because I still held the belief it said something about "me." The "I" arises because I do not want to be a messiah - that idea scares the heck out of me. LOL. So with final collapse, it lead all the way back to where it started: there's no separation. Which I already knew... until around 8 years old. How can you see the reflections of an inward experience, unless you look inward?
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Post by serpentqueen on Jul 22, 2013 12:46:14 GMT -5
I guess I am in the 0.000000001% then, such a special snowflake, I am. Okay, reflecting on past "process," looking outward used to be easy, then it got all freaky, because there was no separation and yet everyone kept insisting there was. Confusing. So I turned inward for awhile instead - that seemed safer. "something must be wrong with me" .. let the comparisons, fault finding, and personal growth hamster wheel begin! But as I looked and looked inward and searched for a compass I found no "there, there." (This is when the shrink told me I was having an "identity" crisis). So then I went back to looking outward. It worked for awhile, it was just normal every day looking. Actually my hubby takes some credit here because he's always had this marvelous way of interrupting my belly button gazing to make sure I don't miss the beautiful sunset or whatever. Everything was fine, but then it got freaky again. But this time, I decided to just roll with it, and try a different approach... That's when it became a huge exercise in exploring what the outward appearances were reflecting about the inward experience. There were some amazing revelations. It led me down all sorts of interesting areas of inquiry. Mostly, it was just a fun & entertaining game, until I took a long long detour into Messiah /magical woo woo land, because I still held the belief it said something about "me." The "I" arises because I do not want to be a messiah - that idea scares the heck out of me. LOL. So with final collapse, it lead all the way back to where it started: there's no separation. Which I already knew... until around 8 years old. How can you see the reflections of an inward experience, unless you look inward? At that stage it became a combo approach, does that clarify?
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Post by Beingist on Jul 22, 2013 13:04:27 GMT -5
How can you see the reflections of an inward experience, unless you look inward? At that stage it became a combo approach, does that clarify? As long as you're looking inward. I was under the impression that you were averse to looking inward due to the emotions it excites.
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Post by serpentqueen on Jul 22, 2013 13:17:01 GMT -5
At that stage it became a combo approach, does that clarify? As long as you're looking inward. I was under the impression that you were averse to looking inward due to the emotions it excites. Nah, looking inward feels safer. It's just there's no there there, and I was under impression there should be, since everyone goes on and on about it so much. I could create a false inner self but it's akin to wearing a pair of those sunglasses with the plastic nose... too easy to see through the disguise. Looking outward creates much more reactivity for me, emotionally. There's a huge sense of vulnerability - the external is filling up the empty internal. It never helped when I'd be told "that's because you don't have a strong enough sense of self." Okay let me just get me one of those, where do they sell them? LOL. So you don the plastic nose disguise again ... and pretend. Knowing all along, you are just pretending. Or f*ck there really IS something wrong with me!!
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Post by Beingist on Jul 22, 2013 13:23:25 GMT -5
As long as you're looking inward. I was under the impression that you were averse to looking inward due to the emotions it excites. Nah, looking inward feels safer. It's just there's no there there, and I was under impression there should be, since everyone goes on and on about it so much. I could create a false inner self but it's akin to wearing a pair of those sunglasses with the plastic nose... too easy to see through the disguise. Looking outward creates much more reactivity for me, emotionally. There's a huge sense of vulnerability - the external is filling up the empty internal. It never helped when I'd be told "that's because you don't have a strong enough sense of self." Okay let me just get me one of those, where do they sell them? LOL. So you don the plastic nose disguise again ... and pretend. Knowing all along, you are just pretending. Or f*ck there really IS something wrong with me!! Okay, now you're contradicting yourself. Are you affiliated with Enigma? You said this-- For me - this particular human critter- looking inward greatly ramps up thoughts, emotions, sensory perceptions rather than quieting them down. I find it a lot, lot easier to still the thoughts by focusing on the external instead So, it's easier to still the thoughts by focusing on the external, but safer to look inward? You're not making any sense, now, SQ.
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Post by serpentqueen on Jul 22, 2013 13:50:45 GMT -5
Nah, looking inward feels safer. It's just there's no there there, and I was under impression there should be, since everyone goes on and on about it so much. I could create a false inner self but it's akin to wearing a pair of those sunglasses with the plastic nose... too easy to see through the disguise. Looking outward creates much more reactivity for me, emotionally. There's a huge sense of vulnerability - the external is filling up the empty internal. It never helped when I'd be told "that's because you don't have a strong enough sense of self." Okay let me just get me one of those, where do they sell them? LOL. So you don the plastic nose disguise again ... and pretend. Knowing all along, you are just pretending. Or f*ck there really IS something wrong with me!! Okay, now you're contradicting yourself. Are you affiliated with Enigma? You said this-- For me - this particular human critter- looking inward greatly ramps up thoughts, emotions, sensory perceptions rather than quieting them down. I find it a lot, lot easier to still the thoughts by focusing on the external instead So, it's easier to still the thoughts by focusing on the external, but safer to look inward? You're not making any sense, now, SQ. Well, THAT was inconsistent of me, wasn't it? I guess it's hard to generalize. Sometimes it's that way, sometimes it's this way. For every rule I may state, I can see an exception to it. This is the problem when the mind wants to stitch it all together in a logical explanation, that this happened first, and that happened next, and divide things into nice categories, like inner vs outer. Also "safer" is full of sh*t. There's no safety.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2013 13:51:40 GMT -5
Ah. Like in meditation. No wonder I've been so confused. I'm lousy at meditation - the type where you keep your eyes closed, sit still, and look inward. I found it worked better for me to "meditate" with eyes wide open, and often while walking rather than sitting still. Possibly this is a form of ATA, I dunno. Jesus said to them, "When you make the two into one, and when you make the inner like the outer and the outer like the inner, and the upper like the lower, and when you make male and female into a single one, so that the male will not be male nor the female be female, when you make eyes in place of an eye, a hand in place of a hand, a foot in place of a foot, an image in place of an image, then you will enter [the kingdom]." ... it doesn't matter which direction you look, inward or outward.... it's all one and the same.... Eye's open, eye's closed, sitting, walking, preparing breakfast, watching TV....doesn't really matter... If you have question about non-duality....the advice remains the same, in whatever activity look inward for the source of experience, thoughts, sensations, and once you "uncovered" it, merge your "self-ness" into it ;-)
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Post by serpentqueen on Jul 22, 2013 15:09:36 GMT -5
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Post by relinquish on Jul 26, 2013 0:57:41 GMT -5
This is my latest (and I'm pretty sure last) conceptual description of the way the non-dual reality (this reality) actually is.
It is the fundamental nature of the infinite, eternal ISness that is what is actually 'here' and 'now' to be intrinsically aware of the absolute causelessness that it is. There is only 'This'. 'It' is not a 'thing'. It is the forever boundless, stateless state of 'pure awareness'. It is Self 'experiencing' Self, which appears as 'seer' (emptiness) experiencing 'seen' (form).
It is only 'within' this illusory 'unfolding' of duality, difference, change, limitation, separation and manyness that 'things' appear, 'events' occur, and 'knowing' takes place.
EVERYTHING that happens is essentially an 'apparent part' of the one forever effortless unfolding of this appearance. This is what is fundamentally 'going on'.
The many apparently separate vantage points of awareness that are apparently 'our personal perspectives' are themselves all finite, temporary 'reflections' of the one absolute vantage field that is the impersonal perspective of 'the seer'.
These reflections emanate from extremely complex apparent parts of the 'the seen', known as life-forms. The most complex of these apparent life-forms are 'body/mind organisms', which are life-forms in which the process of memory and thought is effortlessly taking place within 'their' brains.
From these finite, temporary perspectives, the illusory duality, difference, change, limitation, separation and manyness is 'perceived' and instantly believed to be indisputably real.
From this belief, coupled with discrete 'physical sensations' that occur within the body/mind as a result of it's capacity to reflect the impersonal gaze of the seer back upon itself from 'it's own' seen personal vantage point, the illusion of 'me' (a separate, independently behaving body/mind-based self) and 'not me' (everything and everyone 'else') effortlessly arises.
Actually, ALL is Self. ALL is 'made' of pure awareness. There is only 'This'.
In truth, we are 'This'.
Innocently free and at peace, forever and ever.
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Post by lolly on Jul 26, 2013 7:43:44 GMT -5
It's a way to ask why, there's no duality and non-duality or anything. People are endless about it, but I wonder who are they're trying to convince.
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Post by relinquish on Jul 26, 2013 16:11:05 GMT -5
It's a way to ask why, there's no duality and non-duality or anything. People are endless about it, but I wonder who are they're trying to convince. It seems that 'trying to convince others' just happens sometimes (like right now, with this post). Even though there are no actual 'others'. Weird, init?
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