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Post by ivory on May 2, 2011 1:43:14 GMT -5
That video was awesome
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Post by ivory on May 2, 2011 1:51:21 GMT -5
To be what you are, or the dog chasing it's tail, is the only thing that is real. Each of us has to discover the meaning of the dog chasing his tail, for ourselves. And the beauty of it all, is that you are already that. I think you got the analogy a little mixed up here dude. I think the whole "dog chasing it's tail" thing is analogous to the futility of seeking.
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Post by dreamerrach on May 2, 2011 7:12:59 GMT -5
I've kinda stopped trying at this point. You are on your way to catching that pesky tail! Congrats!!! Woo-Hoo! Here, have a karma point
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Post by kate on May 2, 2011 7:26:20 GMT -5
It's logical that peace would be the result of not chasing the fleeting happiness, but nobody really wants Peace because they don't know what it is. Conceptual peace is just another fleeting dualistic polarity. That's why you get hooked back into the excitement of the movement again. Yep, that certainly seems like it. Lately I notice that the movement that comes from seeking happiness often results as a seeming reaction to unhappiness, which in turn is created by the thought that whatever is going on is not satisfactory or good enough and that something better should be going on. I've gotten interested in this because the particular situations that I'm experiencing the most dissatisfaction with, there's actually nothing wrong with. It's just stuff, there's no problem with it whatsoever, but boy am I good at making up problems with it! The whole business is a ridiculous self-perpetuating cycle that gains more and more momentum the longer it's left unchecked. And rather than it generating more periods of brief fleeting happiness it actually just washes everything in anxiety and misery. Anyway, I don't mean to suggest that life for me at the moment is a wash of misery - once I see these things they start to level out, which is what has happened. It's still a case of being conscious of it, though, as opposed to just dropping the whole business.
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Post by teetown on May 2, 2011 9:48:43 GMT -5
TRF, you speak with quite a bit of authority. So I have a question. For you, was there an instance when the truth was seen, or is it more of a gradual process? I don't know if I've seen the truth, to be perfectly honest. But a gradual process is certainly how it has manifested for me. To be what you are, or the dog chasing it's tail, is the only thing that is real. And although I can see that, I haven't actually been that. Or actually we were all that, but somehow we lost it. And thus the search, to find that which we've never really lost at all... My endeavor is to 'be' that, that which we already are. Self inquiry has been the catalyst, that has helped to pull back the curtains for a glimpse of our true nature. Each of us has to discover the meaning of the dog chasing his tail, for ourselves. And the beauty of it all, is that you are already that. Thanks trf. Just trying tosee where you're speaking from. But I wonder: how you can be certain of what you're going to find if you admittedly haven't found it yet? How can you know the outcome of your truth seeking before the seeking process hasn't finished?
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Post by klaus on May 2, 2011 10:05:29 GMT -5
dreamerrach & someNOTHING,
WOW! PIGS DO FLY!
Thanks for the vids.
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Post by enigma on May 2, 2011 10:50:30 GMT -5
It's logical that peace would be the result of not chasing the fleeting happiness, but nobody really wants Peace because they don't know what it is. Conceptual peace is just another fleeting dualistic polarity. That's why you get hooked back into the excitement of the movement again. I've gotten interested in this because the particular situations that I'm experiencing the most dissatisfaction with, there's actually nothing wrong with. It's just stuff, there's no problem with it whatsoever, but boy am I good at making up problems with it! The whole business is a ridiculous self-perpetuating cycle that gains more and more momentum the longer it's left unchecked. And rather than it generating more periods of brief fleeting happiness it actually just washes everything in anxiety and misery. There ya go. All sorts of movements toward unhappiness are started unconsciously when there's really nothing wrong. This can happen for all sorts of reasons, including the excitement of drama, wanting to be right, wanting to solve problems, wanting the experience of controlling, wanting to feel the righteousness of anger or use victimhood as an excuse. The list is endless and it can get very convoluted. Negative feelings that have suppressed can be projected, and sometimes we just want to feel something and negative feelings are the most accessible. It's still an attempt to find happiness, it's just a little twisted. Yeah, becoming conscious of a scenario stops that one, and another unconscious scenario happens. The process of becoming conscious seems endless but it's not. The reason the futility of happiness is being talked about is that seeing this will dissolve all of those unconscious patterns at once, since they are all the attempt to fulfill some kind of want; to be happy, even if it takes a negative form.
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Post by therealfake on May 2, 2011 12:15:10 GMT -5
I don't know if I've seen the truth, to be perfectly honest. But a gradual process is certainly how it has manifested for me. To be what you are, or the dog chasing it's tail, is the only thing that is real. And although I can see that, I haven't actually been that. Or actually we were all that, but somehow we lost it. And thus the search, to find that which we've never really lost at all... My endeavor is to 'be' that, that which we already are. Self inquiry has been the catalyst, that has helped to pull back the curtains for a glimpse of our true nature. Each of us has to discover the meaning of the dog chasing his tail, for ourselves. And the beauty of it all, is that you are already that. Thanks trf. Just trying tosee where you're speaking from. But I wonder: how you can be certain of what you're going to find if you admittedly haven't found it yet? How can you know the outcome of your truth seeking before the seeking process hasn't finished? Sorry, if I implied that, I'm going to find something, because there isn't anything to find... It's already here, we are 'already' that. People search and end up back where they started from and realize what's always been here, right from the beginning. It's always been right there with you, throughout your entire search. And although anything could have helped me to see that, it requires nothing at all to 'BE' that. When 'I am' that, I am the 'tree blowing in the wind', or the 'dog chasing it's tail', the perfect expression of God, the eternal, Shiva, emptiness or whatever you want to call it. Peeps think that there is going to be some wow experience, or some feeling, or something special. In fact there is nothing special going on, just pure expression... It's only outside observers who will feel something, or want to write a poem, or laugh or cry... Is the dog 'thinking about chasing his tail' or is he simply the expression of the eternal? And who is it that 'thinks' it's funny and laughs? If you can see that they are one in the same, you will have an understanding of 'Being' and 'Becoming'
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Post by charliegee on May 2, 2011 16:07:02 GMT -5
I'm working on my new spiritual epic/how-to guide/cookbook, 'A Bronx Tail' ...
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Post by masuki on May 2, 2011 18:20:42 GMT -5
I'm working on my new spiritual epic/how-to guide/cookbook, 'A Bronx Tail' ... Sounds interesting!
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Post by kate on May 2, 2011 21:36:20 GMT -5
The reason the futility of happiness is being talked about is that seeing this will dissolve all of those unconscious patterns at once, since they are all the attempt to fulfill some kind of want; to be happy, even if it takes a negative form. Yes, it's a helpful way to look at all this for me because it's something that is going on constantly and so it can be noticed again and again. I've been really giving myself a hard time with one aspect of my work lately. I've been very resistant to it and making it very difficult for myself. It has baffled me why I am doing this, what exactly my problem is with it. For a while I tried to get to the bottom of it and then I decided that it didn't really matter what my problem with it was, that trying to figure that out was just creating more stories about it. It’s just a series of actions that need to be performed with a bit of thought where necessary. It's just physical movement and a bit of mental movement and there is absolutely no reason for it to be anything more than that. The other interesting thing is that when I allow it to be just that and don't layer it with a whole lot of bs, this job that I previously loathed I can enjoy as much as anything else. I'm seeing how all of experience works this way – with taking what is going on, which is usually very simple and neutral on its most fundamental level, and getting creative with it and turning it into something else by making up stories about it. It’s actually kind of funny and I suppose it’s just playing, really and probably wouldn't be so much of a problem if it wasn't in the service of a futile search.
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Post by enigma on May 2, 2011 21:44:32 GMT -5
Yeah, the whole spiritual process is really a distraction. As Mooji likes to say, mind throwing stones in the bushes to get your attention.
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Post by kate on May 2, 2011 22:01:38 GMT -5
I was reading a section of Perfect Brilliant Stillness last night (David Carse) and this quote might be relevant...or it might just be something that jumped out at me "Perhaps a reason that the Understanding is not a more common occurrence is that it is too simple, too close to home, too subtle. All the seeking is in the other direction, toward something other, something grander. Consider this: a common response when the Understanding happens is laughter. A common response is, “Oh, that!” Right here, that which is most familiar to you, but overlooked because the looking has been for something else, something beyond. That’s why the finding is in stopping, in stillness. “Be still and know I am God.” Your natural state. Subtle. It is lost, overlooked if there is positive movement, direct searching, active thinking, anything but profound stillness… …The sheer enormity of the misperception, the misunderstanding, is staggering. That’s why the laughter when there finally is seeing: it’s not like we’re even close. Almost the entire human endeavor, from daily life, daily thought and actions, to philosophy and theology, psychology and sociology, biology, physics, history and politics, is all based on a completely erroneous premise and is headed wildly, blithely, obliviously off in the wrong direction."
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Post by enigma on May 2, 2011 22:46:11 GMT -5
Zackly, so there's nothing to be done but to derail that runaway train by any means necessary.
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Post by kate on May 3, 2011 1:56:29 GMT -5
It’s tricky. Just about every bit of information coming to us from the outside world is telling us that permanent happiness can be found. We’re introduced to the words “happily ever after” when we’re about two years old, or even earlier - before we even know what they are supposed to mean - and encouraged to pursue the idea tirelessly from there on in. Despite this you look around and there’s no evidence of anyone having found permanent happiness any more than there is evidence of winged unicorns. And yet most people would consider the pursuit of one a sign of sanity and the pursuit of the other a sign of madness.
There are hooks that snag you everywhere – the movies you see, the questions people ask you when you are in social situations, the qualities that are admired and rewarded in people, etc. are all based on the pursuit of happiness and perceived degrees of success or failure.
In one respect I feel like I see that it’s a doomed, Sisyphean thing; that was the start of all this for me in a way – the seeing of that to some extent. But it still goes on and I’m not sure how that can be. Or how it can stop. I don’t know how I could see anymore clearly that I do, the futility of chasing anything. And yet here I am!
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