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Post by homealone on Feb 8, 2011 17:07:16 GMT -5
Hello, I have been studying this world of enlightenment for the past 4 months and have been greatly influenced by both Mooji and Eckhart Tolle. But what I am having trouble getting around is what this post is hoping to clear up.
Wouldn't an enlightened person settle for anyone as a partner since enlightenment is about surrender and accepting what is? Do we choose?Is choosing a partner ego deciding/judging what is right or wrong?
The reason I ask is because I have been in a relationship with my girlfriend for the past two years and we fight a lot. I wonder if she is right for me but then I realize that this is just my ego's judgment of what is. So do we accept everything? That is true love right? I know being enlightened means you don't "need" anyone/anything to make you happy so why do we have relationships? Will anyone due for the enlightened?
Thank you for reading or posting and have a great day.
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Post by teetown on Feb 8, 2011 18:21:09 GMT -5
I wouldn't get too caught up on that stuff. When I got on the path I used to have questions like that, about what I should or shouldn't do. More recently I realized that enlightenment, whatever it is, it doesn't really have anything to do with that; it doesn't care what you do. It doesn't dictate what you should or shouldn't do. In fact, I've had an inkling that what these enlightened folks have been saying might be true, there might not be a "me" here making those decisions anyway, so then why stress out over it.
So if your relationship ain't working, it ain't working. That's the reality of the situation. And the reality of the situation is much closer to enlightenment than ideas about how we should behave.
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Post by michaelsees on Feb 8, 2011 19:29:58 GMT -5
Nice post teetown you summed it up to a tee Michael
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Post by zendancer on Feb 8, 2011 19:40:47 GMT -5
Yup. Teetown nailed that one.
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Post by therealfake on Feb 8, 2011 19:54:32 GMT -5
We live in a world of ego's, whether you are aware of that or not, it makes no difference, it's the truth. When ego's live together there is going to be conflict, mainly because of control. We want to have things go our way. When we don't get our way, we resent that, which seems to prevent us from getting what we want. The ego will do anything to prevent it from being controlled or feeling vulnerable. When one lives from being, they realize that all control and invulnerability comes from ones beingness. If you were for one moment, to let yourself be vulnerable, you will be instantly thrown into being and become invulnerable. The world really is upside down, to what we think it is. To give up control, throws you instantly into the beingness and into total control. Start by being aware, the next time your arguing, if you or your mate, seem to be wanting to win or control the situation and having the last word. That's all you have to do, be aware. See if you can see the ego acting out it's control and vulnerability fears. If you find yourself awakening and your partner is not, two outcomes are possible, you will split up naturally, or you'll be drawn closer together, either of which, is as it should be. Please be advised that this dime store psychoanalysis is not to be taken at face value, but more as food for thought...
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Post by eputkonen on Feb 8, 2011 20:22:42 GMT -5
Not anyone will due - for the main fact that there has to be some resonance...not all notes work well together.
Accepting everything does not mean being stuck with 'what is' forever. You can accept and yet do something else. You can accept that the two notes are in disonance and perhaps would best not be pushed together. There may be better combination elsewhere. Put another way, if you fall into a pit of quick sand and totally accept what is...that does not mean you never try to get out of the pit. However, if you are stuck in the pit (no way out available)...there wil be peace and contentment. Remember though, we are never stuck in relationships - there is always an out.
In 2005 I woke up...and two years later I met my wife. We had a lot in common - she is spiritual, into tai chi, entrepreneurial, etc...but we were different enough to make it interesting.
Now I did not marry my wife out of some form of need. The marriage ceremony and such was important to my wife...I did not particularly care, but the experience was a joy. The relationship continues not out of some need either (for me). If my wife wakes up tomorrow and says she is leaving, that would be her decision. I was single before...and I don't mind being single again (not averse to being single). However, there are many facets to the game of life that could not be played alone.
As long as my wife wants to hang out with me, I will continue to be with her. She has total freedom...I am not attached or possessive. I don't need her to be happy, but there are different joys available with her (as there are different joys available as a single guy).
My wife chose me...but if we did not have enough key commalities, I would not have chosen to spend all my time with her (not anyone will do). As for my choice...what I chose was whether to be single or in a relationship; and neither option was right or wrong...both options were filled with joy.
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Post by enigma on Feb 8, 2011 21:24:04 GMT -5
Good answers here. All I can think to add is that awakening is not a personal awakening but rather the removal of the personal identification. In an odd way, awakening pulls one out of the person rather than endowing the person with some particular qualities. The absence of this identification in the mind will result in some changes, but conditioning in the mind/body, such as preferences and tendencies, was never what one was to begin with and so it doesn't get reworked into some sort of 'enlightened conditioning'. It just goes on doing stuff much the same way it did before, minus some of the most problematic nonsense.
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Post by michaelsees on Feb 8, 2011 22:10:42 GMT -5
Good answers here. All I can think to add is that awakening is not a personal awakening but rather the removal of the personal identification. In an odd way, awakening pulls one out of the person rather than endowing the person with some particular qualities. The absence of this identification in the mind will result in some changes, but conditioning in the mind/body, such as preferences and tendencies, was never what one was to begin with and so it doesn't get reworked into some sort of 'enlightened conditioning'. It just goes on doing stuff much the same way it did before, minus some of the most problematic nonsense. Hmm I might have some problems with this but need to get back later with you . Michael
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Post by enigma on Feb 9, 2011 2:24:43 GMT -5
Well, i have some problems with it too, but it's the best I can do and still get the point across that the person doesn't Awaken, so it can't be expected to act like an Awakened person.
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Post by homealone on Feb 9, 2011 9:39:05 GMT -5
Thank you all for your answers. I am trying to let them speak to me but some confusion still remains.
I guess I feel like there should be a spark and urge to be with someone but there isn't in our relationship--although I do love her. Is it just me projecting what a relationship should be and I should just be happy with the way things are? Dr. Wayne Dyer says that you should be with the one that challenges you the most and thus helps you to see what your state of mind is. I am constantly being challenged with my girlfriend--trying to stay calm as she speaks negatively about most things everyday and gets easily upset over trivial things (like losing at video games/road rage).
Let me please try to restate my initial question hopefully for clarity:
I am wondering if an enlightened person decides who to marry? I know that the right one will come to you and there is no need to search but what if you are with someone whom you aren't sure is right for you? I've had many failed relationships and many I am glad to have not married.
I have been with my girlfriend for 2 1/2 years now and we are at odds often and don't seem to have much in common. We disagree on spirituality, seeking happiness and many other subjects so I often wonder if she is right for me. Then I realize that this is just my ego talking and that I should just be and accept her as she is. So this is where my question comes in.
If one is, enlightened pure love, and accepts everyone totally does that mean that just anyone will do because all should be accepted?
Then why would you make any decision or choice?
Is deciding if there is a connection a judgment call and therefore not acceptance for what is?
And if "wanting" love is being out of touch with our spirit then why do we marry?
I know I don't need anyone/anything to be happy so is wanting a spark a desire that comes from the spirit wanting a stronger connection or is it ego trying to fill a hole of what it thinks it lacks?
Am I still missing the point?
Thank You, Thank You, Thank You!
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Post by michaelsees on Feb 9, 2011 10:10:09 GMT -5
I have been with my girlfriend for 2 1/2 years now and we are at odds often and don't seem to have much in common. We disagree on spirituality, seeking happiness and many other subjects so I often wonder if she is right for me. Well my friend this might pinch a bit but honestly when I read the above quote you wrote I have to ask why are you still with this person. What I see is clear you are dependent and you and her are in a very co-dependent relationship and you are trying to find a way to fix it by some kind of enlightenment theory. Just back up you do not need any enlightenment stuff. You and her as co-dependents imo would do much better going your own ways. Why waste your time and her time in something where you have so little in common with the "good" stuff. Man up would be the words that come to mind. These kinds of relationships rarely end well so I would just leave. Be well with whatever your choice is Michael
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Post by mamza on Feb 9, 2011 12:17:06 GMT -5
Acceptance of what is isn't like seeing something that sucks and being okay with it. It's more like seeing it sucks and not trying to constantly change it into something else.
When someone punches me in the face, I can't change the fact that I got a black eye. What I can do is put ice on it and let it heal.
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Post by zendancer on Feb 9, 2011 13:48:08 GMT -5
Homealone: too much thinking! Your mind is jerking you around. You need to get connected to your core, so take some long walks and just look at the world in silence. Your body knows the answer to whatever questions your mind has formulated. Listen to that "still small voice inside you." Right now there is too much static drowning it out. Forget all the nonsense about what an enlightened person would do, and dive into your own heart. All of the answers are there.
When I met my wife, I was a million miles away from enlightenment. In fact, I was an intellectual nut case, but I fell instantly in love and knew that I wanted to spend all of my time with her. I asked her to marry me on our third date. Thirty-six years later, I still feel the same way. Find somebody who's similarly fun to be with and go have a ball!
You already understand what you must do, but you may have to get very silent for your body-understanding to become obvious. Even the trees know what you must do, so go listen to tree!
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Post by michaelsees on Feb 9, 2011 14:23:27 GMT -5
"I asked her to marry me on our third date."
With no Zen stick in hand now that is amazing(smile)
Michael
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Post by sharon on Feb 9, 2011 14:29:40 GMT -5
"Even the trees know what you must do, so go listen to tree!"
All of nature knows I'm not separate.
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