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Post by figgles on Apr 5, 2017 10:39:32 GMT -5
Bliss as a translation of the word ananda does not mean a heightened rollercoaster ride of a joy injection. It is the peace and equanimity you describe. But it also has an element of indescribable joy which is sometimes in the foreground and sometimes not. That shift from foreground to background to foreground of experience doesn't mean it's conditional. So what's missing is the roller coaster? Permanent indescribable joy?  The joy is permanent in the sense that it is viscerally known to be always, abidingly there, underscoring all of experience, even if it may at times be more in the background vs. the foreground. It bubbles up easily and effortlessly, making itself known in the forefront of experience, often, and when it ebbs, there is no sense of loss that comes with that, as it's not really gone, it's just slipped back into the background for a bit. |
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Post by figgles on Apr 4, 2017 13:55:29 GMT -5
 " stumbled" onto it?? .. more like you went searching for gopals giraffe and came back with a new straw clown.  What you're demonstrating is the propensity of the hypermind to spin in constant motion, and the way that the storm perpetuates itself.  If it were stackflow, I would downvote this answer! This answer deserves many people downvotes! People please join your arm with me to downvote this answer! Double downvote. |
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Post by figgles on Apr 4, 2017 10:07:46 GMT -5
I don't know that an ending is possible and that's what most SR speak implies. Do we just spend the rest of our lives in contentment and gratitude? Living out the rest of our days carrying water and chopping wood? Life is motion, there's all this doing, nothing but doing.....there just may be more to the doing, more than we can imagine. I like what Tano said about clarity. Clarity not only in thought but in every ounce of our being....maybe. I'm not talking CC experience or woo woo anything. Just going deeper as what we are, in motion. Life continues, but the big picture has been seen, so the context is always obvious. Vastness and particularity move as one. Not knowing is primary. Everything dissolves into isness, and words fade in significance. Wow....that is a perfect (and beautiful) description, imo, ZD. |
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Post by figgles on Apr 3, 2017 15:28:52 GMT -5
Yes, but you're talking about cold, rigid, austere zen types who haven't woken up yet! As Ramakrishna said, for the realized, the world becomes a mansion of delights. Call it what you will, the dance of shiva, the play of Lila. It's heart! Note to tano. Mansion of delights doesn't necessarily mean a girlie bar. No; I'm talking about people who have attained SR, but who still seem to be locked into a head-centered way of relating to the world (if there's any heart centeredness, it's not visible or obvious). Yes. The Jed McKenna character of the books in particular fits that bill imo. Outright says, "I don't do heart,".... |
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Post by figgles on Apr 3, 2017 15:25:34 GMT -5
In the past I wasn't sure about this either, but I've since encountered it. Head realization can apparently occur without heart realization. I see it more often in traditions like Zen, which tend to be rather cold, rigid, and austere. Yes, but you're talking about cold, rigid, austere zen types who haven't woken up yet! As Ramakrishna said, for the realized, the world becomes a mansion of delights. Call it what you will, the dance of shiva, the play of Lila. It's heart! Note to tano. Mansion of delights doesn't necessarily mean a girlie bar. |
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Post by figgles on Apr 3, 2017 15:24:14 GMT -5
I would venture you are a head/heart combo. I am head/gut. I don't see how heart can be left out of realization. Exactly. Absent heart, it's incomplete. I've found when heart is not yet awakened, folks tend to overcompensate with head....reasoning out that heart is for sentimental fools only, and thus, not necessary. |
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Post by figgles on Apr 3, 2017 11:51:32 GMT -5
But if you're so sure that I did say it it should be easy to find, right? Don't you want to prove that I said it?  .. 'cause until you do, I can keep pointing out that it's not the truth, only your fantasy.  I rest my case Laughter! I stumbled upon this one, which is almost the same as the gazing lover's eyes bit, incorporates the 'gazing' meme anyway, & perhaps even better in support of what you're saying, as it clearly shows that Laughter believes everything that appear to be 'conscious': |
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Post by figgles on Apr 3, 2017 11:47:57 GMT -5
But being lucid, (as I understand it) means knowing I am dreaming...and If I know I am dreaming, then I also am aware of waking reality as a comparison..... and if Grandma is dead in waking reality, but in dream reality she is sitting before me, then I will therefore notice that difference, right? You will not notice the difference if you are in theta, you might notice if you are in alpha! Logical is off when you are theta, your logical mind will be active only when you come to alpha. Okay...I'll take your word for it....I admit I don't know much at all about alpha, beta, theta mind states. |
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Post by figgles on Apr 3, 2017 11:40:08 GMT -5
So, in theta state, no lucid dreaming? No I did not meant that, you can become lucid, But I said, you can't notice the mistake as you usually notice the mistake in your dream and that would cause you to become Lucid! For an example, you might be talking to your late grandfather that would make you aware that you are dreaming, but If you are in theta, you can't notice this mistake. But being lucid, (as I understand it) means knowing I am dreaming...and If I know I am dreaming, then I also am aware of waking reality as a comparison..... and if Grandma is dead in waking reality, but in dream reality she is sitting before me, then I will therefore notice that difference, right? |
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Post by figgles on Apr 3, 2017 10:14:28 GMT -5
I would say it often is during a lucid dream, and there are even times where it's the instability that alerts me to the fact that I am dreaming. Agreed, but not in a proper dream, those kind of alertness happens if you are in the surface of alpha state, If you are in complete theta those kind of alertness doesn't happen because logical part of mind completely switched off there. So, in theta state, no lucid dreaming? |
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Post by figgles on Apr 2, 2017 16:01:40 GMT -5
In the same way that in your 'awake' experience you cannot directly experience the being of the other to know in that special, directly experiential way that they are in fact perceiving, as they appear to be, you also cannot know for certain about the perceptive ability or lack thereof, of the dream character. Sure, you can observe that you awaken from the dream state to a reality that appears to be much more solid and tangible, where the dream appears to have been nothing more than a playing out of mind issues from that realm, but with regards to bolded, that assertion can't be anything more than a logical surmise. Fact is, you just don't know for certain. Knowledge of the functioning of my own mind is accessible to me. Yes, and no doubt, it does appear (very compelling so) as though those who show up in the sleeping dream experience are the result of individuated mind functioning, and thus, they are just empty figments, absent their own perceptive ability, but just as we cannot know that stuff for absolute certain about the other in waking reality, we also cannot know it about dream reality. |
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Post by figgles on Apr 2, 2017 15:53:15 GMT -5
Well, there are times when I'm lucid dreaming that I can see certain events of people who seem very much to be related to something or someone in waking reality. But, in a non-lucid dream, it all just plays out, absent awareness of waking reality. I am saying instability of the dream is not visible to us when we are in dream. I would say it often is during a lucid dream, and there are even times where it's the instability that alerts me to the fact that I am dreaming. |
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Post by figgles on Apr 2, 2017 15:49:56 GMT -5
There are people in the dream who supposedly are having thoughts. I don't know about their minds, in the same way I don't know about yours. Everybody in your nightly dream is formed in your own mind from memory and imagination. There are no others with their own thoughts. That sure does seem to be the case, but can you actually know that for certain? |
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Post by figgles on Apr 1, 2017 10:45:08 GMT -5
In the same way that in your 'awake' experience you cannot directly experience the being of the other to know in that special, directly experiential way that they are in fact perceiving, as they appear to be, you also cannot know for certain about the perceptive ability or lack thereof, of the dream character. Sure, you can observe that you awaken from the dream state to a reality that appears to be much more solid and tangible, where the dream appears to have been nothing more than a playing out of mind issues from that realm, but with regards to bolded, that assertion can't be anything more than a logical surmise. Fact is, you just don't know for certain. Exactly, thank you for explaining to Enigma! Thank you for helping Enigma to understand! But not when you are in dream.Well, there are times when I'm lucid dreaming that I can see certain events of people who seem very much to be related to something or someone in waking reality. But, in a non-lucid dream, it all just plays out, absent awareness of waking reality. |
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Post by figgles on Apr 1, 2017 10:31:26 GMT -5
There are people in the dream who supposedly are having thoughts. I don't know about their minds, in the same way I don't know about yours. Everybody in your nightly dream is formed in your own mind from memory and imagination. There are no others with their own thoughts. In the same way that in your 'awake' experience you cannot directly experience the being of the other to know in that special, directly experiential way that they are in fact perceiving, as they appear to be, you also cannot know for certain about the perceptive ability or lack thereof, of the dream character. Sure, you can observe that you awaken from the dream state to a reality that appears to be much more solid and tangible, where the dream appears to have been nothing more than a playing out of mind issues from that realm, but with regards to bolded, that assertion can't be anything more than a logical surmise. Fact is, you just don't know for certain. |
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"stumbled" onto it?? .. more like you went searching for gopals giraffe and came back with a new straw clown. 
