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Post by Portto on Jan 3, 2010 9:14:55 GMT -5
Porto: Yes, you are correct. When I said that I wish for things to continue as they are, I meant as they are including the changes that are part of that. I enjoy not knowing what will happen next. I understand what you're saying, and I was sure you included the changes. I'm just surprised how difficult it is to talk about this. Can we say we wish for things to continue as they are, if that includes change? How are things? Seems indescribable using logic, at least to me. On the spiritual-experiences.com site the experience is listed under the title "First Enlightenment Experience." I got it. Thank you! That was quite a mystical experience. Which makes me wonder again what reality is. Probably neither this nor that, or both this and that. Or both previous phrases. Hilarious! |
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alpha
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Post by alpha on Jan 3, 2010 9:15:57 GMT -5
Alpha: What you saw on the road this morning was Me! Isn't that great? And guess who that includes? Oh, that's right. You already understand. LOL Your right ZD, It was Me! "wish fullfilled  . I had some fun during Christmas when I sent your "certificate of awakening" to a friend with unexpected results, heres part of his reply "[Hi Alpha, Thanks for finally Telling me Who IAm after all these years of searching and not finding because of not knowing what I was searching for or who was searching for whatever it was. I once was blind but now I see was lost but now am found. But whether lost or found the search goes on with or without me!]"... Its part of the fun that I get the credit also LOL. |
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Post by zendancer on Jan 3, 2010 12:11:38 GMT -5
Alpha: Yep, that's the funniest part. The entire search takes place in spite of the one who thinks he's searching. As my enlightened friend, Mike Snider, the country music comedian, likes to say, "It's all part of being in show business." In this show we're all playing the part of the clown.
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Post by zendancer on Jan 3, 2010 12:35:31 GMT -5
Porto: The spiritual-experiences.com website has some really interesting stuff. I love the one titled "Enchanted Place," written by a guy in Norway. I'm always telling people that the universe is so much more mysterious than can be imagined, and his story certainly illustrates that. Most people at one time or another have had an experience of non-locality, but the "stable sameness" function of mind (the mind's effort to maintain the illusion of consensual reality) erases the memories of those experiences as time goes by. The experience has to be very strong in order to be retained. In his book "The Crack in the Cosmic Egg," Chilton Pierce recounts an experience from his college days during which he realized that he was impervious to pain. In front of his roommates he stubbed out lighted cigarettes on his face and eyelids, with no pain and no marks on his skin afterwards. Later, none of his roommates remembered the event even though they expressed amazement at the time.
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Post by karen on Jan 3, 2010 17:01:00 GMT -5
So, at the beginning of this New Year, let's raise a glass and drink a toast to the day when Karen will be seen for what she truly is--a cartoon character dreamed up by "what is." Cheers to you and to all the other SomeNothings involved in this extraultrafantabulous game of hide and seek! I'll drink to that! |
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Post by Portto on Jan 4, 2010 13:07:39 GMT -5
Thank you, Zendancer!
I also had a few experiences of altered space/time, but those that I remember are very mild compared to what others mention.
I found someone who mentioned that such spiritual experiences happen every night in deep sleep, but the brain cannot understand and/or memorize them.
I like a lot what you said in another post: that individuality is a heavy burden. Who would've thought that the very thing we thought we were is the heaviest burden of all.... There's a very peaceful place beyond individuality.
But how do "you" deal with close family members when individuality is seen through? The body continues to do its job, of course; however, those close to "you" can become confused and/or scared by perceived freedom from "usual" ideas.
Although these reactions are completely natural, do you always tell the truth about "your point of view?"
Cheers,
Porto
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Post by zendancer on Jan 4, 2010 16:13:00 GMT -5
Porto: Yes, I almost always tell the truth about my understanding, but it usually depends upon who I'm dealing with, what they understand, and whether I think it is necessary or useful to mention it. In most daily interactions and conversations, the issue simply never arises. I operate two office parks with about fifty customers, and I also run a construction company, but only a handful of customers know anything about my spiritual experiences or teachings.
I am quite a clown, and I find ordinary everyday life to be quite funny. When I interact with people, I can see how their thoughts are causing all of their problems, so I feel a lot of compassion for them. Whenever possible, I try to make subtle suggestions concerning how they can have a happier life. Most people don't hear what I'm saying, but occasionally something I say helps a bit.
My wife often gets frustrated that I follow my own agenda regardless of what she or anyone else thinks I should be doing. She views me as somewhat irresponsible (compared to herself). She also gets a bit jealous that I have so much fun. I agree with her about these judgments, so I remind her that life is not fair. LOL. She understands that she has no more choice than I have in what she does (being responsible and working to fulfill other peoples' expectations), but it makes her mad. Double LOL!
I tried to tell my parents about what happened to me in 1984, but it turned out to be a hilarious disaster. Subsequently, I was extremely angry at my parents for about two years, and then the anger went away. I finally accepted that they would probably never be able to understand or accept that my experiences were as deeply spiritual as the experiences they had had within their belief system.
My sister is a hard-core Christian fundamentalist, so we never talk about spirituality. I sent her a copy of my autobiography, but she never mentioned it afterwards. The same sort of thing has happened with many other people. Non-dualistic teachings can be very scary to people who are rigidly attached to conventional belief systems.
My brother is a science reporter for a major television network. He is an agnostic. Because I have no heavy-duty science credentials, he refuses to think that I might know more about reality than people with a Phd in physics. When I try to tell him that electrons do not exist in the way that scientists think, he gets angry and offended. How dare I say that the experts are blind? LOL. Fortunately, he has a good sense of humor and he is able to joke about my love of "The Big Is (his phrase for God based upon my many references to isness)." He's a great guy, but he can't escape the prevailing scientific paradigm, and he recoils at anything that smacks of spirituality.
My mother, at age 94, has loosened up considerably over the years, and one day recently she said, "You should be proud of me; in today's newspaper crossword puzzle I knew what a Zen koan was." That tempted me to talk to her about non-duality, but I decided to wait awhile longer. I don't think she's quite ready, yet. LOL.
I wrote a newspaper column about mystical Christianity for ten years in our local newspaper, but almost no one understood anything I wrote. It was fascinating. I had lots of people tell me how much they enjoyed the columns, but only one or two people knew what I was writing about. People could sense something deep behind the words, but they didn't have enough curiosity to pursue it. As a result of those columns, many people in my hometown think that I am somewhat off-the-wall, and I enjoy a bit of local notoriety.
Most of the time my perspective on life does not become an issue. However, whenever the opportunity arises, I leap for it. I love to teach, and I am always overjoyed when I get invited to speak to a church or university group. I started a church twenty years ago in an effort to get people interested in meditation and non-duality, but only five or ten people stayed interested. We still meet on Sunday mornings, meditate for an hour, and then talk about non-duality, interesting books, and various teachings. As a minister, I get to conduct marriages and funerals, and those are always very cosmic experiences from my viewpoint. I tell people who want me to marry them that I can perform anything from a very traditional wedding to a totally cosmic ceremony, and they always go for the cosmic! Needless to say, this makes the marriages a lot more fun.
My daughter and her fiancee are also interested in non-duality and we often drive to hear well-known teachers, such as Gangaji, Adyashanti, Byron Katie, and others. My wife, who listened to Gangaji and Eckhart Tolle tapes and videos for years, now enjoys Tony Parsons' teachings best of all. She drives around all day listening to a tape of Tony's that provokes endless laughter.
I don't think that my wife would ever leave me because I would be a hard act to follow. Although I can be frustrating to deal with, I like to play as much as she does, so she tries to overlook the things that irritate her. I am also a good ballroom dancer, and that gives me a major appeal apart from everything else. LOL. I am always telling men that they need to learn to dance. Chocolate, flowers, and poetry will only earn them one point, but dancing is worth at least twenty points! Dancing can also be very existential when one becomes one-with the music.
Well, must run. I hope you and all of the others on this board are enjoying the first days of this wonderful New Year. Only go straight, don't know, and save all beings from suffering. Cheers.
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Post by Portto on Jan 4, 2010 18:58:40 GMT -5
Thank you again, ZD.
Indeed, "your life" is very exiting and full of fun. And you get to be a minister on top of that!
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Post by astenny on Jan 8, 2010 13:53:42 GMT -5
There are many things I could wish for, but I agree with others in many ways. If I wished for enlightenment then I would miss out on all the glorious adventures on the way there, and all the wonderful lessons that came with them. I could wish someone a better life, but I have to consider that maybe they need their life to be hard right now in order to further their own spiritual evolution. I know that I am very tempted to wish for warmer weather, but I know that the current bitterly cold weather is part of a larger pattern.
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Post by Portto on Jan 8, 2010 19:26:42 GMT -5
Nice list of "possible" wishes, Astenny!
I noticed that this "spirituality" path can make wishes very difficult to formulate/visualize. I'm guessing that when someone focuses more on the present, wishes become unimportant.
It reminds me of: "I used to be unsure. But now, I don't know."
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Post by Portto on Jan 8, 2010 19:28:44 GMT -5
... and save all beings from suffering. Could that be a wish? Is it possible to save all beings from suffering? That would be nice... |
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Post by zendancer on Jan 8, 2010 22:51:40 GMT -5
Porto: You nailed it. When one lives in the present moment, the future becomes much less interesting. This moment contains everything.
Byron Katie talks about her seemingly matter-of-fact response to other peoples' suffering in her book "A Thousand Faces of Joy," by saying, "It just isn't my time." She is saying, "I'll suffer when it's my time to suffer; right now it's not my time." She is explicating her moment-to-moment sense of total presence.
In the same way, ZM Seung Sahn used to say to his students, "Get enlightened and save all beings from suffering." If we become enlightened, we discover that who we are is "what is," which includes all beings. Everything is seen to be unified in THAT. It's a different way of pointing to the same thing.
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Post by Portto on Jan 9, 2010 17:07:47 GMT -5
Zendancer: Interesting.
A friend of mine told me that not having any "long-term" wishes is as good as being dead.
I had to disagree with him: strong wishes just prevent us from being open to whatever life brings forward.
It is also interesting that we are told by educators/priests that we must hold onto our principles. But this is very funny, since those principles are not ours by any means.
Regarding the Seung Sahn quote, it's very easy to look at it from an individual point of view! Is this a trick of the quote?
The individual point of view would be: an individual becomes enlightened and then walks around saving beings that suffer.
The other interpretation that there's no individual to become enlightened and no individual that has to be saved from suffering. It's the same play/game.
The mind can be very tempted to start arguing whether suffering is imaginary or real, but this is still within the same play.
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Post by skyblue on Jan 9, 2010 17:49:16 GMT -5
Zendancer: just wanted to let you know I enjoyed reading about your awakening. |
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Post by kornjace on Jan 9, 2010 22:01:24 GMT -5
I wish to be Enlightened ;D
I came across this site today and im impressed.
Zendancer I dont remember when I was laughing so much as when I was reading your posts, there are really funny and insightful thoughts and observations.
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