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Post by laughter on Dec 1, 2017 15:14:02 GMT -5
Max: I don’t remember the title, but I’ll find out. 3 things struck me. Harris mentions Gutei’s one finger zen koan, but he doesn’t understand it, nor the basis for it. No one who’ had a deep CC experience could possibly call himself an atheist or an agnostic. He’s also far too involved in the process of becoming and seeking for someone who’s discovered the Absolute. Probably a nice guy, but definitely not free. Read Don Oakley’s book about the 10 obstacles to realization. it’s infinitely clearer, and far more down to earth. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 18:56:43 GMT -5
Max: the Harris book was “Waking Up.” The Oakley book is “Wake Up Now.”"Many people believe that awakening is a path of more: more knowledge, more effort, more dogma, more good deeds, more meditation, more ritual, etc. If you want a lifelong hobby, a nicely polished spiritualized identity, the comfort of certainty, and the companionship of fellow believers, there are plenty of suitable books out there. This is not one of them. However if your intent is to wake up spiritually, then this book might just save you years of looking for enlightenment where it is unlikely to be found. Spiritual awakening can't be avoided forever. By all evidence, it can be avoided for a very long time. However, eventually you will notice what you already are. So the question is not if, but when. This book is intended to hasten "when" by exposing misleading myths and outright fallacies about awakening that have evolved in the West over the last half century. Any one of these myths, if believed, has the power to hijack your whole spiritual search, take you for an unfruitful ride, and leave you stranded far from home. This book will help you see through the Top Ten most common and seductive myths about awakening. There are others, of course, but if you understand the allure of these Top Ten, the pattern will be recognizable and it will be far easier to see through other beliefs clamoring for your attention as the mind tries desperately to remain in charge. As many have pointed out, you cannot become what you already are. Awakening is not something you attain. Awakeness is pre-existing - just waiting with utmost patience for you to notice. It is obscured only by your belief in what is not true. And all beliefs are ultimately found to be lacking. Be foolhardy and dare to step naked into the unknown domain of your own existence leaving yourself grace-prone to awaken." www.amazon.com/Its-Time-Wake-Now-2016-06-17/dp/B01K3JLVPU/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1512172554&sr=8-2&keywords=Oakley+Wake+Up+Now |
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Post by xander17 on Dec 1, 2017 19:30:38 GMT -5
Can't access that clip on me Tablet. A simple 'yes or no' would've been easier to post surely. Like you, I prefer accuracy. Here's the link to that clip: i.imgur.com/day66mk.mp4 I speculate our definitions of 'accuracy' differ greatly. |
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Post by laughter on Dec 1, 2017 19:39:45 GMT -5
Max: the Harris book was “Waking Up.” The Oakley book is “Wake Up Now.”"Many people believe that awakening is a path of more: more knowledge, more effort, more dogma, more good deeds, more meditation, more ritual, etc. If you want a lifelong hobby, a nicely polished spiritualized identity, the comfort of certainty, and the companionship of fellow believers, there are plenty of suitable books out there. This is not one of them. However if your intent is to wake up spiritually, then this book might just save you years of looking for enlightenment where it is unlikely to be found. Spiritual awakening can't be avoided forever. By all evidence, it can be avoided for a very long time. However, eventually you will notice what you already are. So the question is not if, but when. This book is intended to hasten "when" by exposing misleading myths and outright fallacies about awakening that have evolved in the West over the last half century. Any one of these myths, if believed, has the power to hijack your whole spiritual search, take you for an unfruitful ride, and leave you stranded far from home. This book will help you see through the Top Ten most common and seductive myths about awakening. There are others, of course, but if you understand the allure of these Top Ten, the pattern will be recognizable and it will be far easier to see through other beliefs clamoring for your attention as the mind tries desperately to remain in charge. As many have pointed out, you cannot become what you already are. Awakening is not something you attain. Awakeness is pre-existing - just waiting with utmost patience for you to notice. It is obscured only by your belief in what is not true. And all beliefs are ultimately found to be lacking. Be foolhardy and dare to step naked into the unknown domain of your own existence leaving yourself grace-prone to awaken." www.amazon.com/Its-Time-Wake-Now-2016-06-17/dp/B01K3JLVPU/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1512172554&sr=8-2&keywords=Oakley+Wake+Up+NowThanks! That speaks for itself.  Now I gotta' read it, if for nothing else, just to try to find out what he means by the suggestion of inevitability. I'm wondering if he means death.  |
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Post by lolly on Dec 1, 2017 20:10:57 GMT -5
This question is for Max too: if you were to recommend one book or one series of youtube videos what would it be? I like his podcasts. Methinks he broadcasts them as youtube vids as well. Lots there...meditation with Joseph Golstein...free will with Daniel Dennet...perception/consciousness with David Chalmers.... www.samharris.org/podcast/full_archiveYes, I occasionally listen to his podcasts on you tube. He went on a bit of a rant over Donald Trump for a while, so I stopped listening, but he's back now. |
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Post by justlikeyou on Dec 2, 2017 11:08:54 GMT -5
Some forms of that poetry are stark in their simplicity, other's are lyrical, all are beautiful. Sometimes the stark and simple can be found within the lyrical  An example found here. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2017 16:47:32 GMT -5
Max: I don’t remember the title, but I’ll find out. 3 things struck me. Harris mentions Gutei’s one finger zen koan, but he doesn’t understand it, nor the basis for it. No one who’ had a deep CC experience could possibly call himself an atheist or an agnostic. He’s also far too involved in the process of becoming and seeking for someone who’s discovered the Absolute. Probably a nice guy, but definitely not free. Read Don Oakley’s book about the 10 obstacles to realization. it’s infinitely clearer, and far more down to earth. If a respected medium were to open up a communication between him and Christopher Hitchens, it would be interesting to see what happened to his public life after. |
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Post by laughter on Dec 5, 2017 17:00:02 GMT -5
Max: I don’t remember the title, but I’ll find out. 3 things struck me. Harris mentions Gutei’s one finger zen koan, but he doesn’t understand it, nor the basis for it. No one who’ had a deep CC experience could possibly call himself an atheist or an agnostic. He’s also far too involved in the process of becoming and seeking for someone who’s discovered the Absolute. Probably a nice guy, but definitely not free. Read Don Oakley’s book about the 10 obstacles to realization. it’s infinitely clearer, and far more down to earth. If a respected medium were to open up a communication between him and Christopher Hitchens, it would be interesting to see what happened to his public life after. Wow, you think that Sammy's gonna' get anything out of "ow! ow this Lake of Eternal Fire is really really hot!!"  |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2017 19:45:13 GMT -5
If a respected medium were to open up a communication between him and Christopher Hitchens, it would be interesting to see what happened to his public life after. Wow, you think that Sammy's gonna' get anything out of "ow! ow this Lake of Eternal Fire is really really hot!!" You might have enjoyed Mr Hitchens in his day.. |
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Post by laughter on Dec 5, 2017 19:52:06 GMT -5
Wow, you think that Sammy's gonna' get anything out of "ow! ow this Lake of Eternal Fire is really really hot!!" You might have enjoyed Mr Hitchens in his day.. Seriously speaking, I always did, even though I only ever caught him in sound bites. Him, Dawkins, Sam Harris and others like them all represent the perspective that I was educated into and was the most comfortable with for most of my life. Most of what folks like this have to say still makes quite a bit of sense to me and I wouldn't disagree with it. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2017 20:29:08 GMT -5
You might have enjoyed Mr Hitchens in his day.. Seriously speaking, I always did, even though I only ever caught him in sound bites. Him, Dawkins, Sam Harris and others like them all represent the perspective that I was educated into and was the most comfortable with for most of my life. Most of what folks like this have to say still makes quite a bit of sense to me and I wouldn't disagree with it. But, the perspective that the Hitch may still have something of the radical to say to his intellectual brothers is a step too far, right? |
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Post by laughter on Dec 5, 2017 20:34:48 GMT -5
Seriously speaking, I always did, even though I only ever caught him in sound bites. Him, Dawkins, Sam Harris and others like them all represent the perspective that I was educated into and was the most comfortable with for most of my life. Most of what folks like this have to say still makes quite a bit of sense to me and I wouldn't disagree with it. But, the perspective that the Hitch may still have something of the radical to say to his intellectual brothers is a step too far, right? No, not necessarily. What I wrote was completely in jest. There's this sentiment I have that most people with an interest in channeling the dead have an underlying fear of death. I see this very clearly as an artifact of my past conditioning. The exact conditioning I just described to you. |
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Post by lolly on Dec 6, 2017 1:44:31 GMT -5
Hitchins is good value.
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Post by zendancer on Dec 6, 2017 4:23:35 GMT -5
What Hitchins is is what reads these words. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2017 4:37:51 GMT -5
But, the perspective that the Hitch may still have something of the radical to say to his intellectual brothers is a step too far, right? No, not necessarily. What I wrote was completely in jest. There's this sentiment I have that most people with an interest in channeling the dead have an underlying fear of death. I see this very clearly as an artifact of my past conditioning. The exact conditioning I just described to you. Jest it may well have been, though such an image is a 'just' cultural condition, best brought to the surface save the possibility that any remnants of it are still being believed. |
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Now I gotta' read it, if for nothing else, just to try to find out what he means by the suggestion of inevitability. I'm wondering if he means death. 
An example found