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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2015 0:39:44 GMT -5
History is so rife with examples of how the attempt to embody an ideal leads inevitably to the creation of the opposite that you'd think the point wouldn't be so controversial for someone as well read as 'dusty.  Perhaps both of you are reading some emotions into his posts that aren't there. Controversy need not implicate emotion. Peeps can have stone cold debates, although 'dusty does sometimes make his frustration with the dialogs pretty clear. ... other than that seems like you're just breedin' a giraffe herd tonight. |
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Post by silver on Feb 26, 2015 0:48:22 GMT -5
It's normal for any and all to have their own blind spots, many of which are rather common. You can't deny that 'vast heaps' of words are shoveled around with your own brand of hamster cage rage. Ahhh yes the variation on the "what?? game" -- the retreat into generality, a Silver classic.  So the answer to the question of "give you what?" seems to be that your "don't give me that" was referring to something you imagined and that your reference to "blind spots" was a complete non sequitur. The rest is just obvious trollin' hun'. Do you have a Dr.'s visit scheduled soon or somethin'? Oh,my mistake, you're not a simple man. Heh. Y'know, when I say something like that (about blind spots), I had a specific notion flit through my head about it/you, but I forget quickly. I don't know what that says other than I'm forgetful! (*silver snicker*)As I see it, there's no occasion here at any time, to patrolling for 'trolls', since you are every bit as guilty of it as anyone else, according to 'troll/trolling' in your loosely-defined manner. March 3rd - heart doc. mkay? |
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Post by enigma on Feb 26, 2015 1:06:29 GMT -5
As I say, he's very often coming from the perspective of how dangerous it would be for the person to follow any of these ideas. In this case, the map that guides him through his daily routine. History is so rife with examples of how the attempt to embody an ideal leads inevitably to the creation of the opposite that you'd think the point wouldn't be so controversial for someone as well read as 'dusty. Well, maybe that's what he's afraid of. |
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Post by enigma on Feb 26, 2015 1:10:38 GMT -5
History is so rife with examples of how the attempt to embody an ideal leads inevitably to the creation of the opposite that you'd think the point wouldn't be so controversial for someone as well read as 'dusty. Perhaps both of you are reading some emotions into his posts that aren't there. I rarely read any emotion in his posts anymore. He used to get pretty upset with me, but I think he found a way to dismiss me entirely. What emotions do you think we're reading? |
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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2015 2:06:30 GMT -5
Ahhh yes the variation on the "what?? game" -- the retreat into generality, a Silver classic. So the answer to the question of "give you what?" seems to be that your "don't give me that" was referring to something you imagined and that your reference to "blind spots" was a complete non sequitur. The rest is just obvious trollin' hun'. Do you have a Dr.'s visit scheduled soon or somethin'? Oh,my mistake, you're not a simple man. Heh. Y'know, when I say something like that (about blind spots), I had a specific notion flit through my head about it/you, but I forget quickly. I don't know what that says other than I'm forgetful! (*silver snicker*) Right, so your excuse for the snarky comment about blind spots is that you don't remember what you meant. Aces. As I see it, there's no occasion here at any time, to patrolling for 'trolls', since you are every bit as guilty of it as anyone else, according to 'troll/trolling' in your loosely-defined manner. No, I don't resort to senseless and direct personal insult contrived out of thin air for no apparent reason other than to try to gin up a reaction from others, but it's pretty easy to demonstrate from just this last dialog here that you do. What I'll admit to is not always resorting to restraint and instead indulging in reaction that just feeds the monster under the bridge. March 3rd - heart doc. mkay? Uh-huh .. why didn't you just say so up front? You do know that there's a strong correlation between you coming here fishing for drama and your procedure schedule, right? |
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Post by silver on Feb 26, 2015 2:40:43 GMT -5
Perhaps both of you are reading some emotions into his posts that aren't there. I rarely read any emotion in his posts anymore. He used to get pretty upset with me, but I think he found a way to dismiss me entirely. What emotions do you think we're reading? I had no particular emotions in mind when I said that, tbh. |
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Post by silver on Feb 26, 2015 2:48:52 GMT -5
Oh,my mistake, you're not a simple man. Heh. Y'know, when I say something like that (about blind spots), I had a specific notion flit through my head about it/you, but I forget quickly. I don't know what that says other than I'm forgetful! (*silver snicker*) Right, so your excuse for the snarky comment about blind spots is that you don't remember what you meant. Aces. As I see it, there's no occasion here at any time, to patrolling for 'trolls', since you are every bit as guilty of it as anyone else, according to 'troll/trolling' in your loosely-defined manner. other than to try to gin up a reaction from others, but it's pretty easy to demonstrate from just this last dialog here that you do. What I'll admit to is not always resorting to restraint and instead indulging in reaction that just feeds the monster under the bridge. March 3rd - heart doc. mkay? Uh-huh .. why didn't you just say so up front? You do know that there's a strong correlation between you coming here fishing for drama and your procedure schedule, right? Y'know, you'd do well to stop accusing others of the same stuff you're doing - it was pretty funny though, I do forget very easily and I don't go fishing, as you also should be aware of. YOU are the troll under the bridge, duude. "for no apparent reason" - based on your personal individual judgment - which like everybody else, you have been known to make a mistake here and there - you have your areas of personal and intellectual expertise and prowess, but knowing what's going on in someone's mind is NOT one of them. You should give it up for lent - permanently.  No, the doc appt. isn't for any special problem. I suppose I could mention that because of the mindfulness / meditation, things are intense that are coming up, but it doesn't change how I perceive things going on here. It's different and don't want to go into it at the moment, and not that you'd want me to.  |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2015 4:27:51 GMT -5
its challenging to converse with someone who's so argumentative, and with beliefs that are set in stone No, what you're trying say, is that you don't like it when your friends can't support their own beliefs, so you you feel like you need to help them express their dislike for those that don't agree with them/you.. but, when you try to say it, you think it sounds better when create illusions about the messenger to make the messenger appear in a negative perspective.. why don't you address the subject, 'still mind'? doors open as mind becomes quiet |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Feb 26, 2015 9:13:44 GMT -5
I am a rock, I am an island.  ............... oops...  /not................. .................  ................... ....................  PS w/ AG.... S&G What does the PS part mean? Paul Simon. Simon and Garfunkel. Great song. |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Feb 26, 2015 9:24:11 GMT -5
Do you get up at a certain time weekdays and get to work on time? Or does your boss let you wander in as you please and keep your job if you take off when you please, without consequences? What's that got to do with the dialog? Seems like a complete non sequitur to me. What you and E propose is completely divorced from the way ordinary life works. You say, throw out all the maps. But how do you structure your ordinary life? You get up at a certain time, go to work at a certain time. An alarm clock helps you structure your life like a map or a GPS would if you were in a new city. |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Feb 26, 2015 10:24:28 GMT -5
Perhaps both of you are reading some emotions into his posts that aren't there. I rarely read any emotion in his posts anymore. He used to get pretty upset with me, but I think he found a way to dismiss me entirely. What emotions do you think we're reading? I realized you won't read a post longer than three lines so I cut to the chase and drop the superfluous. "You see what you are". What you are is what you see. When a pickpocket sees ________, all he sees are his pockets. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2015 10:32:39 GMT -5
I've heard someone say that present-awareness or howeveryouwannacallit acts as a solvent. This is how I understand ATA as well -- eventually the triggers no longer have their effect. And so self-referential thinking no longer happens. How do you figure that actually works? The same Q arose over here. A lot of BS bubbled up as a result but didn't quit smelling. Solvents work on the principle of 'like dissolves like' (water is a solvent for most things containing water, some form of grease is a good solvent for greases and oils). The observing the observer loop could be brought up right now. Again, all this smells of BS and grease. Perhaps by keeping attention riveted on the witness, the witness disappears. ATA shifts attention from the conceptual to the senses. But actually it's attention on perception and so there is a constant connection to a perceiver, until there isn't. The mechanism for that? Have no clue -- that smells freshest. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2015 10:47:41 GMT -5
That's clearly stated. It's tricky because a hurtful expression can hurt. And so there may be an expression of being hurt. It's seamless -- like a drop falling into water and a resulting small splash. But then the act of hurtfulness is assigned to a bully and the expression of being hurt is assigned to the victim. Secondary designations, but essential to the drama story. And what complicates things beyond that are times when there are preconceptions about bullies being hurtful and victims being hurt. Even the slightest glimmer of a suggestion of a possibility of an interpretation triggers the drama story. food fer thought: notice the resulting splash in the ripple is itself sending out a whole array of other drops... By the nonduality advocate's account, there's no 'you' that can be 'hurt'.. any claim of 'hurt' collapses the nonduality belief structure, revealing a 'you' that can be hurt/hate.. There is no 'hurt', there's information that you want people to think makes you hurt, but it's just information.. you use 'hurt' to manipulate attention away from the information that you don't like, like the contradictions in the nonduality belief system.. 'Ouch' is an expression of hurt. It's not a problem and doesn't imply grand dogmas. 'Ouch' happens (the splash) because of stimuli triggering a pain response (the drop). There's no need to go beyond that. Going beyond that may look like this: there must be a 'you' that can be hurt. There are myriad ways though. Your last paragraph has a tinge of madness to it. King Lear in the gathering storm. |
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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2015 11:14:14 GMT -5
What's that got to do with the dialog? Seems like a complete non sequitur to me. What you and E propose is completely divorced from the way ordinary life works. You say, throw out all the maps. But how do you structure your ordinary life? You get up at a certain time, go to work at a certain time. An alarm clock helps you structure your life like a map or a GPS would if you were in a new city. You don't need to know the theory of how an alarm clock functions in order to use it, and it's not possible to find what you are by using a map. Culture is useful but the cultural self is not only not necessary, but it's like a toxic waste dump. "Ordinary life" for most people involves a false sense of identity premised on a map like the one you refuse to burn. Real ordinary life is not subject to apprehension by any conceptual structure. The best approximations to that apprehension are found in good art, and if it were possible to draw a map on how to be a great artist the world would be a very different place than it is. |
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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2015 11:16:36 GMT -5
Right, so your excuse for the snarky comment about blind spots is that you don't remember what you meant. Aces. No, I don't resort to senseless and direct personal insult contrived out of thin air for no apparent reason other than to try to gin up a reaction from others, but it's pretty easy to demonstrate from just this last dialog here that you do. What I'll admit to is not always resorting to restraint and instead indulging in reaction that just feeds the monster under the bridge. Uh-huh .. why didn't you just say so up front? You do know that there's a strong correlation between you coming here fishing for drama and your procedure schedule, right? Y'know, you'd do well to stop accusing others of the same stuff you're doing - it was pretty funny though, I do forget very easily and I don't go fishing, as you also should be aware of. YOU are the troll under the bridge, duude. "for no apparent reason" - based on your personal individual judgment - which like everybody else, you have been known to make a mistake here and there - you have your areas of personal and intellectual expertise and prowess, but knowing what's going on in someone's mind is NOT one of them. You should give it up for lent - permanently. No, the doc appt. isn't for any special problem. I suppose I could mention that because of the mindfulness / meditation, things are intense that are coming up, but it doesn't change how I perceive things going on here. It's different and don't want to go into it at the moment, and not that you'd want me to. What you're doing here is obviously blowing off some steam. It's a form of self-therapy, and it's incredibly inconsiderate of the others who use this forum. |
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