|
|
Post by sethie on Dec 26, 2013 20:36:38 GMT -5
i notice there are a lot of teachers out there, however the percentage of people who seem to actually experience full enlightenment from them seems to be 1% of 1%…….
Are there any teachers out there who are really waking up a lot of people?
Please, no Neo-advaita teachers… Ramana was quite clear that "there is nothing to do" for a very few ripe souls. The others he said would need to really reflect on the teaching, or make real effort.
peace
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2014 16:00:45 GMT -5
.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2014 19:49:20 GMT -5
Hey Bro. Welcome to the boards. I am new here too.  I suggest sinking your teeth into Ed Muzika's meaty blog: itisnotreal.blogspot.com/ and very extensive site: www.wearesentience.com/ (click redirect if necessary) There are numerous free downloads available. I have learned over the years that casual scanning of any so-called educational material cuts no ice. Only single-minded study of, and wholehearted immersion in, the non-dual wisdom traditions availeth. Unfortunately the vast preponderance of stuff out there (even Ramana's) is flawed/limited, imo. Ed is an adept with over 45 years of very focused experience with various forms of practice, especially inquiry. He freely shares his tremendous wealth of keen insight on these sites w/o running a "Worship-me/I'm-the-Guru" scam or cult. He has deconstructed the teachings of Ramana Maharshi pointing out key errors/limitations. Aside from Ed's criticisms, Ramana and his teachings have been criticized as being "flat" and "life-negative," as has Zen. Btw, I have always felt a strong affinity for Ramana personally and still resort to photos of his bodily human form as a contact point, a conduit for Source. I used to gravitate strongly to that "alpha" (not related to "alpha" v "beta" male terms) disposition of avoiding full participation in relational human life but no longer. In NLP there is a meta-program of "Moving toward v. Moving away from." Being restored to true identification is all about expansion, infinite expansion, which involves the ultimate gesture of ceaselessly "moving toward," embracing, and deeply feelingly contemplating all that is in non-separateness. Becoming caught up in contemplating "The Void or Absolute," which is often prescribed in certain circles as THE best practice misses the mark of gardening ourselves to our fullest humanness, imo. "Full enlightenment/Awakening?" Ahh. Terms casually bandied about, seems to me. Check out "John Heron on Wilber's tangled lines." www.kheper.net/topics/Wilber/tangle.html This brilliant essay really held my feet to the fire and opened my eyes as to what "full enlightenment" is and how very few people are living it or would be interested in it if they really knew what it involved. It cuts through so much muck that passes for true instruction that I fell for in the past. As far as "Which teacher who has woken up a lot of students?" is concerned, I think that kind of thinking, framing it that way, is off base and is just displacing responsibility. Again, truly "Awakened" has very little to do with the package that people are sold in the so-called spiritual marketplace. It is much more about compassionate interpersonal relating. Yes, it also concerns where the practitioner rests attention moment to moment and no teacher is in control of that. Besides, teachers abound, but true adepts seem to be rare and adepts (especially living adepts) more than teachers may serve to "facilitate" or inspire the development of one's "conscious process." Yes? Fwiw, it seems that Siddharameshwar (Guru of Nisargadatta Maharaj) drew more than a few dedicated students/practitioners in whom attention expanded far beyond the limited identification of separate-self. Muzika covers him also. Ed's teaching has gone through phases of what I term "refinement." Now he focuses exclusively on what he calls Radical Devotional Advaita (I prefer the term "Non-dualism" over "Advaita"). I, too, am of this bent and have been for many years which is why I point to it and to Ed's sites as key. The most profound "inquiry" has nothing to do with concentrating on "Who am I." It is radical (from radix, "root," "arising from or going to the root or SOURCE"). The sites treat this subject capably. With respect, your terminology is flabby. Gurdjieff said "For exact understanding exact language is necessary." Very few folks ever bother to sharpen their discriminative faculty sufficiently. It is too challenging or they don't see the need. Instead they satisfy themselves with consoling mush (a.k.a. blappity-blap). The map is not the territory as the hackneyed phrase goes, but traversing this kind of territory is perilous w/o developing and applying penetrating insight that goes far beyond the norm. "In-sight" is ultimately about being restored to Heart-Vision, which is the always-present-moment incarnation of ecstatic love. But what does "real effort" have to do with anything?? "Effort" is the motivated (rather than inspired) application of "force" (rather than actual "power") to "overcome" resistance. Have you ever felt love for someone or something? Did it occur by "real effort?" Please. There is no effort necessary or possible in love which is the purest and, in fact, only effortless "non-practice." There is no "higher" principle of assertion, only allowance, or vibratory alignment and to steady attention in sublimity is the most expanded expression of that. How tough is it to grant attention to what is attractive and distracting, even in the mundane sense, much less the infinite sense? Wet ice on wet ice, methinks. All other "uses" of attention, all "meditative" methodologies fall short of simply " remembering" true identity as infinite radiance, now and now and now and now. Love is the ultimate quickening. What is everything else but a hollow substitute adopted by those who refuse to fall helpless in the heart? They claim to seek "full enlightenment" but don't want love to be the means. As though there was any other way. Who was it that said that the greatest good is truth and the highest truth is love? Oh yeah, the 1% of 1%. All other techniques may fall short for you, but you are not everyone...the method you listed, in that bolded bit, is method #75 of the 5000 year old Vigyan Bhairav Tantra....#75 of 112....there are 112 because each person will have a method that is right for them at that point in their evolution and personality and lifestyle. 75. "Waking, sleeping, dreaming, Know you as light." A slight variant on that one is #72: 72. "Feel the cosmos as a translucent ever-living presence." :-) No one method is right for everyone, no matter how powerful a method is for you...in most cases, you will know you have found the right practice or method for you when it does not seem like a practice or method at all....it will seem like the obvious and natural thing to do, and it will not feel like an effort at all. |
|
|
|
Post by stardustpilgrim on Jan 12, 2014 12:21:58 GMT -5
i notice there are a lot of teachers out there, however the percentage of people who seem to actually experience full enlightenment from them seems to be 1% of 1%……. Are there any teachers out there who are really waking up a lot of people? Please, no Neo-advaita teachers… Ramana was quite clear that "there is nothing to do" for a very few ripe souls. The others he said would need to really reflect on the teaching, or make real effort. peace To find a qualified teacher you have to be a qualified student. You can't be a qualified student without having a qualified teacher, catch-22. How do you find a qualified teacher? What you find will depend upon what you're looking for. If you're not really looking for the truth, how you are structured, how the universe is structured such that one can understand how self and the universe are related such that self, or Self, can know its place in relation to everything. So, it all boils down to the seeker. This boils down to what you wish. Most wants are related to ego. All ego desires are dead ends. Nobody (much) gets enlightened because nobody (much) really wants to get enlightened. There are probably more qualified teachers out there than qualified students (as defined above). Nobody can do the trip for anyone else, even a qualified teacher can't give one the correct motivation, it has to come from within. There is no formula to get from A to B, but there is help from getting from A to B. But most of us don't really want help, most of us don't really want to get to B. Everybody individually has to sort through all the "teaching" out there....to find the help..... It's not up to the teacher as to who gets awakened. As in science, we have to ask the right question to get a correct answer. Ask a wrong question and you can't possibly get a proper answer. Asking the right question gets one to the right help. The majority of the responsibility is on the student. It can't be otherwise. And a real teacher is not going to say....hey....this is what you should be asking..... sdp |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2014 17:05:04 GMT -5
i notice there are a lot of teachers out there, however the percentage of people who seem to actually experience full enlightenment from them seems to be 1% of 1%……. Are there any teachers out there who are really waking up a lot of people? Please, no Neo-advaita teachers… Ramana was quite clear that "there is nothing to do" for a very few ripe souls. The others he said would need to really reflect on the teaching, or make real effort. peace Why do you assume you are not ripe? |
|
|
|
Post by silence on Jan 14, 2014 17:53:08 GMT -5
i notice there are a lot of teachers out there, however the percentage of people who seem to actually experience full enlightenment from them seems to be 1% of 1%……. Are there any teachers out there who are really waking up a lot of people? Please, no Neo-advaita teachers… Ramana was quite clear that "there is nothing to do" for a very few ripe souls. The others he said would need to really reflect on the teaching, or make real effort. peace Nobody is waking anyone up any more than you can teach someone how to wake up in the morning or go to sleep at night. |
|
|
|
Post by duderino on Jan 18, 2014 14:10:11 GMT -5
i notice there are a lot of teachers out there, however the percentage of people who seem to actually experience full enlightenment from them seems to be 1% of 1%……. Are there any teachers out there who are really waking up a lot of people? Please, no Neo-advaita teachers… Ramana was quite clear that "there is nothing to do" for a very few ripe souls. The others he said would need to really reflect on the teaching, or make real effort. peace Seems many of the spiritual teachings out there are just designed to keep the ego at the forefront and keep you chugging down the path, but there are a lot of good pointers too. I think lots of people are waking up from the more direct teachings, which are easy to spot, they are like big signs that say slow down and check out what's already here. Usually the more direct teachers like Mooji and Gangaji are pointing to same thing, they just have different ways of expressing. Ultimately it comes down to the student, what teacher they groove with and whether or not they really want to get off the path.  |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2014 7:37:38 GMT -5
sri aurobindo and the mother had about fifteen ´´disciples´´, they all reached enlightenment and some far beyond that, some wrote extensively about it. Totally convincing.Unlike any other yoga path. after 1940, they opened the door of the ashram to hundreds of followers, many of whom reached enlightenment. i was cured from severe schizofrenia (1978)by a mere touch, by a student of The Mother, Sri Aurobindo´s spiritual companion, she had the same realisations as he did. This healer was western man, with whom i have had some amazing experiences in my life.He did not want to be a ´´guru´´.Best thing that ever happened to me. Aurobindo is not into advaita, he says we need to realise all possible states of consciousness simultanuously,Nirvana being ´´not indispensible´´but at best a stage on the path upward.(i call it ´´base camp´´)I know nirvana, and am not attached to it as many advaitists here seem to be. a very good introduction to his own work is ´´essays on the gita´´, his easiest to read book, or for an overview , read ´´the adventure of consciousness'' by satprem, also free download on the same site.That is the book that got all these westerners to auroville.Great clarity, and profound insights and knowledge and how to live daily life --´´active meditation, active sleep,etc etc.´´..they embrace the whole of existence instead of discarding it as an illusion.Powerful stuff. ´´lights on yoga´´ is a free download of letters to his students. www.auro-ebooks.com/lights-on-yoga/Sample THE GOAL The way of Yoga followed here has a different purpose from others, – for its aim is not only to rise out of the ordinary ignorant world-consciousness into the divine consciousness, but to bring the supramental power of that divine consciousness down into the ignorance of mind, life and body, to transform them, to manifest the Divine here and create a divine life in Matter. This is an exceedingly difficult aim and difficult Yoga; to many or most it will seem impossible. All the established forces of the ordinary ignorant world-consciousness are opposed to it and deny it and try to prevent it, and the Sadhak will find his own mind, life and body full of the most obstinate impediments to its realisation. If you can accept the ideal whole-heartedly, face all the difficulties, leave the past and its ties behind you and are ready to give up everything and risk everything for this divine possibility, then only can you hope to discover by experience the Truth behind it. The Sadhana of this Yoga does not proceed through any set mental teaching or prescribed forms of meditation, mantras or others, but by aspiration, by a self-concentration inwards or upwards, by self-opening to an Influence, to the Divine Power above us and its workings, to the Divine Presence in the heart and by the rejection of all that is foreign to these things. It is only by faith, aspiration and surrender that this self-opening can come. * The only creation for which there is any place here is the supramental, the bringing of the divine Truth down on the earth, not only into the mind and vital but into the body and into Matter. Our object is not to remove all “limitations” on the expansion of the ego or to give a free field and make unlimited room for the fulfilment of the ideas of the human mind or the desires of the ego-centred life-force. None of us are here to “do as we like”, or to create a world in which we shall at last be able to do as we like; we are here to do what the Divine wills and to create a world in which the Divine Will can manifest its truth no longer deformed by human ignorance or perverted and mistranslated by vital desire. The work which the Sadhak of the supramental Yoga has to do is not his own work for which he can lay down his own conditions, but the work of the Divine which he has to do according to the conditions laid down by the Divine. Our Yoga is not for our own sake but for the sake of the Divine. It is not our own personal manifestation that we are to seek, the manifestation of the individual ego freed from all bounds and from all bonds, but the manifestation of the Divine. Of that manifestation our own spiritual liberation, perfection, fullness is to be a result and a part, but not in any egoistic sense or for any ego-centred or self-seeking purpose. This liberation, perfection, fullness too must not be pursued for our own sake, but for the sake of the Divine. |
|
|
|
Post by Shawn on Feb 6, 2014 17:20:17 GMT -5
It's a great question. The short answer is,"no."
John Wren-Lewis made this very point, and was encouraging the exchange of information on teachers and systems to see if there were any best practices. From what I know, he didn't have any luck in that quest.
If there was anyone who truly had the "goods" and could somehow pass it on to others, the world would be beating a path to their door.
As SDP says, part of the problem, is that a lot of people don't really want to be woken up. They want what they _think_ it means to be woken up. Far more people want affirmation of their beliefs rather than intimations of the truth.
The whole point of spiritualteachers.org was to help people jumpstart their search. Not to provide an exhaustive list, but a few good ones. Grab on to one, and begin; that's better than mulling over which is the best one.
|
|
|
|
Post by psychoslice on Feb 6, 2014 17:59:45 GMT -5
A true teacher already realizes that all are already there, they realize that no one awakens, there is no one to awake, for the simple reason that we are not the mind body, the mind tells us we are separate, even if we carry this illusion to the grave it matters not, at what we call death we are who we always were, pure Source or consciousness.
|
|
Molly
New Member
Really interested in the "I AM" and how to manifest...
Posts: 4 
|
Post by Molly on Mar 31, 2014 10:02:31 GMT -5
When he student is ready ~ the Master is there
|
|
|
|
Post by vedanta on Jun 3, 2014 17:40:08 GMT -5
No one can ascertain the count. However, one should go by the caliber of how many so called enlightened masters have come into being from a particular teacher. In that case, Ramana Maharishi is above all. His disciples (or disciple's disciples) who are considered enlightened are:
Papaji
Mooji
Ramesh Balsekar
Robert Adams
|
|
|
|
Post by vedanta on Jun 3, 2014 17:41:01 GMT -5
Though, there are many unknown teachers who are enlightened and have produced many enlightened masters. One in the current era is, Swami YugPurush Paramanand
|
|
|
|
Post by alreadythat on Apr 12, 2015 9:03:44 GMT -5
About time when you posted this it started happening here - body mind idea melting away. Iwas never a seeker but went to a psychologist due to psychological health, being overworked. They mentioned mindfulness. I asked about Tolle books. They confirmed. Needed help desperately. 3 years into Tolle reading, certain things improved but anxiety attacks & fear continued. Remember, never liked a word spiritual here. It freaked me out. Tolle looked Westerner & 'normal'. Someone mentioned Non duality meetings with Sailor Bob Adamson. Took me a year and a half to finally see him once a week for 3 months. I was very open to his spiel. He said that no one else can do it for you,investigate, you are the light. He was only pointing to it but wasn't teaching it. My fears, depression & anxieties disappeared. My blood pressure that was in high 100s for years never went above 130 since. Sailor Bob helped where doctors couldn' t. I saw many getting the same results from Bob' s pointing. You must be open to it. Bob says ' what you seek you already are'. Listen with being, not with mind & you will see that you won' t need hundred lives. This form here is on auto pilot now. It is all spontaneous living.How long is the distance from your own being? Please don' t trust 'gurus'. They stuff you around for your money. Good luck!
|
|
|
|
Post by jay17 on Apr 12, 2015 14:59:44 GMT -5
i notice there are a lot of teachers out there, however the percentage of people who seem to actually experience full enlightenment from them seems to be 1% of 1%……. Where or what is the yard stick, who is the authority figure, who is the possessor of absolute truth regarding Enlightenment to be able to absolutely determine when a person has obtained 100% Enlightenment? Are there any teachers out there who are really waking up a lot of people? "It is you who must make the effort. The masters only point the way." - Buddha "By your own efforts waken yourself, watch yourself, and live joyfully. You are the master." - Buddha |
|
