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Post by thistoo on Jul 18, 2009 18:58:02 GMT -5
I've heard it said that only one in a million seek Self realization, and perhaps one in a million of them become It.
What advice, I wonder, might the Self-realized offer to the masses? Are there any tidbits of wisdom they could share that might perhaps ease suffering and bring some measure of peace for the remaining 999,999?
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Post by lightmystic on Jul 18, 2009 21:53:54 GMT -5
People insist that their beliefs are real, that they are not cosmic, and that there is no way out of their suffering. What advice can one offer to such people? Those who realize it does not have to be that way are called seekers. Those seekers that are serious about going through what it takes to get to Enlightenment find it. The others do not really care to find it unless it's convenient for them. And the process to Enlightenment is many things, but it's anything but convenient. It's perhaps convenient the way torture is convenient.
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fear
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Post by fear on Jul 21, 2009 17:42:30 GMT -5
I'm not "self realized" as you put it but I can share what statements I've gathered over the last couple years that rattled my cage.
And by the way none of it is advice, just statements that make you think.
1. All your questions are born out of the answers you already have.
2.You do not want to be enlightened.
3.You have never seen anything, you see things as you want them to be, not as they are.
4.You have never experienced true love. There is nothing to gain in true love. The love we experience makes us feel good. If it didn't feel good we wouldn't call it love. True love is like a tree giving shade. It gives as much shade to the evil person as it does to the good person.
If you find youself disagreeing with these statements then they are serving their purpose.
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Post by astenny on Jul 23, 2009 7:22:27 GMT -5
I'm sure many have, but most they speak to are not ready for what they have to teach.
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Post by thistoo on Jul 25, 2009 16:54:39 GMT -5
...the process to Enlightenment is many things, but it's anything but convenient. You do not want to be enlightened. Indeed. I've gathered that it is a steep climb with longer odds than being struck by lightning. From the perspective of the wanderer, though, reading about non-duality puts, for example, the Golden Rule into a whole new light. Acceptance of what is seems easier; death appears less threatening. |
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Post by lightmystic on Jul 26, 2009 10:32:39 GMT -5
I appreciate your perspective. You also have to realize that the fact that you even recognize that there is Enlightenment increases your chances a lot. The fact that you seem to recognize, at LEAST on some level, what it actually is increases your chances a LOT. The fact that you are coming with openness and not the need to cling to ideas about "how it works" increases your chances a LOT. Frankly, I don't see Enlightenment as something that's necessarily unlikely for you - you're definitely at least in the ballpark in terms of what it takes. The only thing that's really needed on top of that is a fervent desire. If you don't have it, but really wished that you did strongly, then chances are it will come very soon. If you have that intense desire, then it's already too late - it's coming for you.  As long as there is that desire and an openness to what it is being unknown - but ringing true in your soul....your deepest levels....then it is only a matter of when, and no longer a matter of if.... There are no rules for how it happens to any individual person, but many people find it to be an uncomfortable process - if you would rather go through the next discomfort than remain in the boundaries you are in now - then that is a good sign. Of course, it's not about being hard on ourselves. Far from it, but it's a gentleness mixed with that willingness and that passion. Does that make sense? Indeed. I've gathered that it is a steep climb with longer odds than being struck by lightning. From the perspective of the wanderer, though, reading about non-duality puts, for example, the Golden Rule into a whole new light. Acceptance of what is seems easier; death appears less threatening. |
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Post by thistoo on Jul 27, 2009 1:26:31 GMT -5
...If you have that intense desire, then it's already too late - it's coming for you. Eerie that you said that like that. I've reached a stage where I almost feel like, maybe, there's no turning back, even if I was convinced it was pointless. Too many little pieces of the ego-centric puzzle have been recognized for what they are and jettisoned. Once they're gone, it seems you can't put 'em back. Trouble is, I've also recognized that what's led me here is largely just a desire to feel better. Not sure if Enlightenment is the answer--maybe I just need a good psychologist. ;D There are no rules for how it happens to any individual person, but many people find it to be an uncomfortable process - if you would rather go through the next discomfort than remain in the boundaries you are in now - then that is a good sign. Of course, it's not about being hard on ourselves. Far from it, but it's a gentleness mixed with that willingness and that passion. Does that make sense? It makes perfect sense, actually. Recognized for what they are, I've let go of a lot of other things that were all about making myself feel better, and discomfort has definitely settled in. I can't say that I feel any intense passion lately, though. There just doesn't seem to be another direction to go... |
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Post by lightmystic on Jul 27, 2009 10:57:32 GMT -5
In my experience, there are a lot of things that just would never have been let go if it didn't hurt too much not to. One cannot want what looks like annihilation, so it has to either happen by accident or it has to be so confining that one is willing to do anything to get out of it and not feel confined. Usually it's a combination of both. Regardless of what people say, no one looks for Enlightenment except to feel better. The only reason that people say they don't care about anything except the truth is because they know that's the only thing that will make them feel better, even if the truth is ugly or uncomfortable at first.... Something to think about...I'm afraid you are on the right track. ...If you have that intense desire, then it's already too late - it's coming for you. Eerie that you said that like that. I've reached a stage where I almost feel like, maybe, there's no turning back, even if I was convinced it was pointless. Too many little pieces of the ego-centric puzzle have been recognized for what they are and jettisoned. Once they're gone, it seems you can't put 'em back. Trouble is, I've also recognized that what's led me here is largely just a desire to feel better. Not sure if Enlightenment is the answer--maybe I just need a good psychologist. ;D There are no rules for how it happens to any individual person, but many people find it to be an uncomfortable process - if you would rather go through the next discomfort than remain in the boundaries you are in now - then that is a good sign. Of course, it's not about being hard on ourselves. Far from it, but it's a gentleness mixed with that willingness and that passion. Does that make sense? It makes perfect sense, actually. Recognized for what they are, I've let go of a lot of other things that were all about making myself feel better, and discomfort has definitely settled in. I can't say that I feel any intense passion lately, though. There just doesn't seem to be another direction to go... |
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Post by souley on Jul 27, 2009 14:46:36 GMT -5
Eerie that you said that like that. I've reached a stage where I almost feel like, maybe, there's no turning back, even if I was convinced it was pointless. Too many little pieces of the ego-centric puzzle have been recognized for what they are and jettisoned. Once they're gone, it seems you can't put 'em back. Yeap, can definitely relate to that.. For me the passion is not just the romantic kind of passion, like a flame burning in your heart or something. It can be more like, being utterly sick of don't knowing. It may also be seen in retrospect, that like "oops seems everything i've been doing lately has been heading in this direction". |
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fear
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Post by fear on Jul 27, 2009 16:48:02 GMT -5
I definitely agree that there's no turning back because even if we put it on hold and enjoy our appetites for a while, there has to come a time when we suffer a little or are humbled and we come right back to an inward way of thinking and a desire that we want to be free.
But what happens if we do not reach enlightenment in our lifetime. I wonder if the search will continue in the afterlife if there is such a thing.
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Post by thistoo on Jul 28, 2009 2:28:15 GMT -5
Something to think about...I'm afraid you are on the right track. I'm afraid you might be right (hehe), although usually it doesn't seem like a track at all; more like stumbling in the dark. But then... It may also be seen in retrospect, that like "oops seems everything i've been doing lately has been heading in this direction". Couldn't have said it better myself. Seems like one's "teachers" aren't recognized as such until they're in the rear view mirror. Regardless of what people say, no one looks for Enlightenment except to feel better. Good to know. Thanks for all your great perspectives. |
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Post by lightmystic on Jul 28, 2009 9:54:35 GMT -5
Yes, and that stumbling in the dark is a further comfirmation. That IS path! It's really the people who know exactly how their path is going to look in the future that are sidetracked, as those who are really moving forward have no idea what the next thing is until the knowledge/experience comes.... Something to think about...I'm afraid you are on the right track. I'm afraid you might be right (hehe), although usually it doesn't seem like a track at all; more like stumbling in the dark. But then... Couldn't have said it better myself. Seems like one's "teachers" aren't recognized as such until they're in the rear view mirror. Regardless of what people say, no one looks for Enlightenment except to feel better. Good to know. Thanks for all your great perspectives. |
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As long as there is that desire and an openness to what it is being unknown - but ringing true in your soul....your deepest levels....then it is only a matter of when, and no longer a matter of if....