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Post by andrew on Feb 22, 2012 17:31:16 GMT -5
Except, as I said, there are occasions when I do look at a specific projection, if that seems like the most intelligent and appropriate thing to do. Why would unconscious mind ever see that as an intelligent appropriate thing to do unless it was just a game of pretending to look? Why are you separating the mind from the body? To me the bodymind is one system. The intelligence of the system may mean looking at a projection or it may not. These days, there isnt much movement to. |
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Post by andrew on Feb 22, 2012 17:31:58 GMT -5
Except you are arguing with me here (and projecting a heap) and therefore there is an intellectual spiritual ego war going on that we are both participants of. I'm on a forum having a conversation. The rest is your imagination. You are still arguing. |
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Post by enigma on Feb 22, 2012 17:32:05 GMT -5
It IS actually the point. One that you seem incredibly reluctant to go anywhere near. It would mean that your imagination doesn't have as much (or any) authority as you think it does. The fact that you see yourself in a war and suffering has absolutely no bearing on my experience. Except you are arguing with me here (and projecting a heap) and therefore there is an intellectual spiritual ego war going on that we are both participants of. Only because you see all disagreement here as 'spiritual ego war' and projection. Sounds like a recipe for suffering. |
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Post by andrew on Feb 22, 2012 17:33:18 GMT -5
But trusting the intelligence of the whole bodymind system is. But then I am not really interested in 'being conscious', because that requires 'one' to be conscious. And so we've made the idea of becoming conscious meaningless too, so you never have to do that. I am not interested in becoming conscious, no. I did that already and got over it. |
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Post by enigma on Feb 22, 2012 17:36:24 GMT -5
Projection is unconscious, and requires self deception. Your idea that everyone is unconscious is a projection. Has it escaped your notice that you are projecting a hell of a lot? Yes, projection is unconscious by definition but as humans we project. In a subtle way, every time we speak we project. What does that tell you about what it means to be human? Humans ARE unconscious. Every time I say...'I am Andrew, or I am a man, or I am awareness' I am experiencing unconsciousness. To experience an I-thought is to be unconscious. So we can add 'unconscious' to the list of meaningless terms since everyone is unconscious. There's a definite pattern here of dismissing all ideas that could threaten your illusions. |
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Post by andrew on Feb 22, 2012 17:36:38 GMT -5
Except you are arguing with me here (and projecting a heap) and therefore there is an intellectual spiritual ego war going on that we are both participants of. Only because you see all disagreement here as 'spiritual ego war' and projection. Sounds like a recipe for suffering. When people come on threads solely to point out the ego involved, they are not wrong. The need to point it out is also ego, but thats by the by. There may be peace in this, but there is also ego. This is suffering. To say that this conversation is an experience of perfect harmony for either of us is lacking integrity in my opinion. |
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Post by Portto on Feb 22, 2012 17:36:57 GMT -5
Andrew: The main issue seems to be that you see souls exposed to suffering everywhere, in every creature and device. When in fact, there is only one soul.
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Post by silence on Feb 22, 2012 17:38:03 GMT -5
But trusting the intelligence of the whole bodymind system is. But then I am not really interested in 'being conscious', because that requires 'one' to be conscious. Haven't you argued that oneness and duality are just viewpoints we can choose to look from? Isn't what you're doing here just a rationalization to use oneness to not have to deal with all of the stuff going on with Andrew? |
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Post by andrew on Feb 22, 2012 17:39:16 GMT -5
Has it escaped your notice that you are projecting a hell of a lot? Yes, projection is unconscious by definition but as humans we project. In a subtle way, every time we speak we project. What does that tell you about what it means to be human? Humans ARE unconscious. Every time I say...'I am Andrew, or I am a man, or I am awareness' I am experiencing unconsciousness. To experience an I-thought is to be unconscious. So we can add 'unconscious' to the list of meaningless terms since everyone is unconscious. There's a definite pattern here of dismissing all ideas that could threaten your illusions. What I have made clear many times is that oneness/unity/peace can be dominant in our experience, and unconsciousness, projection, objectification, ego, separation can be secondary. I am at peace while having this conversation but there is also projection, objectification, unconsciousness, ego and suffering happening. |
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Post by andrew on Feb 22, 2012 17:40:00 GMT -5
Andrew: The main issue seems to be that you see souls exposed to suffering everywhere, in every creature and device. When in fact, there is only one soul. I dont see it in every creature. Creatures on this earth, yes. There is one soul and many souls. Its a dichotomy. |
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Post by silence on Feb 22, 2012 17:43:33 GMT -5
I'm on a forum having a conversation. The rest is your imagination. You are still arguing. Having a discussion is automatically arguing? Should we all be agreeing with each other all day? |
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Post by enigma on Feb 22, 2012 17:46:56 GMT -5
You imply that I would/should feel guilty about eating a stake tonight, and yet you say it's ridiculous to suggest that you would feel that way. You're getting sleepier by the moment, Andrew. Well, you know what, these days, if I ate meat - if I COULD eat meat - then I might feel guilty because I am far more connected and sensitive than I used to be. If I hit someone I might feel guilty about that too! In the old days, there was no sense of guilt, there was just a sense of physically not being able to swallow. As we become more enlightened, we become more sensitive. In a sense there is a raising of standards. There is a violence to eating meat that just does not sit well with me. So yes, maybe it would be healthy if you DID feel a bit guilty. Enjoy your steak. Enjoy your 'enlightenment'. ;D |
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Post by silence on Feb 22, 2012 17:47:38 GMT -5
And so we've made the idea of becoming conscious meaningless too, so you never have to do that. I am not interested in becoming conscious, no. I did that already and got over it. What does this mean and how do you reconcile this statement with "But then I am not really interested in 'being conscious', because that requires 'one' to be conscious." |
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Post by enigma on Feb 22, 2012 17:51:13 GMT -5
Why would unconscious mind ever see that as an intelligent appropriate thing to do unless it was just a game of pretending to look? Why are you separating the mind from the body? To me the bodymind is one system. The intelligence of the system may mean looking at a projection or it may not. These days, there isnt much movement to. I'm not separating them. In most mind/bodies, the intelligence is distorted by some serious ignorance. Giving into that ignorance by formulating a 'world view' that holds it in place is more ignorance and not an intelligent thing to do. |
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Post by silence on Feb 22, 2012 17:54:40 GMT -5
Sounds reasonable ;D. The vampire thing didn't really catch so now the playing field must be 'evened' with asserting how more evolved or moral or aligned with truth being a vegetarian is. Do you eat meat? Yes. |
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