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Post by dwbh1953 on Jan 14, 2009 0:24:20 GMT -5
This link brings you to Stephen Wingates website audio section of his talks. For anyone that wants a good glimpse of what this NonDuality is that we talk about or try to talk about. Who we are, what the mind really is etc etc I highly suggest you listen to a few of his talks. livinginpeace-thenaturalstate.com/correspondence.htmEnjoy Randyji |
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Post by The Uncreated on Jan 16, 2009 11:45:30 GMT -5
Interesting. In my experience, Franklin Merrell-Wolff to date has offered the deepest look into the state of nothingness, a state which he terms the High Indifference.Wolff's books are not for everyone because his writing is highly abstract and technical, but as far I'm able to determine of him where my own development is concerned, his understanding is quite deep. Unfathomably so. I get a strong feeling that this man serves as an authentic gateway into the Void. I'd recommend his main work, Experience and Philosophy, which is a compilation of two of his previous books, but to understand his basic messsage you have to have walked pretty far along the path. Wolff was a mathematician by profession, so if you have a scientific or logical bent and are partial to the jnana means of working toward liberation, Wolff provides you with explanations you'll find fascinating. Uncreated |
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Post by lightmystic on Jan 16, 2009 12:34:21 GMT -5
Hmm...Interesting. What does indifference have to do with Nothingness? Interesting. In my experience, Franklin Merrell-Wolff to date has offered the deepest look into the state of nothingness, a state which he terms the High Indifference.Wolff's books are not for everyone because his writing is highly abstract and technical, but as far I'm able to determine of him where my own development is concerned, his understanding is quite deep. Unfathomably so. I get a strong feeling that this man serves as an authentic gateway into the Void. I'd recommend his main work, Experience and Philosophy, which is a compilation of two of his previous books, but to understand his basic messsage you have to have walked pretty far along the path. Wolff was a mathematician by profession, so if you have a scientific or logical bent and are partial to the jnana means of working toward liberation, Wolff provides you with explanations you'll find fascinating. Uncreated |
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Post by dwbh1953 on Jan 16, 2009 12:43:04 GMT -5
Interesting. In my experience, Franklin Merrell-Wolff to date has offered the deepest look into the state of nothingness, a state which he terms the High Indifference.Wolff's books are not for everyone because his writing is highly abstract and technical, but as far I'm able to determine of him where my own development is concerned, his understanding is quite deep. Unfathomably so. I get a strong feeling that this man serves as an authentic gateway into the Void. I'd recommend his main work, Experience and Philosophy, which is a compilation of two of his previous books, but to understand his basic messsage you have to have walked pretty far along the path. Wolff was a mathematician by profession, so if you have a scientific or logical bent and are partial to the jnana means of working toward liberation, Wolff provides you with explanations you'll find fascinating. Uncreated Yes I am familar with his work Do you know Joel Morwood? He was a student of FMW.His style is not for me. Liberation, Enlightenment or wgatever you wish to call it is not at all complex. It has noting to do with needing a refined mind or even a quick mind to grasp and awaken to the truth. FMW is a old timer sort of mystic from what little I know of him. But thank you for sharing his info with me. Here is one for you which is around the same time era as FMW. His name was Sunyata and someone wrote a book about his life story called Dancing in the Void a great read if you can find it. I love this guy when he met RM in India RM gave him the name Sunyata which means a rare born mystic. Sunyata lived well into his 90s where he died in Marin county California. He was quite a charater he use to wear a big button pin that said Mr. NoBody! Have a nice day Randyji |
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Post by The Uncreated on Jan 16, 2009 13:28:00 GMT -5
What does indifference have to do with Nothingness? Probably everything. Wolff coined the term while supposedly anchored in that nothingness, so if anything, it's what Nothingness calls itself -- a name that automatically sprung forth from the void, uncaused, to serve as one of the many clues pointing the way back toward the nondual state. |
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Post by The Uncreated on Jan 16, 2009 13:53:35 GMT -5
It has noting to do with needing a refined mind or even a quick mind to grasp and awaken to the truth. |
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Post by dwbh1953 on Jan 16, 2009 14:27:04 GMT -5
It has noting to do with needing a refined mind or even a quick mind to grasp and awaken to the truth. Hi, Well In the book is written the story of Sunyata meeting RM and RM told him he was a rare born mystic but it is very possible I got something confused as far as the name goes. what Wolf was speaking about is the way of the Janni in India a sect that belives you can reach enlightement through the intellect only. This is a huge trap for folks that may be a little smarter than the rest. The reason is they can think there way into feeling they are awake when actually no shift has happen. From my experience intelligence has little if nothing to do with waking up. It is a real energtic shift that happens but not of the mind and for me even to speak about it in these terms leaves me wide open for being missunderstood. It is true you do see a certain group of almost cocky, critical folks that talk about enlightenment using big words etc. I would say that group probably has the least % of people that have actually woke up from the dream. However they will never admit this because they think it is about fitting all the pieces of a puzzle and when done then they have arrived. The only thing they have arrived at for most of them is showing they know how to work a puzzle! Cheers Randyji |
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Post by lightmystic on Jan 16, 2009 14:41:19 GMT -5
It's one of many many things the Nothingness calls itself. See Creation? That is included in what Nothingness calls itself. I certainly relate to indifference, and that never goes away on some fundamental level, but it's also missing a large part if it's said that that is the only direction Nothingness is. Nothingness isn't something limited... What does indifference have to do with Nothingness? Probably everything. Wolff coined the term while supposedly anchored in that nothingness, so if anything, it's what Nothingness calls itself -- a name that automatically sprung forth from the void, uncaused, to serve as one of the many clues pointing the way back toward the nondual state. |
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Post by The Uncreated on Jan 16, 2009 14:46:41 GMT -5
what Wolf was speaking about is the way of the Janni in India a sect that belives you can reach enlightement through the intellect only. No gnani would ever suggest one could reach enlightenment through the intellect only (jnana), but being one of the three main branches of yoga, it is established that straining logic to its breaking point is in fact a method of transcending the intellect. I've but one name to mention to demonstrate the fact -- the most accomplished dialectician of all time, Nagarjuna, pretty much the ground zero of the Middle Way. The zen koan is pure and utter jnana -- the path of knowledge cannot and should not be discounted. Through knowledge it's possible to arrive at the Ultimate Ignorance, and I use the term to describe enlightenment because that's chiefly what it is about -- not knowing. Jnana is the basis by which man negates those things which are not he, to arrive at the non-dual reality. It's quite a simple philosophy really, and has little to do with thinking one's way to enlightenment. Uncreated |
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Post by dwbh1953 on Jan 16, 2009 15:08:02 GMT -5
what Wolf was speaking about is the way of the Janni in India a sect that belives you can reach enlightement through the intellect only. No gnani would ever suggest one could reach enlightenment through the intellect only (jnana), but being one of the three main branches of yoga, it is established that straining logic to its breaking point is in fact a method of transcending the intellect. I've but one name to mention to demonstrate the fact -- the most accomplished dialectician of all time, Nagarjuna, pretty much the ground zero of the Middle Way. The zen koan is pure and utter jnana -- the path of knowledge cannot and should not be discounted. Through knowledge it's possible to arrive at the Ultimate Ignorance, and I use the term to describe enlightenment because that's chiefly what it is about -- not knowing. Jnana is the basis by which man negates those things which are not he, to arrive at the non-dual reality. It's quite a simple philosophy really, and has little to do with thinking one's way to enlightenment. Uncreated I do not see it that way at all. You cannot arrive to the Oneness or enlightenment by use of techniques of the mind. It is just not possible. As a matter of fact it almost its true opposite. The mind and the techniques only re enforce that there is somewhere to get to and something to gain. You cannot gain something that you already have can you? You are that which you seek . It is really that simple, that is the truth beyond any doubt however unless a person is awaken it is impossible to get this. all things of mind that are called spiritual techniques such as neti neti not this not this will keep you in bondage to your mind and never reach the goal that is set up. that is the nature of mind just like the rat in a cage on the wheel just a few more turns and the rat will get the cheese but in truth the rat needs to step off the wheel to get the cheese. Man lives in a self made prison created by the mind to keep the game moving. Awareness or Oneness is who you are and it only takes a second or even less to realize that you are what you seek. Ok nuff said you know exactly what I mean so I will retire the thought for now Take care Randji |
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