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Post by dwbh1953 on Jan 13, 2009 21:26:08 GMT -5
The word is used so often so I open up the group to this question.
What is your understanding of what enlightenment is?
thank you
Randyji
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Post by lightmystic on Jan 14, 2009 11:20:01 GMT -5
Here are some ways to talk about it: Enlightenment is when the individual disappears because it's truly recognized to never have had any independent existence. Enlightenment is when there is a recognition of sameness in all things. I am That substance which is the same substance as everyone else: Awareness. Enlightenment is the realization that there is nothing outside Awareness and I am That. Enlightenment is when perceiver and perceived are interchangeable. When subject sees subject in all things, and the heart delights. Enlightenment is when all experience is perceived as the motion of one's own Consciousness. Enlightenment is when all is perceived as at open, delicious, spacious, unconfined, Nothingness. Enlightenment is when the feeling of confinement is seen to be illusion, so that it is allowed to lift... Enlightenment is when there is a personal relationship with Allness, so close that and so intimate, all needs are recognized to be fulfilled. Enlightenment is when acceptance is so deep that it's worth having any experience so that the joy of existence can wash over it and it can be unconditionally met with an open heart. Enlightenment is the breath of the Creator, of Creation itself, breathing with you, through you, as you. Enlightenment is being in the lap of the Mother, with Creation in your lap. Enlightenment is the simplest state of Awareness Enlightenment is total innocence. Enlightenment is a simple, gentle feeling level allowed to flower, sparking total devotion and joyful letting go into the smiling void. Enlightenment is seeing the self in all things, and all things in the self. The word is used so often so I open up the group to this question. What is your understanding of what enlightenment is? thank you Randyji |
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Morrie
New Member
"Nothing is me" is the first step. "Everything is me" is the next.
Posts: 38
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Post by Morrie on Jan 14, 2009 11:34:17 GMT -5
LM, these are some of the most beautiful and remarkable spiritual aphorisms I've ever read....I think these deserved to be published! Thank you! This is a keeper.
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Post by commiejesus on Jan 14, 2009 12:35:59 GMT -5
Randiji, With all respect, we either walk the walk or just talk the talk....  I do not mean to be blunt but the "pop new age" phenomena is about to put me over the top. There is no new day under the sun that a "new" spiritual teacher emerges and begins to tell me about "enlightenment" or "bliss". The bookstores are filled with "new" gurus and teachers. Nothing but people who got tired of their day jobs. Are you (or anyone) tell me that all these "gurus" all of the sudden, awakened? Bull nuts, I would say! It ain't that easy. Some real teacher told me once that the "The mere desire to be a Mahatma, would actually preclude him/her to become one..." I for one do not care if I am "awakened" by tomorrow, or next week or next lifetime. I gain bliss and serenity of mind that I can, and hence there is no death (to speak of). That is enough for me and all other talk is (sorry) but idle chatter.... Sorry for the ranting....just my two cents.... CJ (let the revolution commence) The word is used so often so I open up the group to this question. What is your understanding of what enlightenment is? thank you Randyji |
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Post by ANON on Jan 14, 2009 19:47:14 GMT -5
The "enlightenment" business is lucrative these days. Most of those that go through an "awakening" experience don't know what to do with themselves after that, so they go into the guru business. A lot of them make good money offering their "wisdom" for a monthly fee (credit cards accepted).
It takes many years to integrate the awakening event such that one understands what happened. These self-appointed gurus should stay quiet for about 20 years and then, and only then, should they share the wisdom they have found on the way. Then it will have the ring of truth, wisdom and maturity.
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Post by dwbh1953 on Jan 14, 2009 23:50:43 GMT -5
Randiji, With all respect, we either walk the walk or just talk the talk.... I do not mean to be blunt but the "pop new age" phenomena is about to put me over the top. There is no new day under the sun that a "new" spiritual teacher emerges and begins to tell me about "enlightenment" or "bliss". The bookstores are filled with "new" gurus and teachers. Nothing but people who got tired of their day jobs. Are you (or anyone) tell me that all these "gurus" all of the sudden, awakened? Bull nuts, I would say! It ain't that easy. Some real teacher told me once that the "The mere desire to be a Mahatma, would actually preclude him/her to become one..." I for one do not care if I am "awakened" by tomorrow, or next week or next lifetime. I gain bliss and serenity of mind that I can, and hence there is no death (to speak of). That is enough for me and all other talk is (sorry) but idle chatter.... Sorry for the ranting....just my two cents.... CJ (let the revolution commence) Well CJ thanks you just gave a perfect example of the mind just being the mind. You see you can have your perfect blissful world in the mind, your story or movie but just know it is the mind and not real. But you will still have at somepoint a sense of loss of Oneness in other words because what you have is of the mind it will always be lacking , needing something more, almost there but never quite arriving. What I am saying about waking up is very simple, you become nothing new but it is a shift that happens were now you see that you have had this freedom all your life, that you are this freedom which is beyond space, time. You are that which you seek, give up the seeking and see what happens. You cannot get something you already have. Cheers Randyji The word is used so often so I open up the group to this question. What is your understanding of what enlightenment is? thank you Randyji |
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Post by dwbh1953 on Jan 15, 2009 0:04:22 GMT -5
Here are some ways to talk about it: Enlightenment is when the individual disappears because it's truly recognized to never have had any independent existence. Enlightenment is when there is a recognition of sameness in all things. I am That substance which is the same substance as everyone else: Awareness. Enlightenment is the realization that there is nothing outside Awareness and I am That. Enlightenment is when perceiver and perceived are interchangeable. When subject sees subject in all things, and the heart delights. Enlightenment is when all experience is perceived as the motion of one's own Consciousness. Enlightenment is when all is perceived as at open, delicious, spacious, unconfined, Nothingness. Enlightenment is when the feeling of confinement is seen to be illusion, so that it is allowed to lift... Enlightenment is when there is a personal relationship with Allness, so close that and so intimate, all needs are recognized to be fulfilled. Enlightenment is when acceptance is so deep that it's worth having any experience so that the joy of existence can wash over it and it can be unconditionally met with an open heart. Enlightenment is the breath of the Creator, of Creation itself, breathing with you, through you, as you. Enlightenment is being in the lap of the Mother, with Creation in your lap. Enlightenment is the simplest state of Awareness Enlightenment is total innocence. Enlightenment is a simple, gentle feeling level allowed to flower, sparking total devotion and joyful letting go into the smiling void. Enlightenment is seeing the self in all things, and all things in the self. Well said thank you and wonderful thank you. I will add that Enlightenment is not something to obtain, you are that already, you cannot obtain something that you already are. This was the genius of RM when told people of the inquiry of Who Am I. We and the we is really no one is simply awareness. Awareness is the onething we all have in common humans are aware of other humans, dogs aware of dogs, cats aware of cats, insects aware of insects there is no divison because there is no mind in awareness it just is. Enlightenment to me is anything without the I thought. The moment we speak the I we have created seperation what is before the I is Enlightenment, Awakening, Oneness or whatever term you want to use. Randyji The word is used so often so I open up the group to this question. What is your understanding of what enlightenment is? thank you Randyji |
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Post by dwbh1953 on Jan 15, 2009 0:24:06 GMT -5
The "enlightenment" business is lucrative these days. Most of those that go through an "awakening" experience don't know what to do with themselves after that, so they go into the guru business. A lot of them make good money offering their "wisdom" for a monthly fee (credit cards accepted). It takes many years to integrate the awakening event such that one understands what happened. These self-appointed gurus should stay quiet for about 20 years and then, and only then, should they share the wisdom they have found on the way. Then it will have the ring of truth, wisdom and maturity. The ring of truth will always be the ring of truth. I do not feel at all that folks like Tony Parsons, or Jeff Foster, and many others would ever label themselves as gurus. They are simply folks that have awaken to this very simple truth and now are sharing it in hopes to create a space for others to get a taste of it. I do agree that because this is so very very simple that one needs to be careful with it. The only impossible part of teaching non duality is that you can never know it from the mind. So the very words one uses to describe it can become in themselves to hinder the actual teachings. The less said the better . thanks for your comment Randyji |
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fear
Full Member
Posts: 128
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Post by fear on Jan 15, 2009 3:22:13 GMT -5
Using the evidence gathered through aquired knowledge and a little intuition, I'd say:
Enlightnement is a paradox, it can only be pointed to but can never be reached.
It can never be captured because by the time you examine it, you've already missed it.
Therefore, there is no such thing as enlightnement, but there is...
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Post by hm180370 on Jan 15, 2009 6:21:19 GMT -5
A child is born enlightened but grown unenlightened. So enlightenment is to become child once again and I think Sri Sri Ravi Shankar's Art of living Courses are helping people to become childlike and not childish.
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Post by dwbh1953 on Jan 15, 2009 9:18:12 GMT -5
Using the evidence gathered through aquired knowledge and a little intuition, I'd say: Enlightnement is a paradox, it can only be pointed to but can never be reached. It can never be captured because by the time you examine it, you've already missed it. Therefore, there is no such thing as enlightnement, but there is... Yes that is very true since there is really only one then their is no one to experience enlightenment so how is it to be yet there is enlightenment in Oneness. thanks for your comment great point! Randyji |
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Post by lightmystic on Jan 15, 2009 11:17:52 GMT -5
*bow* Well, thank you Morrie! How very nice of you to say so. LM, these are some of the most beautiful and remarkable spiritual aphorisms I've ever read....I think these deserved to be published! Thank you! This is a keeper. |
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Post by lightmystic on Jan 15, 2009 11:23:03 GMT -5
Some people stay quiet many so it can integrate. I like talking about it better. It seems to work a lot better at any rate, at least for me... And expansion still happens in silence.... Also, there's always more growth to be had, so who wrote these "talking about it" rules... And what IS a guru anyway? The "enlightenment" business is lucrative these days. Most of those that go through an "awakening" experience don't know what to do with themselves after that, so they go into the guru business. A lot of them make good money offering their "wisdom" for a monthly fee (credit cards accepted). It takes many years to integrate the awakening event such that one understands what happened. These self-appointed gurus should stay quiet for about 20 years and then, and only then, should they share the wisdom they have found on the way. Then it will have the ring of truth, wisdom and maturity. |
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Post by lightmystic on Jan 15, 2009 11:28:27 GMT -5
It's most certainly a paradox. It cannot be reached, because it's already happening. If the goal is to make a white wall white, nothing can be done to change it that will have the desired effect. It can only be recognized to already BE white. So looking at all the ideas about why it isn't white helps alleviate that problem. Paradoxes are things that cannot possibly coexist yet somehow coexist peacefully anyway. Enlightenment is a paradox. It DOES exist, but cannot be "reached." It just needs to stop being resisted, and I, of course, don't mean intellectually, I mean emotionally. It's not that we actively resist these things, it's that we've been actively resisting it our whole lives. What we want is scary because it involves a complete loss of anything to hold on to, and can quite possible seem to mean death to go through with it. That's discovered to only be a fear, but often after the fact. Going into it is quite scary, and it means looking at every bit of horribleness that we've been trying to avoid in ourselves and resisting for so long, so that it can be released and we can let ourselves see what is already there free of these old habits of resistance. Using the evidence gathered through aquired knowledge and a little intuition, I'd say: Enlightnement is a paradox, it can only be pointed to but can never be reached. It can never be captured because by the time you examine it, you've already missed it. Therefore, there is no such thing as enlightnement, but there is... |
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Post by someNOTHING! on Jan 31, 2009 8:02:56 GMT -5
LM,
Wonderful lines for pointing. Don't mind if I use of few of those in general discussions here in our Perfect dreamscape!
Grazie.
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