Check him out if you dare

[dwbh1953]

I forgot to add this fellow.
He is not for everyone but I like him a lot.
He is another of the few that tells it like it really is.
Only for serious folks.
His name is
Scott Kiloby

www.kiloby.com/

Stop by and tell me what you like or do not like it is all good

[Morrie]

Thanks DWBH

I didn't have a lot of time to check the sight out (at work now), but I did watch one of his videos about "no point of reference." I think Kiloby says some good stuff and I generally liked what I saw...his presentation is a little dry though. Have you read his book?

[dwbh1953]

Jan 13, 2009 17:40:40 GMT -5 Morrie said:

Thanks DWBH

I didn't have a lot of time to check the sight out (at work now), but I did watch one of his videos about "no point of reference." I think Kiloby says some good stuff and I generally liked what I saw...his presentation is a little dry though. Have you read his book?

No have you? I like the guy but then I like folks that say things like your spiritual teacher is full of crap. Tony Parsons is on the wave length as this guy. I guess it was all the time I spent with Gurus and other spiritual teachers that now I just like it plain and simple.

You see when this thing they call enlightenment hits you it makes you really see that most spiritual teachers are doing nothing at all to help anyone they are caught is their own dream and they take you away from enlightenment. Even with these words what I am saying is not true becaause the words themselves are very misleading because you cannot be taken away from something that is always there but you get the drift. Drift is a good word for it the best words can really do
So is his book any good?
Take care friend
Randy

[jimmytantric]

Just finished reading his book - Loves Quiet Revolution - The end of the spiritual search. The book was very good. Very helpful in helping to not identify with thoughts etc.

[Matilda]

His book was excellent when I read it.

It led to what I thought was enlightenment.

Then the bubble burst. It was a thought-enlightenment - the thoughts I was thinking were leading me to believe something special had happened. Now that it's past, I can't say what it was. Just an experience.

This is all thoughts can do, all books and teachers can do.

It's just a trip. This man is as good as these teachers get, but he has nothing to offer. I don't mean this in any sort of romantisized "ooh, that's what i'm after" way. I think that when people say "there's nothing here" we think it's some profound mystical statement. It's not. It's just the truth. None of these guys have sh*t. But they string us along. They keep us seeking. This at least has been my experience. Even with this book subtitled "the end of the spiritual search." Even this, it's stringing us along.

If it's fun, it's fun, but that's all it is. The spiritual search and whatever we arrive at are nothing special. Everyone has "This" means EVERYONE HAS IT. There is nothing special or mystical about discovering what these special ones (the gurus/teachers) are talking about. Nothing!!!

Why are we all saying we want the search to end? Why is that the most discussed topic on the discussion board? If we want it to end, then just end it. Stop listening to others and just live your life. Or admit that you don't really want it to end, that you're having a good time! And more power to you! Enjoy it, enjoy your life, whatever that means, embrace "seeker" if that's what you want to be. But don't think it's about the "end goal". There's nothing there that you don't already have!! And that doesn't mean that "I just want to realize that" makes any sense.

Scott Kiloby is great - no offense to him, but it is TRUE that he has NOTHING THAT YOU DON'T HAVE ALREADY NOW. Nothing. Nothing. Nothing.
Nothing.

[lightmystic]

Greetings Matilda,

There is an important distinction between recognizing how things are already functioning, and just resigning oneself to feeling limited. Both could be considered ending the search, but the first ends suffering permanently, and the second simply resigns oneself to it.

It's true that we already are that, but it's not relevant or useful until it's our living reality. I certainly appreciate that you had a mystical experience that went away, but that doesn't mean that that is all there is. Temporary experiences of amazing connectedness are an important part of this important process. It doesn't mean the connectedness cannot last, it means that it has to integrate. There has to be a normal-ness to it, because if an experience is too flashy, then we constantly want to hold it up and look at it, so to speak, and so we keep it separate from ourselves that way. And as long as we are keeping it separate from ourselves to some extent, then it cannot last, because it's not being fully accepted. Eventually, any experience, no matter how amazing it is and how appreciated it is, becomes normal. It's perhaps like going around your whole life without arms, and then discovering you have them. It's amazing and all of that, but if you are constantly looking at them, then you cannot really use them. The analogy breaks down a bit, but it works in the sense that, eventually, you appreciate your arms deeply, but you accept it. They are great, but they are really there and they are not going away. Having arms just becomes part of life.

There is is truly every inch of constant amazingness that you want there to be and more. WAY more. It's just that it comes from noticing how we are resisting life and allowing it. And it's not that we are actively resisting, but that we've actively been resisting our whole life. What we call status quo is actually a deep resistance. Because if we are not separate, then what will happen to our individual selves??!
So it's unconsciously blocked out, being deeply resisted. Started to put attention on those deeply primal resistances allows them to start to gently be worked out, fading over time. It can be an incredibly intense process, as it's literally exploring the darkest fears to see that they are safe, and that they are not really threatening. As the resistance fades, we can start to see more and more what has already been going on this whole time. And life changes. Drastically. Radically. Night and Day Difference. It just cannot really be described....

Although I like to try for some reason.

I hope you see what I'm saying.

Nov 7, 2009 18:05:17 GMT -5 @Matilda said:

His book was excellent when I read it.

It led to what I thought was enlightenment.

Then the bubble burst. It was a thought-enlightenment - the thoughts I was thinking were leading me to believe something special had happened. Now that it's past, I can't say what it was. Just an experience.

This is all thoughts can do, all books and teachers can do.

It's just a trip. This man is as good as these teachers get, but he has nothing to offer. I don't mean this in any sort of romantisized "ooh, that's what i'm after" way. I think that when people say "there's nothing here" we think it's some profound mystical statement. It's not. It's just the truth. None of these guys have sh*t. But they string us along. They keep us seeking. This at least has been my experience. Even with this book subtitled "the end of the spiritual search." Even this, it's stringing us along.

If it's fun, it's fun, but that's all it is. The spiritual search and whatever we arrive at are nothing special. Everyone has "This" means EVERYONE HAS IT. There is nothing special or mystical about discovering what these special ones (the gurus/teachers) are talking about. Nothing!!!

Why are we all saying we want the search to end? Why is that the most discussed topic on the discussion board? If we want it to end, then just end it. Stop listening to others and just live your life. Or admit that you don't really want it to end, that you're having a good time! And more power to you! Enjoy it, enjoy your life, whatever that means, embrace "seeker" if that's what you want to be. But don't think it's about the "end goal". There's nothing there that you don't already have!! And that doesn't mean that "I just want to realize that" makes any sense.

Scott Kiloby is great - no offense to him, but it is TRUE that he has NOTHING THAT YOU DON'T HAVE ALREADY NOW. Nothing. Nothing. Nothing.
Nothing.

[mark]

I just spent a couple of days with him in NYC. I thought he was great. Direct pointing, no BS. A guy who went to the weekend in Silver Springs got the realization.
Mark

[zendancer]

Hi Matilda,

You seem very certain that nothing of spiritual importance can be realized, but you already told us that you were deceived by some sort of experience by which you temporarily thought you were enlightened. If thoughts can be that deceptive, maybe thoughts about the meaninglessness of the spiritual search are equally deceptive. Is that possible? I would recommend that you contemplate why you feel so certain that people who are seeking truth are wasting their time. Is it because you had no luck in finding anything when you searched? If you were satisfied with your life, why would you ever read a book by someone like Kiloby in the first place?

Let us imagine, just for fun, that something quite amazing can be discovered as a result of seeking the truth. If we cross our arms and refuse to even entertain that possibility, then we have shut the door, thrown away the key, and relegated ourselves to a thought-dominated life known to many of us as "consensual reality" or "dreamsville."

You are free to do and think whatever you wish, but your argument for why you think teachers are pulling the wool over people's eyes is pretty weak (considering the nature of your own experiences). Here are a few questions to consider. Do you think that you are separate from what you see? If you believe in God, do you think that God is separate from you? Do you think space and time exist? Do you understand how you grow your teeth or the hairs on your head? Do you have any fears, and, if so, why? Are you totally at peace no matter what happens in your life?

Maybe your antipathy to people who are on a spiritual search is telling you more about yourself than them. Is that possible? Don't answer too quickly. Look inside and see what's there. Look at your motivation for what you posted.

In the deepest sense, coming to the end of one's spiritual search is nothing more than an entry into a new kind of life not based upon thoughts. This kind of life cannot be imagined, but only someone who intuits the possibility of such a thing will ever attempt to search for it, much less find it. I doubt that anyone who finds the truth would trade it for anything the world has to offer. Meister Eckhart summed it up pretty well when he wrote, "If I had to choose between God and the truth, I would hold to the truth." That's a pretty radical thing for a Catholic priest to say. Why would he have said such a crazy thing? Cheers.

[Peter]

Hi Matilda

I'm reading a Jack Kornfield book at the moment that you might find helpful: After the Ecstasy, The Laundry. One of the anecdotes Kornfield tells is exactly what happened to me. A Zen practitioner had a big experience that gets labelled as Enlightenment and then a few weeks later when the high has worn off, this guy (and me) are looking at our lives and saying "Hang on a minute, if I'm Enlightened, why am I feeling so bloody irritable"?

And that's when the Real Work on the self starts.

[karen]

I've been listening to his Kilologues. Good stuff.