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Post by tcejer on Oct 12, 2013 19:23:32 GMT -5
If it's your desire and choice for YOUR mind to be finite, limited by your fears and subordinates, then that is YOUR choice and thank (your) god for this. Thank (your) god also that your choice as such only applies to YOUR mind. What is Mind tcejer? In short; the mind is the non-physical (i.e. spiritual) awareness and means by which we all make choice - perhaps hundreds of thousands per day.
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Post by nowhereman on Oct 12, 2013 19:40:06 GMT -5
not really mind is mind there is no such thing as a personal mind As the case with many, you present as a little confused about what you actually believe, and clever words aren't providing sufficient cover. So a couple of questions for you ... 1. Why do you introduce the concept of a personal mind in the same statement as suggesting it doesn't exist? 2. What is your definition of a 'personal mind', and how does it differ from your 'finite mind'; which isn't personal. Also ... 3. What so limits your 'finite (yet impersonal) mind'? Simply because you make it personal the moment you use words such YOUR mind etc you make it personal. There is no such thing as minds in the plural there is only mind and it's not even close to being infinite. As I already pointed out the only thing that has infinity is the Self all else including mind of course is just a illusion and a finite illusion at that. Of course there are those that are determine not to grow spiritually and I guess you could say for them illusions are infinite lol. When one sees who they truly are which is the SELF alone then all these fables about the mind vanish poof! However the finite mind is quite the trickster and seekers tend to be fairly gullible and the ego hates to be revealed for what it is and this is why "you" will continue to make up stories which does not help your own growth. The mind will only allow you to have understanding at the mind level. By it's very nature it cannot move outside it self as it is limited completely for what it is. Nowhereman
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Post by enigma on Oct 12, 2013 20:44:53 GMT -5
The mind is not infinite but finite and thank God for this. The Self is the only thing that is infinite and also the only Thing. If it's your desire and choice for YOUR mind to be finite, limited by your fears and subordinates, then that is YOUR choice and thank (your) god for this. Thank (your) god also that your choice as such only applies to YOUR mind. I see mind as the process of cognition through which wholeness is bifurcated into dualistic pairs, and as such, it is a process of limitation itself, in the same sense that a prism is a device of limitation as it removes frequencies of light in order to produce a color.
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Post by enigma on Oct 12, 2013 20:48:55 GMT -5
If it's your desire and choice for YOUR mind to be finite, limited by your fears and subordinates, then that is YOUR choice and thank (your) god for this. Thank (your) god also that your choice as such only applies to YOUR mind. not really mind is mind there is no such thing as a personal mind I would say mind is an individuated function only. IOW there is only the personal mind and no 'Master Mind'. Of course, it depends on one's definition of mind.
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Post by tcejer on Oct 12, 2013 20:56:48 GMT -5
As the case with many, you present as a little confused about what you actually believe, and clever words aren't providing sufficient cover. So a couple of questions for you ... 1. Why do you introduce the concept of a personal mind in the same statement as suggesting it doesn't exist? 2. What is your definition of a 'personal mind', and how does it differ from your 'finite mind'; which isn't personal. Also ... 3. What so limits your 'finite (yet impersonal) mind'? Simply because you make it personal the moment you use words such YOUR mind etc you make it personal. There is no such thing as minds in the plural there is only mind and it's not even close to being infinite. You express a couple of beliefs there, yet without any semblance of logical explanation, such dogmas are most appropriately considered on a par with the ancient Egyptian god Amen, who dragged the sun east to west across the sky each day, and west to east through the underworld each night. Ultimately, such beliefs might make perfect sense to your ‘mind’ (whatever that means to you) but for some of us, perhaps better left with your good self. So with regards your ‘one’ (and only one) finite mind – to whom or what does this belong? Also how does it work? Also why are billions of humans convinced they all have their own, you know - if it isn’t theirs at all? And why do they all consider theirs to be (even slightly) different to the next guy’s? As I already pointed out the only thing that has infinity is the Self all else including mind of course is just a illusion and a finite illusion at that. Well the last I checked, it was pretty much axiomatic that by definition, all illusions are, well … finite – severely limited to the imaginary! So now you express another belief, how do you logically explain the ‘self’ as having ‘infinity’? What could you possibly mean by such a statement? Have you considered sleep, coma, trauma, 'death' in this dogma of yours? What is this infinite ‘self’, anyways? Of course there are those that are determine not to grow spiritually and I guess you could say for them illusions are infinite lol. Well … if you say so lol. When one sees who they truly are which is the SELF alone then all these fables about the mind vanish poof! So it would appear you’re yet to encounter the spiritual insight which clearly establishes your ‘self’ as the actual illusion – the great illusion about which you become convinced, and into which you invest heavily, huh? Poof! However the finite mind is quite the trickster and seekers tend to be fairly gullible and the ego hates to be revealed for what it is and this is why "you" will continue to make up stories which does not help your own growth. Yes it appears ‘you’ have made up a few good ones. The mind will only allow you to have understanding at the mind level. By it's very nature it cannot move outside it self as it is limited completely for what it is. Perhaps you haven’t noticed, but thus far your responses don’t actually answer anything, but simply raise more (many more) questions, such as – why do you say the mind cannot move outside itself, when (at least) the act of typing your posts would suggest this very process which you deny?
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Post by nowhereman on Oct 12, 2013 21:00:22 GMT -5
not really mind is mind there is no such thing as a personal mind I would say mind is an individuated function only. IOW there is only the personal mind and no 'Master Mind'. Of course, it depends on one's definition of mind. Yes it can be defined like that also but unless someone knows where you are coming from it can be confusing. Mind is mind it's a illusion on the level of Self however very real as there is a body/mind ego thingy but there is no such thing as "minds" like we all have one there is just Mind which is access by individuals. Mind is what keeps you here in the illusion it's ego major helper .
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Post by nowhereman on Oct 12, 2013 21:07:27 GMT -5
Simply because you make it personal the moment you use words such YOUR mind etc you make it personal. There is no such thing as minds in the plural there is only mind and it's not even close to being infinite. You express a couple of beliefs there, yet without any semblance of logical explanation, such dogmas are most appropriately considered on a par with the ancient Egyptian god Amen, who dragged the sun east to west across the sky each day, and west to east through the underworld each night. Ultimately, such beliefs might make perfect sense to your ‘mind’ (whatever that means to you) but for some of us, perhaps better left with your good self. So with regards your ‘one’ (and only one) finite mind – to whom or what does this belong? Also how does it work? Also why are billions of humans convinced they all have their own, you know - if it isn’t theirs at all? And why do they all consider theirs to be (even slightly) different to the next guy’s? As I already pointed out the only thing that has infinity is the Self all else including mind of course is just a illusion and a finite illusion at that. Well the last I checked, it was pretty much axiomatic that by definition, all illusions are, well … finite – severely limited to the imaginary! So now we have another belief, how do you logically explain the ‘self’ as having ‘infinity’? What could you possibly mean by such a statement? What is this infinite ‘self’, anyways? Of course there are those that are determine not to grow spiritually and I guess you could say for them illusions are infinite lol. Well … if you say so lol. When one sees who they truly are which is the SELF alone then all these fables about the mind vanish poof! So it would appear you’re yet to encounter the spiritual insight which clearly establishes your ‘self’ as the actual illusion – the great illusion about which you become convinced, and into which you invest heavily, huh? Poof! However the finite mind is quite the trickster and seekers tend to be fairly gullible and the ego hates to be revealed for what it is and this is why "you" will continue to make up stories which does not help your own growth. Yes it appears ‘you’ have made up a few good ones. The mind will only allow you to have understanding at the mind level. By it's very nature it cannot move outside it self as it is limited completely for what it is. Perhaps you haven’t noticed, but thus far your responses don’t actually answer anything, but simply raise more (many more) questions, such as – why do you say the mind cannot move outside itself, when (at least) the act of typing your posts would suggest this very process which you deny? Simply because I am now speaking from SELF pov and you are from mind. You cannot understand what I am posting because of your vantage point. The reason why what I post raises more questions(many more) is because you are viewing what I write from the level of mind. The mind job is to keep you asking and asking therefore keeping you from seeing the truth of things. However for me it gets old fast and very tiresome as the truth is far more simple and no I am not going to continue with such mind games. I am very happy and content just being me.
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Post by tzujanli on Oct 12, 2013 21:49:36 GMT -5
Greetings..
Mind is the medium through and upon which awareness and perception is revealed to the experiencer.. mind is the interface between the experiencer and the experience, between the part and the whole, between the unknown and the known.. mind is the interface that processes the information revealed by awareness and perception in accordance with the beliefs and knowledge the experiencer believes is true.. mind is like a window through which the experiencer is aware of and perceives their existence, and the beliefs and knowledge that the experiencer is attached to, is like specks of dirt attached to the 'window'.. the more the mind is active and thinking and attached, the dirtier the window is.. still mind, clean window..
Be well..
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2013 21:58:25 GMT -5
In short; the mind is the non-physical (i.e. spiritual) awareness and means by which we all make choice - perhaps hundreds of thousands per day. By what means, if any, does "spiritual" awareness make choices? Have you ever tried to observe a choice occurring, not with mentation, but by a kind a of silent watching like watching a thought pass by? What do you observe when you observe awareness making a choice?
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Post by tcejer on Oct 12, 2013 22:44:35 GMT -5
You express a couple of beliefs there, yet without any semblance of logical explanation, such dogmas are most appropriately considered on a par with the ancient Egyptian god Amen, who dragged the sun east to west across the sky each day, and west to east through the underworld each night. Ultimately, such beliefs might make perfect sense to your ‘mind’ (whatever that means to you) but for some of us, perhaps better left with your good self. So with regards your ‘one’ (and only one) finite mind – to whom or what does this belong? Also how does it work? Also why are billions of humans convinced they all have their own, you know - if it isn’t theirs at all? And why do they all consider theirs to be (even slightly) different to the next guy’s? Well the last I checked, it was pretty much axiomatic that by definition, all illusions are, well … finite – severely limited to the imaginary! So now we have another belief, how do you logically explain the ‘self’ as having ‘infinity’? What could you possibly mean by such a statement? Have you considered sleep, coma, trauma, 'death' in this dogma of yours? What is this infinite ‘self’, anyways? Well … if you say so lol. So it would appear you’re yet to encounter the spiritual insight which clearly establishes your ‘self’ as the actual illusion – the great illusion about which you become convinced, and into which you invest heavily, huh? Poof! Yes it appears ‘you’ have made up a few good ones. Perhaps you haven’t noticed, but thus far your responses don’t actually answer anything, but simply raise more (many more) questions, such as – why do you say the mind cannot move outside itself, when (at least) the act of typing your posts would suggest this very process which you deny? Simply because I am now speaking from SELF pov and you are from mind. You may by all means make assumptions on your own behalf, but you tread on very impoverished ground with assumptions on behalf of others. In any case, I'm wondering if your severe lacking of anything that comes close to a logical answer to logical questions, may be due to your 'SELF pov' (disad)vantage point? You cannot understand what I am posting because of your vantage point. Perhaps you cannot understand what you are posting either, huh? Perhaps words without perspective and clarity to back them up just ain't enough? Perhaps one might have an expectation that when someone posts to a forum such as this, they might actually enjoy a little appreciation about that which they espouse so freely. The reason why what I post raises more questions(many more) is because you are viewing what I write from the level of mind. The mind job is to keep you asking and asking therefore keeping you from seeing the truth of things. More vague words upon ambiguity upon disorientation of persepctive, but do you actually have some insight which backs up any (if not all) of these inconsistencies? It's a very simple question, after all. However for me it gets old fast and very tiresome as the truth is far more simple and no I am not going to continue with such mind games. I am very happy and content just being me. Just as well!
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Post by nowhereman on Oct 12, 2013 22:51:38 GMT -5
"Just as well!"
Yes this these are the most accurate words you have written so far.. Happy trails Nowhereman
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2013 22:57:15 GMT -5
You express a couple of beliefs there, yet without any semblance of logical explanation, such dogmas are most appropriately considered on a par with the ancient Egyptian god Amen, who dragged the sun east to west across the sky each day, and west to east through the underworld each night. Ultimately, such beliefs might make perfect sense to your ‘mind’ (whatever that means to you) but for some of us, perhaps better left with your good self. So with regards your ‘one’ (and only one) finite mind – to whom or what does this belong? Also how does it work? Also why are billions of humans convinced they all have their own, you know - if it isn’t theirs at all? And why do they all consider theirs to be (even slightly) different to the next guy’s? Well the last I checked, it was pretty much axiomatic that by definition, all illusions are, well … finite – severely limited to the imaginary! So now we have another belief, how do you logically explain the ‘self’ as having ‘infinity’? What could you possibly mean by such a statement? What is this infinite ‘self’, anyways? Well … if you say so lol. So it would appear you’re yet to encounter the spiritual insight which clearly establishes your ‘self’ as the actual illusion – the great illusion about which you become convinced, and into which you invest heavily, huh? Poof! Yes it appears ‘you’ have made up a few good ones. Perhaps you haven’t noticed, but thus far your responses don’t actually answer anything, but simply raise more (many more) questions, such as – why do you say the mind cannot move outside itself, when (at least) the act of typing your posts would suggest this very process which you deny? Simply because I am now speaking from SELF pov and you are from mind. You cannot understand what I am posting because of your vantage point. The reason why what I post raises more questions(many more) is because you are viewing what I write from the level of mind. The mind job is to keep you asking and asking therefore keeping you from seeing the truth of things. However for me it gets old fast and very tiresome as the truth is far more simple and no I am not going to continue with such mind games. I am very happy and content just being me. Time for a break again Randy?
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Post by tcejer on Oct 12, 2013 22:59:15 GMT -5
"Just as well!" Yes this these are the most accurate words you have written so far.. Happy trails Nowhereman Does it become 'truth' just because you believe it - even without the least explainable reason for doing so? Happy trails.
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Post by tcejer on Oct 12, 2013 23:21:46 GMT -5
In short; the mind is the non-physical (i.e. spiritual) awareness and means by which we all make choice - perhaps hundreds of thousands per day. By what means, if any, does "spiritual" awareness make choices? What would you suggest is the difference between 'spiritual' and any other awareness? Awareness doesn't make choices as such. Consciousness - i.e. the SPIRITUAL 'I AM' (within) makes the choices - all of them. Consciousness calls upon awareness as one of the 'weights and measures' used in the process of making each and every choice. Have you ever tried to observe a choice occurring, not with mentation, but by a kind a of silent watching like watching a thought pass by? I would think that even if unaware of it, we have all experienced such occurrence, yet most often (by far), the process is not so conspicuous. Nevertheless, we observe and experience both the process and result of every choice we ever make. What do you observe when you observe awareness making a choice? Observing awareness making a choice would be like observing a microscope choosing to go for a run around the block - except a microscope is a physical tool, whereas awareness is not, but rather a spiritual tool. Both tools (physical and spiritual) then, are employed by the individuated consciousness to evaluate the environment of selection - towards the SPIRITUAL consciousness subsequently making choice to PHYSICAL action.
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Post by tcejer on Oct 13, 2013 2:41:07 GMT -5
Mind is the medium through and upon which awareness and perception is revealed to the experiencer. Ok, so what would be the purpose of this 'revealing'? Surely the purpose is the focal point, after all. mind is the interface between the experiencer and the experience, between the part and the whole, between the unknown and the known.. mind is the interface that processes the information revealed by awareness and perception in accordance with the beliefs and knowledge the experiencer believes is true.. mind is like a window through which the experiencer is aware of and perceives their existence, and the beliefs and knowledge that the experiencer is attached to, is like specks of dirt attached to the 'window'.. the more the mind is active and thinking and attached, the dirtier the window is.. still mind, clean window.. Your words above, although a little ambiguous appear reasonable/valid - until you arrive at your apparently illogical caveat towards the end. So how can mind have awareness, and at the same time be inactive? Does one in a coma (for instance) have a better awareness than an 'active'/'dirty window/mind?
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