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Post by topology on Aug 5, 2013 11:20:44 GMT -5
The only two scenarios which make sense if that is the case is that either he is trolling or there is a real disconnect between the word and experience for him, meaning he can't recognize genuine compassion. I wonder if he is able to recognize the solidarity he has received and continues to receive. The vote to lift his ban was an act of solidarity. The support and encouragement he's received is solidarity with him. Even Bobby gives him solidarity, but he can't feel it or see it because it is not a personal solidarity, meaning it's not in support of his personal world view, it is in support of him, his essence. You have a penchant for relating to people with a different viewpoint from yours as trolls, Top. You and I disagree all the time. I really don't see you as a troll. I see you more like someone that wants me to buy into his viewpoint. Q made a point early on in one of the unmoderated threads about our simple state. I really do sense this is the foundation for his posts. All of us fall into a trap using labels. The labels are contrived, based on societal conditioning. The societal definition of compassion isn't even close to the direct experience of compassion. The direct experience of compassion is based on the quality of being. In my experience, it's a movement. It's instinctive. Intuitive. Not an orphaned, well thought out expression. You can thank Q for inserting the term Troll into my language pattern. He repeated it over and over again and I couldn't help but get NLPed into using it. I've got nothing for you to buy, Art. I can see that you have an orientation towards quality of being, but I also feel like you are selective about what kind of qualities. Some get your approval and some don't. Enigma, for example has a tremendous quality of being, but you don't seem to be able to recognize it. You fixate on what you perceive to be character flaws. You project about how others polish images, but your fixation is your own effort to polish the image you see into an image that exhibits your approved qualities of being.
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Post by topology on Aug 5, 2013 11:23:15 GMT -5
I don't think he's a troll. I do think he's touching on something pretty important, something I've also thought about a lot. I.e., what does genuine compassion look like? Sometimes the most compassionate response is to leave people alone and let them struggle. It is a matter of trust and respect that the individual is right where they are supposed to be, even if they are suffering. Lending someone a hand benefits the lender and makes the lender feel good. That is not compassion. Compassion is not in the "doing." Compassion may be more in the "seeing." Excellent observation, SQ. You might be right on point, as far as Q is concerned too. Is that your subtle way of saying "leave'm alone"?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 5, 2013 11:27:16 GMT -5
You have a penchant for relating to people with a different viewpoint from yours as trolls, Top. You and I disagree all the time. I really don't see you as a troll. I see you more like someone that wants me to buy into his viewpoint. Q made a point early on in one of the unmoderated threads about our simple state. I really do sense this is the foundation for his posts. All of us fall into a trap using labels. The labels are contrived, based on societal conditioning. The societal definition of compassion isn't even close to the direct experience of compassion. The direct experience of compassion is based on the quality of being. In my experience, it's a movement. It's instinctive. Intuitive. Not an orphaned, well thought out expression. You can thank Q for inserting the term Troll into my language pattern. He repeated it over and over again and I couldn't help but get NLPed into using it. I've got nothing for you to buy, Art. I can see that you have an orientation towards quality of being, but I also feel like you are selective about what kind of qualities. Some get your approval and some don't. Enigma, for example has a tremendous quality of being, but you don't seem to be able to recognize it. You fixate on what you perceive to be character flaws. You project about how others polish images, but your fixation is your own effort to polish the image you see into an image that exhibits your approved qualities of being. Enigma lives in his head. I've already posted I'm not interested in being cloned. I'm pretty certain most people feel the same way, based on the responses he gets, or lack thereof. Remember, there are 1200 + members. There's a lot of lack thereof. One reason could be the lack of quality of being in his colleagues, like reefs. Talk about a ball and chain....
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Post by topology on Aug 5, 2013 11:32:30 GMT -5
You can thank Q for inserting the term Troll into my language pattern. He repeated it over and over again and I couldn't help but get NLPed into using it. I've got nothing for you to buy, Art. I can see that you have an orientation towards quality of being, but I also feel like you are selective about what kind of qualities. Some get your approval and some don't. Enigma, for example has a tremendous quality of being, but you don't seem to be able to recognize it. You fixate on what you perceive to be character flaws. You project about how others polish images, but your fixation is your own effort to polish the image you see into an image that exhibits your approved qualities of being. Enigma lives in his head. I've already posted I'm not interested in being cloned. I'm pretty certain most people feel the same way, based on the responses he gets, or lack thereof. Remember, there are 1200 + members. There's a lot of lack thereof. One reason could be the lack of quality of being in his colleagues, like reefs. Talk about a ball and chain.... You're being disingenuous. First you have to filter out any membership prior to his join date. Second you have to filter out anyone that quit for reasons unrelated to what you are insinuating the reason was. Face it, you're skewing reality to support your claim. You're more interested in a distortion which supports your biases and prejudices than what the truth really is.
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Post by silver on Aug 5, 2013 11:39:14 GMT -5
Excellent observation, SQ. You might be right on point, as far as Q is concerned too. Is that your subtle way of saying "leave'm alone"? You really don't like women do you. When you're not chasing them away with blatantly inappropriate crap, you're diminishing what they say, especially when its particularly cogent. No, that isn't a subtle way......one thing I had in mind was positive reinforcement especially when I see the kind of bumping and grinding going on - it's very unattractive on a forum when everyone is being constructive (sarcasm intended) via all kinds of insults. I like sarcasm and insults, but not as a steady diet. It's like you all salt your food before you've even really taken a bite of it yourself.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 5, 2013 11:45:14 GMT -5
Enigma lives in his head. I've already posted I'm not interested in being cloned. I'm pretty certain most people feel the same way, based on the responses he gets, or lack thereof. Remember, there are 1200 + members. There's a lot of lack thereof. One reason could be the lack of quality of being in his colleagues, like reefs. Talk about a ball and chain.... You're being disingenuous. First you have to filter out any membership prior to his join date. Second you have to filter out anyone that quit for reasons unrelated to what you are insinuating the reason was. Face it, you're skewing reality to support your claim. You're more interested in a distortion which supports your biases and prejudices than what the truth really is. Why do members prior to his join date have to be filtered out? ZD was here prior. If others are no longer here, it could be a direct result of his endeavors here, or the combined endeavors with others. You're pretty good at setting the table, but, like enigma, reefs, and Billy- not very talented when it comes to presenting the meal.
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Post by topology on Aug 5, 2013 11:48:08 GMT -5
Is that your subtle way of saying "leave'm alone"? You really don't like women do you. When you're not chasing them away with blatantly inappropriate crap, you're diminishing what they say, especially when its particularly cogent. No, that isn't a subtle way......one thing I had in mind was positive reinforcement especially when I see the kind of bumping and grinding going on - it's very unattractive on a forum when everyone is being constructive (sarcasm intended) via all kinds of insults. I like sarcasm and insults, but not as a steady diet. It's like you all salt your food before you've even really taken a bite of it yourself. The bolded is your own insecurity being projected outward. I love what Quinn, Wren and SQ have to say.
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Post by topology on Aug 5, 2013 11:49:41 GMT -5
You're being disingenuous. First you have to filter out any membership prior to his join date. Second you have to filter out anyone that quit for reasons unrelated to what you are insinuating the reason was. Face it, you're skewing reality to support your claim. You're more interested in a distortion which supports your biases and prejudices than what the truth really is. Why do members prior to his join date have to be filtered out? ZD was here prior. If others are no longer here, it could be a direct result of his endeavors here, or the combined endeavors with others. You're pretty good at setting the table, but, like enigma, reefs, and Billy- not very talented when it comes to presenting the meal. I didn't know you were hungry. The peeps that stop participating prior to his join date. You keep wanting to skew reality to have it say what you want it to say.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 5, 2013 11:54:24 GMT -5
Why do members prior to his join date have to be filtered out? ZD was here prior. If others are no longer here, it could be a direct result of his endeavors here, or the combined endeavors with others. You're pretty good at setting the table, but, like enigma, reefs, and Billy- not very talented when it comes to presenting the meal. I didn't know you were hungry. The peeps that stop participating prior to his join date. You keep wanting to skew reality to have it say what you want it to say. I lose my appetite after reading reefs and enigma's all-nighters.... What's your estimate of the people that left, or stopped participating prior to his join date? Without it, you're doing the same thing you're accusing me of.
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Post by silver on Aug 5, 2013 11:58:04 GMT -5
You really don't like women do you. When you're not chasing them away with blatantly inappropriate crap, you're diminishing what they say, especially when its particularly cogent. No, that isn't a subtle way......one thing I had in mind was positive reinforcement especially when I see the kind of bumping and grinding going on - it's very unattractive on a forum when everyone is being constructive (sarcasm intended) via all kinds of insults. I like sarcasm and insults, but not as a steady diet. It's like you all salt your food before you've even really taken a bite of it yourself. The bolded is your own insecurity being projected outward. I love what Quinn, Wren and SQ have to say. bullspit to the bolded. Yeah but you want a limited supply of smart females in the vicinity, is what I'm thinking.
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Post by silver on Aug 5, 2013 12:00:52 GMT -5
You really don't like women do you. When you're not chasing them away with blatantly inappropriate crap, you're diminishing what they say, especially when its particularly cogent. No, that isn't a subtle way......one thing I had in mind was positive reinforcement especially when I see the kind of bumping and grinding going on - it's very unattractive on a forum when everyone is being constructive (sarcasm intended) via all kinds of insults. I like sarcasm and insults, but not as a steady diet. It's like you all salt your food before you've even really taken a bite of it yourself. The bolded is your own insecurity being projected outward. I love what Quinn, Wren and SQ have to say. Yes let's talk about that. quinn is a lovely person and sure would love to see more of her offerings than we do. She's the best. She speaks her mind and does not ever go out of her way to snip snap at people. wren is weird, lol. and the great part for you is she challenges all those here you don't see eye to eye with. that's the real bone-us. SQ? Everyone likes SQ.
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Post by laughter on Aug 5, 2013 12:07:58 GMT -5
Why do members prior to his join date have to be filtered out? ZD was here prior. If others are no longer here, it could be a direct result of his endeavors here, or the combined endeavors with others. You're pretty good at setting the table, but, like enigma, reefs, and Billy- not very talented when it comes to presenting the meal. I didn't know you were hungry. The peeps that stop participating prior to his join date. You keep wanting to skew reality to have it say what you want it to say. I wonder if these two trolls realize that most of their content is just gossip ... interesting to observe that this is something that andjanli tend to avoid, but that figs loves to incite.
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Post by topology on Aug 5, 2013 12:16:21 GMT -5
I didn't know you were hungry. The peeps that stop participating prior to his join date. You keep wanting to skew reality to have it say what you want it to say. I lose my appetite after reading reefs and enigma's all-nighters.... What's your estimate of the people that left, or stopped participating prior to his join date? Without it, you're doing the same thing you're accusing me of. For the most part, I have no idea what their reasons for joining and leaving were. Are there some who have left because they didn't like the atmosphere here, of course. But its not true for all that have left. And I don't really see it as a problem.
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Post by topology on Aug 5, 2013 12:18:20 GMT -5
The bolded is your own insecurity being projected outward. I love what Quinn, Wren and SQ have to say. bullspit to the bolded. Yeah but you want a limited supply of smart females in the vicinity, is what I'm thinking. You're talking out your ass today. Quit looking through the filters of your own insecurity.
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Post by enigma on Aug 5, 2013 12:19:46 GMT -5
Fair enough if you insist on looking at it that way. So you desire to be desireless? What's the next step other than to see how ridiculous that is and give up? No, of course I don't desire to be desireless, I can't. I desire what Linda has, whatever it is. Even if know that it's ridiculous, what can I do, this stupidity still functions, I can't choose what my unconscious believes in. And this desire is a natural consequence of how the non-duality discourse is structured. It's very simple. Ordinary experince is boring, yes? That's common sense. Spiritual experinces are cool, right? Also common sense. Then Linda says to let those experinces go. Okay, and what for? For something boring? I don't think so. The common sense interpretation is that it must be left for something even better. That's how the unconsicous reads the structure. Bobby can insert his complicated footnotes all day long, the unconscious is never going to believe them because they don't make sense. Yes, that's a clear description of the dilemma. Somebody is saying there is something better than woowoo experiences, and in some way this needs to be experienced or the whole idea devolves into nonsense. This is where the pointing comes in and where it all gets very subtle and tricky. The reason it's tricky is that mind is naturally focused on acquiring a new and improved experience, while nonduality is focused on pointing away from some experiences that are already happening. It's believed that the way to be happy is to add more happy experiences, while what's being said is that happiness is about deleting something. It's not as simple as deleting unhappy experiences, which is ultimately the same dynamic as adding happy experiences. So the issue is, what are they talking about deleting that will alter experience in such an apparently radical way? They're effectively saying delete (let go of) special experiences, and they're saying let go of the desire to improve experiences. Of course one can't follow their own desire to experience what is pointed to and also let go of desire, as you've implied, which is why this letting go is a pointing description rather than a prescription. Nobody is asking us to do (or not do) something but rather to realize and understand something. So what's being said is that the desire for a better experience is really the problem with experience. To put it another way, the problem with experience is that we believe there is a problem, and it's the attempt to resolve this problem that reinforces the experience of a problem. It's a loop (though not a closed one) of imagining a problem, experiencing it as such, and imagining some more, until the experience is that life itself is the problem. Given the dynamics of that process, there is no way out, and so one must extricate themselves from that process. (i.e. stop imagining that there is a problem. Stop playing the game.) It starts to sound simplistic and absurd, and make no mistake, it is. If there is hilarity involved, it's aimed at the absurdity and not the 'person' seemingly caught in this absurd dilemma.
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