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Post by Peter on Jul 8, 2011 5:07:39 GMT -5
The body that we talk about vanishes as well, but the 'real body' is unchanged. I think it more sort of "rots" rather than vanishes. Or gets burned. What is this "real body" that you're talking about, and what makes you think that it exists? Cheers, Peter |
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Post by karen on Jul 8, 2011 9:53:03 GMT -5
You've experienced your body rotting or getting cremated? This inquiry is only in your subjective experience - not some imagined empirical world.
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Post by Portto on Jul 8, 2011 22:43:10 GMT -5
The body that we talk about vanishes as well, but the 'real body' is unchanged. I think it more sort of "rots" rather than vanishes. Or gets burned. If you insist on slo-mo, you could say that. If you fast forward or fast backward, it vanishes. The real body is what I/we am/are, and is everywhere. How can it not exist? |
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Post by Peter on Jul 10, 2011 2:31:58 GMT -5
You've experienced your body rotting or getting cremated? This inquiry is only in your subjective experience - not some imagined empirical world. This is going to sound like a shaggy dog story, but it happened to a guy I knew. Or thought I knew. Or I think I thought there was a me who thought there was a him. If there was. Etc. In my subjective experience, I did once watch my heart stop and my body crumble into dust and blow away in the wind. I was lying on the floor of Euston Station at the time. However since I'm here writing about it, obviously it didn't happen in consensual reality. |
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Post by Peter on Jul 10, 2011 2:43:57 GMT -5
I think it more sort of "rots" rather than vanishes. Or gets burned. If you insist on slo-mo, you could say that. If you fast forward or fast backward, it vanishes. Well I don't know that I'd insist on going "slo-mo" although that's sort of what I've been used to up until now. Interesting to think about other time frames. Like animals who live much faster than we do (eg insects who live their entire lives in a couple of days) must think we hang around for ever, moving like we experience continental drift. Very true that we'd vanish in the blink of an eye if life were lived in fast forward. Confusingly we'd actually be living apparently very slowly in that case, like the mountains. But you've no experience of that, so we're both using imagination here - yes? The real body is what I/we am/are, and is everywhere. How can it not exist? So more like a Multiverse thingy than the dictionary definition of a human body then. Not individuated. Don't you think it's changing all the "time"? |
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Post by karen on Jul 10, 2011 17:38:46 GMT -5
You've experienced your body rotting or getting cremated? This inquiry is only in your subjective experience - not some imagined empirical world. This is going to sound like a shaggy dog story, but it happened to a guy I knew. Or thought I knew. Or I think I thought there was a me who thought there was a him. If there was. Etc. In my subjective experience, I did once watch my heart stop and my body crumble into dust and blow away in the wind. I was lying on the floor of Euston Station at the time. However since I'm here writing about it, obviously it didn't happen in consensual reality. Your subjective experience was that that didn't happen, was it not? When do you experience consensual reality outside of your subjective experience? |
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Post by enigma on Jul 10, 2011 17:43:05 GMT -5
Lets all sign a consent form to agree that it really DID happen.  |
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Post by Peter on Jul 11, 2011 4:23:52 GMT -5
Your subjective experience was that that didn't happen, was it not? Hmm. Well the falling to dust thing both happened and didn't happen at the same time. I certainly felt pretty real at the time, but then, here I am. When do you experience consensual reality outside of your subjective experience? Well, never. Surely that's impossible by definition? I don't experience anything outside of my subjective experience. What is your point there, I don't get it? That saying "In my subjective experience" is redundant? |
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Post by Portto on Jul 11, 2011 8:28:04 GMT -5
Well I don't know that I'd insist on going "slo-mo" although that's sort of what I've been used to up until now. Interesting to think about other time frames. Like animals who live much faster than we do (eg insects who live their entire lives in a couple of days) must think we hang around for ever, moving like we experience continental drift. Very true that we'd vanish in the blink of an eye if life were lived in fast forward. Confusingly we'd actually be living apparently very slowly in that case, like the mountains. But you've no experience of that, so we're both using imagination here - yes? We are not using imagination - everybody has many such experiences. I also experience some 'weird flashes' in space/time, but there's no need for those. Remember an event from when you were ~10, or the one you mention above. How much time has passed? We might be tempted to say 20+ years, but it has actually happened in less than the blink of an eye. Another simple example is when you dream you're very old/young and then wake up and see another age. Yes, you know what the 'real body' is. But there's no multiverse. Change appears in the 'real body,' so how can the 'real body' change? |
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Post by karen on Jul 11, 2011 9:24:12 GMT -5
Your subjective experience was that that didn't happen, was it not? Hmm. Well the falling to dust thing both happened and didn't happen at the same time. I certainly felt pretty real at the time, but then, here I am. When do you experience consensual reality outside of your subjective experience? Well, never. Surely that's impossible by definition? I don't experience anything outside of my subjective experience. What is your point there, I don't get it? That saying "In my subjective experience" is redundant? BTW, where does the issuance of "real" come from? Look at something "real" and ask, where does it's "real" come from. There's no intellectual point - just pointing. If that line isn't helpful, please ignore and move on. |
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Post by Peter on Jul 11, 2011 13:43:00 GMT -5
There's no intellectual point - just pointing. If that line isn't helpful, please ignore and move on. If I ignored every question who's purpose I didn't understand, then I wouldn't learn very much now would I? |
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Post by Peter on Jul 13, 2011 2:39:20 GMT -5
Well first I felt my heart beat slow and then stop, and I was definitely feeling my body at that point - very visceral. I watched my heart stop as if I was seeing through my body from about 30cm away. Watching my body crumble to dust...I maybe had a vantage point a meter away or so. I had no awareness of the station floor at that point, and I didn't "feel" the wind blow the dust away, I just watched it. No, as you say, no sense of panic. Just a sadness that I was being parted from my family.
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Post by unveilable on Jul 13, 2011 6:20:33 GMT -5
I really like hearing your updates AT1. Please post more when you get a chance. On a side note I just came across this interesting vid from Adya about different kinds of awakening. www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4yf-usgDQw |
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