jenpa
Junior Member
Posts: 79
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Post by jenpa on Feb 4, 2011 22:07:01 GMT -5
I practice mindful meditation; letting go of thoughts lightly as they arise, and bringing my attention back to breath.
Usually during my meditation, when thoughts arise, they feel very close, like they are me, with not much space around them.
I can notice them and let them go and return to breath, but the gaps are short, one or two mindful breaths then back in thought — my mind is busy thinking away.
A couple of days ago during meditation I tried focusing on the witness.
(I've been reading I AM THAT: Talks with Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj) After a while I became aware of both my breath and thinking in what felt like a much larger space than before. My thoughts were as busy as usual, but they were farther away, and as if they were just flowing through in front of the me (the witness).
There was no getting hooked by my thoughts. I was detached until I became self conscious of this new perspective. Then I was back to my mind chatter. I was able to bring the perspective back again in small intervals.
Was I just trancing out on my imagination, or was any of this a glimpse?
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Post by angela on Feb 4, 2011 22:24:07 GMT -5
trust your instinct. your heart knows what is true for you.
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Post by enigma on Feb 5, 2011 0:48:50 GMT -5
The practice of controlling thoughts, diverting attention away, is delusional to the core. Which entity is thinking and which one is trying not to think? It should be obvious why it is not successful. Mindfullness is simply to notice, nothing else. This noticing is, itself, transformative.
Yes, the direction is deeper within. Who's thoughts? Are they true thoughts? Are they helpful and to whom? Who or what is aware of thoughts and can this one be seen?
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Post by zendancer on Feb 5, 2011 1:04:30 GMT -5
Jenpa: I have to use words to point to something that is beyond words, so please keep this in mind. LOL
You were not trancing out. Zen folks call this "a confirmatory experience," and several variations of this sort of thing are common. When we meditate, we are changing the way the brain is used. We are focusing upon the actual rather than staying lost in imagination. There is really no difference between focusing upon the witness, focusing upon the breath, shifting attention away from thoughts to what can be seen or heard, or even focusing upon thoughts. That which sees and hears is detaching from the usual roofbrain chatter. It is like staying in the train station and watching thought trains go by without jumping on board. The more often this is done the easier it becomes to stay in the station.
When you became aware of what was happening, you began to reflect upon it and imagination and internal speech got revved up again. Yes, you can sometimes make certain experiences come back, but don't try to do that! The very effort to get anything back will keep you from being present, and put you back in the mind. As soon as you realize that reflectivity has returned, put your attention back upon the actual. IOW, don't check on "your" progress because that reinforces the illusion that there is a "you" making progress. There isn't.
In essence, the path of non-duality is a path of leaving selfhood behind by becoming so involved in life that selfhood gets lost. Eventually, the structures of mind that support the illusion of selfhood simply collapse from disuse (the illusion is seen for what it is).
Nisargadatta discovered the truth because he trusted his guru totally, and he single-mindedly did what his guru told him to do. His guru told him to focus on the I am every minute of the day. If his guru had told him to put his attention upon what he could see or hear every minute of the day, he would have been just as successful because the same process would have unfolded.
As we shift our attention to the actual more and more often, an incredible variety of strange things can happen. This is because attentiveness (or noticing) puts pressure on the conventional structure of reality conceived by the mind. The psychological paradigm literally begins to crumble under the onslaught of the actual. If we stay with the actual, belief in the imaginary world of the mind must eventually disintegrate.
Go watch young children at play. If you follow the path of non-duality, that is where you are going. You will return to a child-like state of mind while retaining the full functionality of the intellect. The intellect will then be a servant rather than a master.
The danger that all serious seekers confront is getting attached to the extraordinary experiences that often occur as the meta-reality of the consensus trance starts to collapse. The best advice is to watch, but don't touch! The seeker is going somewhere that has no boundaries, so don't give up an old set of boundaries for a new set. Stay with not-knowing, and the marvelous truth will naturally unfold. It is alive, intimate, poignant, profound, wonderfully ordinary, and bursting with love. It is curious, playful, compassionate, thankful, and intuitive. The truth never knows what its doing, but it has a joyous time exploring the collosal wonder of its infinite being. To be awake is to be everlastingly amazed.
One last warning: don't forget that the ordinary is just as extraordinary as the extraordinary. When you're walking around during the day, bring the same attentiveness to everything you see that you brought to focusing on the witness.
The mysteriously real world that we all selflessly lived in as young children can be rediscovered, but not by the illusional character we think we are. That world is only discovered by who we really are. When that happens, we will say, like young Frankenstein after seeing his monster's first movements, "It's alive, Igor. It's alive!" LOL
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Post by zendancer on Feb 5, 2011 1:13:03 GMT -5
The practice of controlling thoughts, diverting attention away, is delusional to the core. Which entity is thinking and which one is trying not to think? It should be obvious why it is not successful. Mindfullness is simply to notice, nothing else. This noticing is, itself, transformative. Yes, the direction is deeper within. Who's thoughts? Are they true thoughts? Are they helpful and to whom? Who or what is aware of thoughts and can this one be seen? E: Some people might think we're saying something that conflicts, but both of our posts are saying the same thing in different ways. Jenpa: My entire post can be summed up in E's one phrase: "This noticing is, itself, transformative." |
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jenpa
Junior Member
Posts: 79
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Post by jenpa on Feb 5, 2011 1:51:50 GMT -5
Thank you Z, E and A. This has been very helpful.
I understand "This noticing is, itself, transformative."
Even after a sitting that is painfully ordinary, I find that afterwards, I have a lot more room in my head. And, generally I'm much more present and attentive to whatever it is I'm doing.
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Post by enigma on Feb 5, 2011 2:59:27 GMT -5
Good stuff, Zen. Your well informed perspective is always appreciated.
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Post by angela on Feb 5, 2011 10:07:45 GMT -5
"stay with not knowing"
amen. best advice ever. in my experience this integrity was the biggest kindness from the universe.
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jenpa
Junior Member
Posts: 79
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Post by jenpa on Feb 5, 2011 10:24:28 GMT -5
I agree A, "Stay with not knowing," that's a good one. Its like letting go continuously.
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