Deleted
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bubbles
Jan 30, 2011 7:19:14 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2011 7:19:14 GMT -5
The quote below is from a fellow named David Loy, a professor of comparative philosophy and a Zen Teacher. His first book was 'Nonduality: A Study in Comparative Philosophy.' This is taken from an interview of him in the Winter 2010 Insight Journal.
"When we practice we realize that our perceptions are being filtered, as if we are inside a mental fog, or a bubble that distorts everything. But we do not just suffer from this individual bubble, we are also together inside a group bubble that today is largely maintained by the media, which have become our collective “nervous system.” The two bubbles interact and work together,deluding Big Bubble, which feeds on our sense of lack. Consumerism is so addictive because advertising persuades us that the next thing we buy will make us happy -- it hooks onto our sense of lack."
"If the two delusion bubbles are not really separate, and if Buddhism is about popping my bubble, so we see things as they really are, can we really just focus on the small one? Don’t we need to find ways to address th larger bubble too? There is not only my own dukkha, from my own bubble, there are also powerful social forces creating enormous amounts of dukkha in the world. To wake up form my own suffering is to become aware of all the other suffering in the world, which is not separate from “my own.”"
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bubbles
Jan 30, 2011 11:43:53 GMT -5
Post by sharon on Jan 30, 2011 11:43:53 GMT -5
"If the two delusion bubbles are not really separate, and if Buddhism is about popping my bubble, so we see things as they really are, can we really just focus on the small one?"
Knowing that there aren't really any bubbles at all, must be found to be absolutely true first yeah?
Then the reality of keeping the small bubble popped seems to be directly linked to trusting the larger bubble. It becomes easy to see who has a transient bubble ~ A passport in the back pocket with which to work from and operate in the world.
"To wake up from my own suffering is to become aware of all the other suffering in the world, which is not separate from 'my own'.”
Yes ~ the sensitivity of not having a bubble brings with it a whole new way of being. A balancing act. A refinement of love's intelligence.
There is a vulnerability that comes from knowing that it is oxygen that keeps the bubble afloat.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2011 9:39:47 GMT -5
the valorization of "human agency" is an ideological lynchpin for capitalism. Without the notion of the the agentic individual, any capitalist social formation would crumble.
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bubbles
Jun 3, 2011 11:23:48 GMT -5
Post by enigma on Jun 3, 2011 11:23:48 GMT -5
The big bubble is just what happens when a lot of little bubbles rub together. There isn't 'my delusion' and then lots of bigger delusions that are making my delusion what it is. Addressing the 'larger bubble' from within the distortion of my smaller bubble just shows me my slimy reflection on the surface. As Niz said, 'Pop your own bubble and see if there are still suds.' (Well, okay, I paraphrased)
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maxie
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bubbles
Jun 3, 2011 11:41:06 GMT -5
Post by maxie on Jun 3, 2011 11:41:06 GMT -5
The big bubble is just what happens when a lot of little bubbles rub together. There isn't 'my delusion' and then lots of bigger delusions that are making my delusion what it is. Addressing the 'larger bubble' from within the distortion of my smaller bubble just shows me my slimy reflection on the surface. As Niz said, 'Pop your own bubble and see if there are still suds.' (Well, okay, I paraphrased) No, that was it. He then adds, "I am that."
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Deleted
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bubbles
Jun 3, 2011 11:54:04 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2011 11:54:04 GMT -5
well i hope there will always be time for suds post-bubble. salud!
I’m thinking that this “sense of lack” that Loy points to is the same sort of thing that is behind the search for happiness that you mentioned a few threads ago.
The bubble is that belief in other; that happiness is out there somewhere or maybe will be developed with enough effort. The slimy film is constantly being recreated by this investment in that belief. At root that investment is what the buddha was talking about way long ago prior to advertising (not to say that there weren't other slime-inducing cultural/societal factors). Loy seems to be pointing to the fact that the investment in that belief of otherness is also supported and encouraged by a system which depends on separation.
So, in addition to popping the immediate bubble, those systemic thingies thriving and inducing bubbledom should also be zapped.
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bubbles
Jun 3, 2011 21:06:38 GMT -5
Post by enigma on Jun 3, 2011 21:06:38 GMT -5
Well, it would be natural for persons who are invested in that belief to form structures that are aligned with it, but this doesn't imply anything at all can be done with the structure as long as the beliefs remain. If you built the Sun God statue to honor your belief, it's not the statue that makes you believe.
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Deleted
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bubbles
Jun 6, 2011 10:49:32 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2011 10:49:32 GMT -5
But isn’t part of the structure to reproduce belief in the structure? The SunGod is placed everywhere – in cribs, on binkies, staring down from a mobile, on the handlebars of the first trike, on the first shoes, staring out from the side of a jar of mashed chicken dinner…
i agree that only by popping those belief-bubbles can the SunGod be seen for what it is, which is just a lump of plaster or whatever. But meanwhile those SunGod icons are being imprinted on innocent minds.
It is not the statue that makes you believe, and one can not be forced to believe. But if it is spoonfed from birth and we are awash in thousands of images of it daily, how is that not being forced?
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bubbles
Jun 6, 2011 11:27:15 GMT -5
Post by enigma on Jun 6, 2011 11:27:15 GMT -5
I didn't mean to say anything about force. We go to war to force our beliefs, so clearly that happens, but the sun god symbol isn't really used to reproduce a belief so much as to honor something that's considered useful and important, and to pass the knowledge of it on to others so that they can benefit too. IOW, the belief drives the reinforcing so nothing can be done about all the sun god symbols and teaching about the sun god and forcing others to accept the sun god until the beliefs change. All of that is just a predictable expression of the belief.
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Deleted
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bubbles
Jun 22, 2011 9:07:41 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 9:07:41 GMT -5
"If nonviolence is a stand, then it would be an attack on violence. But the most visible form of violence is revolutionary and liberational violence. So if you stand for nonviolence, you automatically stand against actual revolution and liberation. Quite distressing! 'No! We are not against revolution or liberation. We are against the other side, the side of the institutions, the side of the oppressors. The violence of the system is much more destructive, much more harmful, although it is well hidden. We call it institutional violence. By calling ourselves nonviolent we are against all violence, but we are first against institutional violence.'"
Thich Nhat Hanh
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bubbles
Jun 22, 2011 9:12:19 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 9:12:19 GMT -5
"When the Buddha created a politically involved community he did so by turning his politic inwardly. It's not that there is suffering "out there," he taught, but "I am suffering." When I begin taking care of how I suffer -- how I too am greedy and angry -- then I begin to understand same energies in others, even those patterns in institutions."
Michael Stone
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bubbles
Jun 22, 2011 10:58:42 GMT -5
Post by heretic on Jun 22, 2011 10:58:42 GMT -5
"When the Buddha created a politically involved community he did so by turning his politic inwardly. It's not that there is suffering "out there," he taught, but "I am suffering." When I begin taking care of how I suffer -- how I too am greedy and angry -- then I begin to understand same energies in others, even those patterns in institutions." Michael Stone Nicely shared, max. Yes, if we want to decrease our suffering and the suffering of others, then we have to wake up to our own potential. Nice to meet you.
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bubbles
Jun 22, 2011 11:12:36 GMT -5
Post by therealfake on Jun 22, 2011 11:12:36 GMT -5
Yes, gaining freedom pops your own bubble, but does it abdicate your responsibility for being in this unfathomable world?... You are more responsible now for your actions, then you were before you popped your bubble. Is fighting the battle of popping the bigger bubble freedom? Especially when most peeps don't even know there's a war... You only have to be responsible for yourself, and consequently others who have relationships with you. That means knowing about your sense of lack and cutting everything out of your life that upholds that illusory belief. Is freedom really freedom if you can't even be true to yourself? Popping the bubble also means to put away the dishes, otherwise your just playing a spiritual game of best dressed guru...
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bubbles
Jun 22, 2011 12:12:18 GMT -5
Post by heretic on Jun 22, 2011 12:12:18 GMT -5
I cannot push a wave onto shore any faster than the ocean brings it in. Until then, I'll wash, and put away the dishes. Love
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bubbles
Jun 22, 2011 16:33:27 GMT -5
Post by heretic on Jun 22, 2011 16:33:27 GMT -5
sensai....the dishes have been washed, dried, and put away. Your sandals have been resoled, and their lasts have been scrubbed with English saddle soap. I've even oiled their latches. Then, I took a moment to write a long overdue letter to myself... Dear Habit Energy, I see you. Love, heretic All that's left to do in this ever renewing moment is invite the bell... Body, speech, and mind in perfect oneness- I send my heart along with the sound of the bell. May the hearers awaken from forgetfulness and transcend all anxiety and sorrow. If you would be so kind as to sound it.
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