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Post by enigma on Aug 29, 2014 11:04:23 GMT -5
As somebody just said about science, it can't answer the question of how consciousness arose from matter. The question can't be answered because it didn't. Are you really going to break the hearts of all those scientists working on the problem of consciousness? And who is it that "sees" consciousness and Djin? Science is a kind of game that keeps refining it's rules, but as with any game, there are strict boundaries and you can't move the pieces off the board. For the science game, that boundary is objectivity. If 'reality' is actually subjective, then it requires a different sort of game. My sense is that this new game will look a bit like a merging of science, philosophy, psychology and spirituality. If that were to happen, it might imply that mankind was on the verge of awakening.
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Post by enigma on Aug 29, 2014 11:08:43 GMT -5
I'm talking about the same ordered universe that everyone else talks about, I just don't conclude that there's a personal God behind it. However, it doesn't seem like a stretch to say there is intelligence behind it. I'm still not getting what you mean by 'order.' Or 'intelligence' for that matter. Is an example of order like breathing? In, out, in, out. Is it a crystal or snowflake? Is it hydrogen bonding? a spiderweb? How teeth line up in a row? .... Yeah. Yeah, that one.
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Post by laughter on Aug 29, 2014 11:17:21 GMT -5
Are you really going to break the hearts of all those scientists working on the problem of consciousness? And who is it that "sees" consciousness and Djin? Science is a kind of game that keeps refining it's rules, but as with any game, there are strict boundaries and you can't move the pieces off the board. For the science game, that boundary is objectivity. If 'reality' is actually subjective, then it requires a different sort of game. My sense is that this new game will look a bit like a merging of science, philosophy, psychology and spirituality. If that were to happen, it might imply that mankind was on the verge of awakening.What if it's already happened?
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Post by enigma on Aug 29, 2014 11:54:17 GMT -5
Science is a kind of game that keeps refining it's rules, but as with any game, there are strict boundaries and you can't move the pieces off the board. For the science game, that boundary is objectivity. If 'reality' is actually subjective, then it requires a different sort of game. My sense is that this new game will look a bit like a merging of science, philosophy, psychology and spirituality. If that were to happen, it might imply that mankind was on the verge of awakening.What if it's already happened? You figgr mankind has already awakened? Bummer.
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Post by laughter on Aug 29, 2014 12:10:11 GMT -5
What if it's already happened? You figgr mankind has already awakened? Bummer. Bummer? In terms of the appearance of mankind, what I'd describe is a constant dance at the edge of a precipice, and any intervals in the sweep of history that seemed otherwise are simply too narrow of a focus for that to be apparent. The potential for a self-species-induced extinction event predates my birth, and from what I know of human nature, the fact that it hasn't happened during my lifetime is one of those lucky little miracles similar to how far the Earth is from the Sun or the fact that there would likely be no life as we know it without the Moon and the Earths iron core. How would the appearance of an awakened mankind differ from what appears to us today?
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Post by silver on Aug 29, 2014 12:17:39 GMT -5
What if it's already happened? You figgr mankind has already awakened? Bummer. You thought you missed it? (It's not a concert....or is it?)
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Post by enigma on Aug 29, 2014 12:40:44 GMT -5
You figgr mankind has already awakened? Bummer. Bummer? In terms of the appearance of mankind, what I'd describe is a constant dance at the edge of a precipice, and any intervals in the sweep of history that seemed otherwise are simply too narrow of a focus for that to be apparent. The potential for a self-species-induced extinction event predates my birth, and from what I know of human nature, the fact that it hasn't happened during my lifetime is one of those lucky little miracles similar to how far the Earth is from the Sun or the fact that there would likely be no life as we know it without the Moon and the Earths iron core. I'm lost. Is awakening equivalent to species induced extinction? It would differ in that there would be less zombies. (and zombie movies)
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Post by enigma on Aug 29, 2014 12:41:49 GMT -5
You figgr mankind has already awakened? Bummer. You thought you missed it? (It's not a concert....or is it?) Yeah, I musta been asleep.
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Post by someNOTHING! on Aug 29, 2014 14:57:10 GMT -5
Do you have an example of what you mean by 'order'? I'm talking about the same ordered universe that everyone else talks about, I just don't conclude that there's a personal God behind it. However, it doesn't seem like a stretch to say there is intelligence behind it.
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Post by someNOTHING! on Aug 29, 2014 14:59:21 GMT -5
Are you really going to break the hearts of all those scientists working on the problem of consciousness? And who is it that "sees" consciousness and Djin? Science is a kind of game that keeps refining it's rules, but as with any game, there are strict boundaries and you can't move the pieces off the board. For the science game, that boundary is objectivity. If 'reality' is actually subjective, then it requires a different sort of game. My sense is that this new game will look a bit like a merging of science, philosophy, psychology and spirituality. If that were to happen, it might imply that mankind was on the verge of awakening. Sciphipsyspi would probably be a fun class to teach/take, but hard to grade!
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Post by laughter on Aug 29, 2014 18:07:07 GMT -5
Bummer? In terms of the appearance of mankind, what I'd describe is a constant dance at the edge of a precipice, and any intervals in the sweep of history that seemed otherwise are simply too narrow of a focus for that to be apparent. The potential for a self-species-induced extinction event predates my birth, and from what I know of human nature, the fact that it hasn't happened during my lifetime is one of those lucky little miracles similar to how far the Earth is from the Sun or the fact that there would likely be no life as we know it without the Moon and the Earths iron core. I'm lost. Is awakening equivalent to species induced extinction? Nah, 'coarse knot . The fact that it hasn't happened yet came to mind as one reflection of appearances that run counter to human history. I guess I was just speculatively anticipating your answer to the question. It would differ in that there would be less zombies. (and zombie movies) Well do you have like a population % in mind? How would this be determined? Is there a zombie test? (other than engaging peeps in correspondence on the interwebs that is ) Would you expect the # of zombies to ever get to zero? And would the awakening be a process that would happen over time where there was an increasing # of non-zombies or all at once like? I'm not taking a position on this idea one way or another as to whether this might happen or already has, just curious as to what it means to you.
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Post by laughter on Aug 29, 2014 18:17:02 GMT -5
I'm talking about the same ordered universe that everyone else talks about, I just don't conclude that there's a personal God behind it. However, it doesn't seem like a stretch to say there is intelligence behind it. This is obviously a bit of self-indulgent TMT on my part but if you consider that picture in the context of what's referred to as the "fractal nature of the Universe" (which evidently has a limit) .. .. well, yeah .. like, wow.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 18:46:16 GMT -5
It would differ in that there would be less zombies. (and zombie movies) currently the zombies are winning, in a rout........ I think the looking at things through personal filters has something to do with it
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Post by silver on Aug 29, 2014 18:49:01 GMT -5
Science is a kind of game that keeps refining it's rules, but as with any game, there are strict boundaries and you can't move the pieces off the board. For the science game, that boundary is objectivity. If 'reality' is actually subjective, then it requires a different sort of game. My sense is that this new game will look a bit like a merging of science, philosophy, psychology and spirituality. If that were to happen, it might imply that mankind was on the verge of awakening. Sciphipsyspi would probably be a fun class to teach/take, but hard to grade! I was dumb enough to try n google it!
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Post by enigma on Aug 29, 2014 19:14:30 GMT -5
Science is a kind of game that keeps refining it's rules, but as with any game, there are strict boundaries and you can't move the pieces off the board. For the science game, that boundary is objectivity. If 'reality' is actually subjective, then it requires a different sort of game. My sense is that this new game will look a bit like a merging of science, philosophy, psychology and spirituality. If that were to happen, it might imply that mankind was on the verge of awakening. Sciphipsyspi would probably be a fun class to teach/take, but hard to grade! The students would have to grade themselves.
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