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Post by zendancer on Apr 12, 2014 15:31:38 GMT -5
One moment of cosmic consciousness gives a whole different perspective on the idea of infiniteness. The word that comes to mind during and after a CC experience is "infinite," not "emptiness." The idea of emptiness arises as one tries to communicate the flavor of what one sees when looking at the world in mental silence when the intellect is quiescent.
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Post by Transcix on Apr 12, 2014 15:52:34 GMT -5
One moment of cosmic consciousness gives a whole different perspective on the idea of infiniteness. The word that comes to mind during and after a CC experience is "infinite," not "emptiness." The idea of emptiness arises as one tries to communicate the flavor of what one sees when looking at the world in mental silence when the intellect is quiescent. Exactly, one moment, realized in contrast to mundane reality, can distort one's perception of Emptiness, make it out to be more extravagant, forgetting that less is more. You can't always live in cosmic consciousness, so to understand it you have to take into consideration that you're only getting a glimpse. To integrate it into yourself requires a little mellowing out, the twilight of the mind, that's what Emptiness is for you, not some giant exploding thing. It seems giant and exploding as your whole reality first explodes, but afterwards once you get the drift then it mellows out.
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Post by tzujanli on Apr 12, 2014 16:01:01 GMT -5
Endlessness.. without limits.. time/space limitlessness..
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2014 16:01:37 GMT -5
One moment of cosmic consciousness gives a whole different perspective on the idea of infiniteness. The word that comes to mind during and after a CC experience is "infinite," not "emptiness." The idea of emptiness arises as one tries to communicate the flavor of what one sees when looking at the world in mental silence when the intellect is quiescent. It really doesn't matter to me whether thought calls it infinite or empty. The fact is that thought wasn't there to make the observation in the first place.
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Post by silence on Apr 12, 2014 16:15:53 GMT -5
One moment of cosmic consciousness gives a whole different perspective on the idea of infiniteness. The word that comes to mind during and after a CC experience is "infinite," not "emptiness." The idea of emptiness arises as one tries to communicate the flavor of what one sees when looking at the world in mental silence when the intellect is quiescent. One mans cosmic consciousness experience is another mans self induced hallucination.
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Post by silence on Apr 12, 2014 16:21:05 GMT -5
One moment of cosmic consciousness gives a whole different perspective on the idea of infiniteness. The word that comes to mind during and after a CC experience is "infinite," not "emptiness." The idea of emptiness arises as one tries to communicate the flavor of what one sees when looking at the world in mental silence when the intellect is quiescent. It really doesn't matter to me whether thought calls it infinite or empty. The fact is that thought wasn't there to make the observation in the first place. I would actually say it's an explosion of thought rather than a vacuum where thought comes in afterwards. Rather the more complex verbal type of thought gives way to more primordial movements during that time.
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Post by Transcix on Apr 12, 2014 16:21:32 GMT -5
One moment of cosmic consciousness gives a whole different perspective on the idea of infiniteness. The word that comes to mind during and after a CC experience is "infinite," not "emptiness." The idea of emptiness arises as one tries to communicate the flavor of what one sees when looking at the world in mental silence when the intellect is quiescent. It really doesn't matter to me whether thought calls it infinite or empty. The fact is that thought wasn't there to make the observation in the first place. Thoughts are powerful though.. usually in a negative way.. words are also powerful like this.. and while not necessarily for you, in the wider marketplace of ideas these semantics make a big difference..
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2014 16:41:29 GMT -5
It really doesn't matter to me whether thought calls it infinite or empty. The fact is that thought wasn't there to make the observation in the first place. Thoughts are powerful though.. usually in a negative way.. words are also powerful like this.. and while not necessarily for you, in the wider marketplace of ideas these semantics make a big difference.. That's true of course. But as you say from my perspective, it's like Infinity and his friend Emptiness telling me that they've been to Turkey. When I ask them what it was like they can't tell me because neither of them were really there.
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Post by Transcix on Apr 12, 2014 16:50:35 GMT -5
Hehehe, that's a nice way to put it.
But by your initial posting, are you merely expressing yourself, sharing, that it doesn't matter to you what It's called, or are you implicitly suggesting that it shouldn't matter at all what It's called?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2014 17:03:27 GMT -5
Hehehe, that's a nice way to put it. But by your initial posting, are you merely expressing yourself, sharing, that it doesn't matter to you what It's called, or are you implicitly suggesting that it shouldn't matter at all what It's called? I don't have any direct experience of what is being discussed here. I'm only sharing what others have said. I myself would never suggest that it shouldn't matter what It's called, because obviously it does matter to some people.
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Post by topology on Apr 12, 2014 17:09:28 GMT -5
Will you indulge me and engage in a process of deconstruction of your tacit assumptions? The fact that you have to "attribute" finiteness should clue you into the fact that there is some level of arbitrary categorization going on which should be challenged. In mathematics the interval (0,1) in the Real numbers is bounded but not finite. It is infinitely divisible and isomorphic to all the real numbers. So being bounded is not grounds for a classification of being finite. Also consider a two dimensional pair from Rx{0,1}. The first x dimension of the pair (x,y) is any number in R, there are infinitely many. The second dimension, y, is either 0 or 1. Focussing on the finiteness of the second dimension and ignoring the infiniteness of the first dimension to argue that the space of the pairs is finite is cherry picking and a logical fallacy. Let's pick one concrete example of something finite and deconstruct the assumptions that go into "attributing" finiteness. With regards to the experience of consciousness and thought. I wouldn't say, but some have said that the arising of the mind in the form of thought is an "apparent" finiteness. In other words the mind as thought arises as an "apparent limit" on infinite consciousness. When the thought comes to an end the infinite consciousness ceases to be veiled by the apparent limit or finiteness of thought. So all the apparent finite objects that we see are actually made of a single infinite substance called pure consciousness. One would think that a single brush stroke is limited, but when the "limited" comes together in just the right way to induce a few moments of awe, the face of God is revealed.
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Post by topology on Apr 12, 2014 17:16:58 GMT -5
With regards to the experience of consciousness and thought. I wouldn't say, but some have said that the arising of the mind in the form of thought is an "apparent" finiteness. In other words the mind as thought arises as an "apparent limit" on infinite consciousness. When the thought comes to an end the infinite consciousness ceases to be veiled by the apparent limit or finiteness of thought. So all the apparent finite objects that we see are actually made of a single infinite substance called pure consciousness. Exactly, except when you label Emptiness as "infinity" then you're still thinking conventionally and you're missing the ISness of it. Even "Emptiness" isn't a perfect term, obviously, but hell we need some way to refer to it! Topology: From an aware sentient perspective, a limit is only ever a constituent of a framework towards potentially limitless freedom, where the potential limitlessness doesn't imply nullification of the framework, and where the freedom doesn't imply separation from the framework. Freedom within the framework of reality refers not to a transient feeling of being free on a sunny day at the park, it refers to actually having one's modality of being aligned with the structure or grid of reality such that as an agent of consciousness one can, sustainably, simultaneously change and remain intact/coherent in a way that's both self-sustaining as well as context-bound.Being in alignment is the natural state of things. It is resistance to the flow of life, i.e. when people try to impose their preconceptions of "being in alignment", that life tends to go haywire. You speak of yourself as something less than consciousness, an agent bounded by some context. When you realize yourself as the context for all things, freedom is moot. Alignment is always and effortless.
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Post by Transcix on Apr 12, 2014 17:22:31 GMT -5
One would think that a single brush stroke is limited, but when the "limited" comes together in just the right way to induce a few moments of awe, the face of God is revealed. I truly mean to offense, and with all due respect, I find this vantage point utterly, utterly disgusting. Things don't ever come together 'in just the right way', although it can be perceived as such. It's not heresy to point out the underlying structure and pattern of the movement. There's nothing innocent or pure about being unadulterated by knowledge. Let go of the surprise and spectacle of awe, stop gawking, stop succumbing, rise up and be.
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Post by topology on Apr 12, 2014 17:28:29 GMT -5
One would think that a single brush stroke is limited, but when the "limited" comes together in just the right way to induce a few moments of awe, the face of God is revealed. I truly mean to offense, and with all due respect, I find this vantage point utterly, utterly disgusting. Things don't ever come together 'in just the right way', although it can be perceived as such. It's not heresy to point out the underlying structure and pattern of the movement. There's nothing innocent or pure about being unadulterated by knowledge. Let go of the surprise and spectacle of awe, stop gawking, stop succumbing, rise up and be. You'll have to try harder than that. ;-) I didn't know being (existing) required anything, let alone rising up. I don't think you and I are communicating on the same frequency yet.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2014 17:30:38 GMT -5
One moment of cosmic consciousness gives a whole different perspective on the idea of infiniteness. The word that comes to mind during and after a CC experience is "infinite," not "emptiness." The idea of emptiness arises as one tries to communicate the flavor of what one sees when looking at the world in mental silence when the intellect is quiescent. One mans cosmic consciousness experience is another mans self induced hallucination. Which man is correct?
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