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Post by Reefs on Jul 3, 2013 10:19:39 GMT -5
You had a realization about realizations? That's some deep doo doo there dude. No. I had a realization about the nature of ideas/things, and in that realization, 'realizations' themselves were seen through. Might be wrong but you seem to be basking in a realization, which is all part of the process, but that too will pass. And that 'see-thru' realization is important and all other realizations are not? Sounds like a rigid mental position.
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Post by Reefs on Jul 3, 2013 10:21:03 GMT -5
'Mental water polo' is the phrase I use. And....you are basking in the realization that you are not mind. Hence why you call yourself 'Beingist'. A good thing to do for a while might be to swap your name to 'Illusionist' I guess he would if that title wouldn't have been taken by you already.
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Post by enigma on Jul 3, 2013 10:21:44 GMT -5
Right, you're trying to run away from what's really happening in favor of what seems to be happening. After all your spearatuall work you've come full circle back to self delusion. When you push a button on your computer, you do it with the intention of it coming on, yes? When you put a car in gear, there is a some slight sense of being in control of the car, yes? As opposed to when the car is careering out of control after hitting some ice. When someone calls your name, you recognize that they are talking to you, don't you? When you are at the grocery store, you choose between products don't you? It may well all be delusion, but its not the point. This is an experience of physical reality and that stuff is part of the experience. Of course you can say that 'physical reality' is an illusion but that's not going to change the experience. I have come back full circle, no longer insistent on putting a boundary up between reality/illusion, clarity/delusion, actuality/imagination, truth/falsity. The path of least resistance is no longer (for me) about trying to fight what seems to be the case. I experience the existence of a dog, and that's really okay. Seeing through the illusion isn't about denying your experience, but rather ceasing to entertain your imaginary conclusions about it. You're full to the brim with conclusions about your experience and that of others. When you see that intention, control and identity are illusions, you don't need to stop intending, controlling and answering to your name. Just notice what in blazes is really going on and stop pretending something else is going on. The "path of least resistance" as prescribed by ego, will be self centered delusion. What path do you think ego was following before you got all speerichool and wise?
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Post by Reefs on Jul 3, 2013 10:24:51 GMT -5
Sometimes I use the word 'stuck' to describe what I see in people, and I use that word to describe the cementing of a position following a realization. It doesn't sound to me like you are cementing. You seem to have cemented yourself in that 'all is just a play of ideas' position after your 'see-thru' realization. Don't take your realization so seriously. It's just a conclusion.
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Post by andrew on Jul 3, 2013 10:27:05 GMT -5
Notice that I said 'proverbial void'. You have a habit of conveniently taking the bits of you want from what I say to suit your agenda. By and large I address whole messages. As if that would change anything. Course it does. You really don't get this non-duality stuff do you?
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Post by andrew on Jul 3, 2013 10:30:45 GMT -5
It could be taken as a compliment, but it wasn't meant that way. Though neither was it meant as an insult as such, more just as a slightly comedic ironic observation. Gasp! You were mocking again! I wouldn't say that is 'mocking' in the same way that I am mocking yours and E's idea that 'its all imaginary except realizations', but its along those lines I guess, yes.
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Post by andrew on Jul 3, 2013 10:32:10 GMT -5
You had a realization about realizations? That's some deep doo doo there dude. Andy seems to see that realization about realizations as crucial. Realizations are important after all. I said they were important, but the realization about realizations supersedes all other ones, and even itself.
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Post by andrew on Jul 3, 2013 10:37:49 GMT -5
No. I had a realization about the nature of ideas/things, and in that realization, 'realizations' themselves were seen through. Might be wrong but you seem to be basking in a realization, which is all part of the process, but that too will pass. And that 'see-thru' realization is important and all other realizations are not? Sounds like a rigid mental position. I never said that other realizations are not important, that's your giraffe. There is no separation, there is no free will, the issue of free will is misconceived, there is no self, I am not the bodymind....these are all useful realizations that collapse attachments. There are others too. But there is one realization to rule them all, one realization to find them, one realization to bring them all and in the darkness bind them. Hehe.
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Post by Beingist on Jul 3, 2013 10:41:07 GMT -5
'Mental water polo' is the phrase I use. Well, 'hyper-minding' and 'utter confusion' describe it just fine. Indeed, 'hyper-minding' seems to work for me, though Andrew doesn't seem 'confused'. Utterly confusing, perhaps. E is sometimes the same, though not as often.
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Post by topology on Jul 3, 2013 10:42:40 GMT -5
Andy seems to see that realization about realizations as crucial. Realizations are important after all. I said they were important, but the realization about realizations supersedes all other ones, and even itself. You mean it has primacy, even above itself?!? *mind commits seppuku*
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Post by andrew on Jul 3, 2013 10:42:53 GMT -5
When you push a button on your computer, you do it with the intention of it coming on, yes? When you put a car in gear, there is a some slight sense of being in control of the car, yes? As opposed to when the car is careering out of control after hitting some ice. When someone calls your name, you recognize that they are talking to you, don't you? When you are at the grocery store, you choose between products don't you? It may well all be delusion, but its not the point. This is an experience of physical reality and that stuff is part of the experience. Of course you can say that 'physical reality' is an illusion but that's not going to change the experience. I have come back full circle, no longer insistent on putting a boundary up between reality/illusion, clarity/delusion, actuality/imagination, truth/falsity. The path of least resistance is no longer (for me) about trying to fight what seems to be the case. I experience the existence of a dog, and that's really okay. Seeing through the illusion isn't about denying your experience, but rather ceasing to entertain your imaginary conclusions about it. You're full to the brim with conclusions about your experience and that of others. When you see that intention, control and identity are illusions, you don't need to stop intending, controlling and answering to your name. Just notice what in blazes is really going on and stop pretending something else is going on. The "path of least resistance" as prescribed by ego, will be self centered delusion. What path do you think ego was following before you got all speerichool and wise? I experience choosing between groceries, I experience cause and effect (pushing a button and the computer coming on), I experience control of a car, I experience recognizing when someone call's my name, I experience the existence of a dog. And it all just happens very directly and spontaneously. Have you found a way to pretend that you don't experience that stuff? I HAVE seen that those things are illusion, but my need to put in a boundary between illusion and reality is no longer there. You still need those boundaries, and then when you get tired of them you collapse them into a fictitious 'ultimate', which is still a mental fixed box.
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Post by andrew on Jul 3, 2013 10:44:16 GMT -5
I said they were important, but the realization about realizations supersedes all other ones, and even itself. You mean it has primacy, even above itself?!? *mind commits seppuku* Exactly! Mind commits seppuku. Essentially the superceding realization collapses all former realizations, and even collapses itself i.e all realizations are released to the proverbial void.
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Post by andrew on Jul 3, 2013 10:46:34 GMT -5
Sometimes I use the word 'stuck' to describe what I see in people, and I use that word to describe the cementing of a position following a realization. It doesn't sound to me like you are cementing. You seem to have cemented yourself in that 'all is just a play of ideas' position after your 'see-thru' realization. Don't take your realization so seriously. It's just a conclusion. The superceding realization cannot come with cementing, by definition of the realization. Again, you don't understand what is being pointed to or suggested.
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Post by topology on Jul 3, 2013 10:47:02 GMT -5
You mean it has primacy, even above itself?!? *mind commits seppuku* Exactly! Mind commits seppuku. Essentially the superceding realization collapses all former realizations, and even collapses itself i.e all realizations are released to the proverbial void. Wasn't quite the reason my mind was attempting seppuku in this case.
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Post by Beingist on Jul 3, 2013 10:47:22 GMT -5
I said they were important, but the realization about realizations supersedes all other ones, and even itself. You mean it has primacy, even above itself?!? *mind commits seppuku* Is that anything like hari-kiri?
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