PLEASE

[OMG]

To whom it may concern:


Please get rid of the 'karma' function ASAP.

I have come to the conclusion that it is contributory to an atmosphere of negativity and personality conflict in that it encourages a childish impulse to 'reward' those who mirror personal preference or 'punish' those who don't. Like a childhood popularity contest with winners and losers

It's not only insidious but especially ridiculous in the sense that it is entirely 'personality' oriented, not at all the humor element it was probably intended as, but an artificial and distortive contrivance; an instrument of continuous petty labeling, marginalization, divisiveness, and factionalization - undermines sense of community. That on a 'spiritual' site which (ambiguously?) professes an impersonal non-dual orientation.

I used it twice soon after joining: to take an action and then because got a negative impression of it, immediately reversed the action. No more.

Think about it. What I mean is, what kind of place do you want the site to be? According to my preference - I would 'smite' it in a heartbeat.

OMG

[arisha]

If you don't like it, don't use it. Simple like that.
If it bothers you it's a sign of some spiritual immaturity. Try to overcome it, please.

[OMG]

Feb 16, 2013 1:37:32 GMT -5 arisha said:

If you don't like it, don't use it. Simple like that.
If it bothers you it's a sign of some spiritual immaturity. Try to overcome it, please.

Hi arisha,

Repeating what I said already in case you missed it:

I don't like it and therefore I do not use it . And that by itself is simple.

What may be more nuanced, is not that using it is nececssarily a sign of 'spiritual immaturity', but that in my view (and hence my plea) - it contributes to a certain tone, a gestalt in the community, one that people identify as pervasive, negative, and unproductive - yet one you evidently enjoy, and why probably that point has escaped your grasp.

OMG

[topology]

I think the tone is set by the people. Taking away the karma system isn't going to change their inclinations. Yes it is an overt medium for egoic game playing. The games will get played, overtly and covertly even without the system. At least with it there is some chance for conscious reflection within a person for looking at when and why they push the smite or exalt button and looking at how their ego reacts to receiving or losing "karma". But I suppose that self-aware orientation has to be there already as well.

OMG, can you be more specific (perhaps specific instances on the board) about how the system is a detriment in your eyes? What harm are you seeing?

[arisha]

Feb 16, 2013 13:42:13 GMT -5 OMG said:

Feb 16, 2013 1:37:32 GMT -5 arisha said:

If you don't like it, don't use it. Simple like that.
If it bothers you it's a sign of some spiritual immaturity. Try to overcome it, please.

Hi arisha,

Repeating what I said already in case you missed it:

I don't like it and therefore I do not use it . And that by itself is simple.

What may be more nuanced, is not that using it is nececssarily a sign of 'spiritual immaturity', but that in my view (and hence my plea) - it contributes to a certain tone, a gestalt in the community, one that people identify as pervasive, negative, and unproductive - yet one you evidently enjoy, and why probably that point has escaped your grasp.

OMG

No, I never used it, and am not going to use it. Just don't care about it. I see it a bit childish.

[Deleted]

Feb 16, 2013 0:11:09 GMT -5 OMG said:

To whom it may concern:


Please get rid of the 'karma' function ASAP.

I have come to the conclusion that it is contributory to an atmosphere of negativity and personality conflict in that it encourages a childish impulse to 'reward' those who mirror personal preference or 'punish' those who don't. Like a childhood popularity contest with winners and losers

It's not only insidious but especially ridiculous in the sense that it is entirely 'personality' oriented, not at all the humor element it was probably intended as, but an artificial and distortive contrivance; an instrument of continuous petty labeling, marginalization, divisiveness, and factionalization - undermines sense of community. That on a 'spiritual' site which (ambiguously?) professes an impersonal non-dual orientation.

I used it twice soon after joining: to take an action and then because got a negative impression of it, immediately reversed the action. No more.

Think about it. What I mean is, what kind of place do you want the site to be? According to my preference - I would 'smite' it in a heartbeat.

OMG

There is an episode of...wow..total memory crash...and i just watched a few eposides the other week...hang on a mo...Oh, The X Files.

So, there's an episode of The X Files where Mulder has found a real Genie and she grants him three wishes.
The story is quite interesting because it hilights the all too common stupid attitude of people,
as expressed throught the Genie character who, being immortal, is sick of being found by people who ask for really stupid, selfish and temporal things,
and she's suffered for centuries as see watches humans behaving badly.

The empahsis is on human greed and stupidity, but also how easy it is to be selfish
because half of the story is about the girl who has become a Genie and is trapped in her own eternal hell.
She suffers because she experiences time and time again that she has unlimited power to fulfil anyone's wishes
but utopia on earth has still not been achieved because of the stupidity aspects of human nature.

Mulder, the resident intelligent and insightful human on the show, who's passion is truth and good will to all people, ponders his three wishes very carefully.

The next day, his first wish is peace on earth. The Genie says after a few seconds, "Done."
Mulder is amazed that it took the Genie so little time to achieve peace throughtout the world.
He runs outside to check, and is first shocked, then realises why the Genie took little time.
The Genie created peace on earth simply by removing all the people.

Mulder goes back inside and questions the Genie's action.
The Genie says because of human nature, this is the only way to produce peace on earth.

Mulder's second wish is to restore all the people. The Genie says, "Done."
Mulder goes outside and yep, everyone has returned.
This is when the Genie describes her centuries of observing humans and how not one person
has asked for something worthwhile for all of humanity's benefit, and that humans actually do not need a Genie to create a global utopia.

Mulder's last wish, the final scene when Skully asked him what his last wish was,
he asked that the genie become a normal human like everyone else.
to which the scene ends with the view of this ex Genie happily living a normal mortal life.

Getting rid of the karma function isn't going to stop people from behaving unlovingly towards another.
Changing the external environment doesn't change a person's internal world.
A person can use external means to express the abundance of their being to another.
Changing the external means, will not change what inside them, they will simply express their being via another transportation method.

The problem is not the karma device, the problem is inside the human device.

[OMG]

Feb 26, 2013 2:00:05 GMT -5 @mountaingoat said:

Feb 16, 2013 0:11:09 GMT -5 OMG said:

To whom it may concern:


Please get rid of the 'karma' function ASAP.

I have come to the conclusion that it is contributory to an atmosphere of negativity and personality conflict in that it encourages a childish impulse to 'reward' those who mirror personal preference or 'punish' those who don't. Like a childhood popularity contest with winners and losers

It's not only insidious but especially ridiculous in the sense that it is entirely 'personality' oriented, not at all the humor element it was probably intended as, but an artificial and distortive contrivance; an instrument of continuous petty labeling, marginalization, divisiveness, and factionalization - undermines sense of community. That on a 'spiritual' site which (ambiguously?) professes an impersonal non-dual orientation.

I used it twice soon after joining: to take an action and then because got a negative impression of it, immediately reversed the action. No more.

Think about it. What I mean is, what kind of place do you want the site to be? According to my preference - I would 'smite' it in a heartbeat.

OMG

There is an episode of...wow..total memory crash...and i just watched a few eposides the other week...hang on a mo...Oh, The X Files.

So, there's an episode of The X Files where Mulder has found a real Genie and she grants him three wishes.
The story is quite interesting because it hilights the all too common stupid attitude of people,
as expressed throught the Genie character who, being immortal, is sick of being found by people who ask for really stupid, selfish and temporal things,
and she's suffered for centuries as see watches humans behaving badly.

The empahsis is on human greed and stupidity, but also how easy it is to be selfish
because half of the story is about the girl who has become a Genie and is trapped in her own eternal hell.
She suffers because she experiences time and time again that she has unlimited power to fulfil anyone's wishes
but utopia on earth has still not been achieved because of the stupidity aspects of human nature.

Mulder, the resident intelligent and insightful human on the show, who's passion is truth and good will to all people, ponders his three wishes very carefully.

The next day, his first wish is peace on earth. The Genie says after a few seconds, "Done."
Mulder is amazed that it took the Genie so little time to achieve peace throughtout the world.
He runs outside to check, and is first shocked, then realises why the Genie took little time.
The Genie created peace on earth simply by removing all the people.

Mulder goes back inside and questions the Genie's action.
The Genie says because of human nature, this is the only way to produce peace on earth.

Mulder's second wish is to restore all the people. The Genie says, "Done."
Mulder goes outside and yep, everyone has returned.
This is when the Genie describes her centuries of observing humans and how not one person
has asked for something worthwhile for all of humanity's benefit, and that humans actually do not need a Genie to create a global utopia.

Mulder's last wish, the final scene when Skully asked him what his last wish was,
he asked that the genie become a normal human like everyone else.
to which the scene ends with the view of this ex Genie happily living a normal mortal life.

Getting rid of the karma function isn't going to stop people from behaving unlovingly towards another.
Changing the external environment doesn't change a person's internal world.
A person can use external means to express the abundance of their being to another.
Changing the external means, will not change what inside them, they will simply express their being via another transportation method.

The problem is not the karma device, the problem is inside the human device.

I see that we are on the same page MG.
If this is a site dedicated to some kind of authenticity with regard to a consciously spiritual approach to life - why does the site need a 'genie' that is given the task of exalting and smiting its own members at their whim?

[Deleted]

Feb 26, 2013 9:07:37 GMT -5 OMG said:

I see that we are on the same page MG.
If this is a site dedicated to some kind of authenticity with regard to a consciously spiritual approach to life - why does the site need a 'genie' that is given the task of exalting and smiting its own members at their whim?

I don't see we are on the same page OMG.
You think getting rid of the karma device will resolve the issues people have with each other, i think it won't.

The karma device is not a genie.
The karma device does not magically transform people into good or bad people according to their karma points.
The karma device has no innate power like a genie.

The karma device is a communication tool for people to express their opinion of others or their views.
The stoopid thing about this device is a person may not know who thinks highly or lowly of them, or what post someone liked or disliked.

It's a way to communicate without connecting... a type of detached communion.

As far as i can tell, ST is dedicated to promoting non duality from theory to fact.
Personally, i find the representatives are doing a bang up job showing how flawed this theory is.

[Deleted]