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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2015 6:52:56 GMT -5
yes, i got that from the link to your earlier post... i am curious--arfe ther any specs you can give? For me , the reason why i see It has just to do with some prior conditioning, everybody has a different experience...at times i AM IT as well, i can well relate to what you describe...the ´´shifting out´´ of it is just the clouding of that presence. where is this I AM located in the body?The head, the heart, the feet...any place?How does it make you feel?  Hi Sunshine, There is no 'location'. Imagine a dog which lacks awareness of Self. Where would its 'I am' be? Nowhere. Presence is just that - being in the moment of everything. Anything I do - gets my complete undivided attention. I am PRESENT in every act or motion or feeling. It's simple really.. if I am peeling potatoes - I am THERE, in that. The feel of it, the sound of peeling, the texture of the potato skin. If I have sex - I am there, in the act and nowhere else mentally. If I talk here - I am completely focused on what someone says and how I respond. It makes one do things - consciously, but without unnecessary mental processes. Very simple. Not mysterious. There is no more to it than that. I feel balanced. okay... but a dog lives entirely on impulses, conditionings. Humans usually identify with these conditionings. Disconnecting from them does not necessarily erase these conditionings. I recall Jed talking about ´´patterns and signs´´.That is a part i liked, because i can relate to that.Patterns are repetitive, and by trial and error, one learns to ´´read´´ the patterns. Some human conditionings can be detrimental...food, smoking, etc. so...you never get angry? You have a son, if i recall correctly.I am curious.A friend who has two teenage daughters, once had a ´´near-death experience´´. She was amazed by the fact that she had no sense of connection at all to them.She felt serenity, complete freedom from any attachment. I have the same experience, i just shift in and out of It.When IT arrives i feel it as serenity, it seems to originate in the heart.Perhaps that is what you describe as ´´balanced´´. My chaotic live-workspace , as i described earlier, triggered old conditionings.I noticed that every time i entered the house, the Presence would withdraw.A pattern.After cleaning up the place and bringing order into it, the Presence remained.And, and this is the interesting part, after a while the chaos returned--but i no longer lost the ´´Presence´´--it stayed. This tells me that that particular conditioning had been changed ,favorably. do you recognise patterns and signs? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2015 6:19:43 GMT -5
okay... but a dog lives entirely on impulses, conditionings. Humans usually identify with these conditionings. Disconnecting from them does not necessarily erase these conditionings. I recall Jed talking about ´´patterns and signs´´.That is a part i liked, because i can relate to that.Patterns are repetitive, and by trial and error, one learns to ´´read´´ the patterns. Some human conditionings can be detrimental...food, smoking, etc. so...you never get angry? You have a son, if i recall correctly.I am curious.A friend who has two teenage daughters, once had a ´´near-death experience´´. She was amazed by the fact that she had no sense of connection at all to them.She felt serenity, complete freedom from any attachment. I have the same experience, i just shift in and out of It.When IT arrives i feel it as serenity, it seems to originate in the heart.Perhaps that is what you describe as ´´balanced´´. My chaotic live-workspace , as i described earlier, triggered old conditionings.I noticed that every time i entered the house, the Presence would withdraw.A pattern.After cleaning up the place and bringing order into it, the Presence remained.And, and this is the interesting part, after a while the chaos returned--but i no longer lost the ´´Presence´´--it stayed. This tells me that that particular conditioning had been changed ,favorably. do you recognise patterns and signs? Yes. Patterns are all around us. Nature is all about free unfolding, it doesn't occur chaotically, but in patterns. Flowers bloom on time, and if the weather was particularly cold - they will delay blooming. Ocean tides will come and go. The earthquakes will occur due to pattern movement of techtonic plates.. a woman will give birth in nine months, and an elephant - in twelve. The same for the human world, and there patterns can be pertaining to our original animal nature (sleep is a pattern), or can be conditioned, man made. Just observe a human interaction, here or in physical life... behavioural response patterns that people display are pretty clear, but not noticed by most. The word 'signs' tends to invoke a mystical, otherworldly association. But. I feel hungry. It's a sign for me to eat. And so it goes.. in most things. I feel uncomfortable with my living arrangments.. time to move. I feel a person is withdrawing.. time to give space etc. etc. Countless. If a butterfly lands on my window tomorrow with a pattern on its wings resembling the face of my son - I will say it's a butterfly with a pattern resembling the face of my son. Not a 'sign' of anything. I never got to the white light and the tunnel and so cannot say I've had a genuine ND experience. But yes... in those five or so minutes there was no time, no world, no 'others'. no concern of anything. Total surrender, calmness and absence of fear. Just presence. Thank you Tano I think the ´´tunnel´´ is optional , not all ND folk report going through it... About the ´´signs´´ i will give an example. some years ago (2007) my nearest neighbour ,living about 300 m away payed me a rare visit--she held a piece of paper in her hand as she apprached me, i was working outside the house.She had tears in her eyes.She showed me the paper and it was a map of a few square kilometers of the area we lived.Our prperties were in the middle. Across the map was a dotted line, with two black lines,one on each side of the dots.It was a roadplan for a highway.`´they changed the trajectory of the road´´she said--the original plan was miles away from us. It would mean the end of my little forest paradise if it was realised.Though not touching my property, it woud mean noise and fumes only 200 meters away from my house.My neighbours would lose their property,as it went right across their land.Construction would begin in 2008. ´´We have to protest, write to Brussels, they cant do this, it is protected area´´. I respectfully told her that, though i have a rebellious nature, i would not take any such action.It immediately had occurred to me that getting upset about a piece of paper and some words from a neighbour was absurd. I also new that as long as i had this inner freedom, nothing could touch me and i woud be allright, no matter what. Next morning i woke up and had a dreamlike experience--i relived the moment i saw her walk towards me with that piece of paper in her hand.(A4 size). But the paper was radiating Light, it seemed to be vibrating with joy, as if to say:hey this is a GOOD thing, not bad... I did not doubt it, it was a ´´sign´´. Now i was even more convinced that i should not waste time on this ´´problem´´, though i could not fathom any scenario how it could be ´´good´´ for me. The folowing years some things happened , too complex too explain here, but the fact that that road was planned there, resulted in financial support from an unlikeley source...giving me a lot more financial freedom. In 2008 the financial crisis hit Portugal hard, and the 1.3 billion euro roadplan was shelved, but not scrapped. Today, the plans still havent been scrapped but it is unlikely they will be realised.I never lost a minute of sleep over it. Last year,out of the blue, i got another, much more beautiful property thrown into my lap.Currently i am trying to sell the old place, which isnt easy because of that planned road.Buyers are worried about the road.I dont mind, have no doubt that that too, will turn out to be just perfect. sorry, this post got a bit longer than i intended. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2015 7:14:34 GMT -5
<abbr data-timestamp="1448450383000" class="time" title="Nov 25, 2015 12:19:43 GMT 7">Nov 25, 2015 12:19:43 GMT 7</abbr> sunshine said: Thank you Tano I think the ´´tunnel´´ is optional , not all ND folk report going through it... About the ´´signs´´ i will give an example. some years ago (2007) my nearest neighbour ,living about 300 m away payed me a rare visit--she held a piece of paper in her hand as she apprached me, i was working outside the house.She had tears in her eyes.She showed me the paper and it was a map of a few square kilometers of the area we lived.Our prperties were in the middle. Across the map was a dotted line, with two black lines,one on each side of the dots.It was a roadplan for a highway.`´they changed the trajectory of the road´´she said--the original plan was miles away from us. It would mean the end of my little forest paradise if it was realised.Though not touching my property, it woud mean noise and fumes only 200 meters away from my house.My neighbours would lose their property,as it went right across their land.Construction would begin in 2008. ´´We have to protest, write to Brussels, they cant do this, it is protected area´´. I respectfully told her that, though i have a rebellious nature, i would not take any such action.It immediately had occurred to me that getting upset about a piece of paper and some words from a neighbour was absurd. I also new that as long as i had this inner freedom, nothing could touch me and i woud be allright, no matter what. Next morning i woke up and had a dreamlike experience--i relived the moment i saw her walk towards me with that piece of paper in her hand.(A4 size). But the paper was radiating Light, it seemed to be vibrating with joy, as if to say:hey this is a GOOD thing, not bad... I did not doubt it, it was a ´´sign´´. Now i was even more convinced that i should not waste time on this ´´problem´´, though i could not fathom any scenario how it could be ´´good´´ for me. The folowing years some things happened , too complex too explain here, but the fact that that road was planned there, resulted in financial support from an unlikeley source...giving me a lot more financial freedom. In 2008 the financial crisis hit Portugal hard, and the 1.3 billion euro roadplan was shelved, but not scrapped. Today, the plans still havent been scrapped but it is unlikely they will be realised.I never lost a minute of sleep over it. Last year,out of the blue, i got another, much more beautiful property thrown into my lap.Currently i am trying to sell the old place, which isnt easy because of that planned road.Buyers are worried about the road.I dont mind, have no doubt that that too, will turn out to be just perfect. sorry, this post got a bit longer than i intended. It is a good example of Flow. Intuition that you are and which bypasses the reflective Mind's reaction to control the situation in any way. People equate this with Passivity, but it is not the case at all. You are in Portugal? Yes, Portugal, i moved there from Holland in 2000. You live in SE Asia? Anther example of a ´´sign´´--i used to live in squats in Holland. Once i squatted an old school, and friends and other ´´activists´´ told me I´d never get away with that. They refused to help me, so i did it on my own.I´d been living on a beach, but winter was coming and i needed a roof. The windows were all broken and it was cold.In one of the classrooms i found a box with used clothes.One of the items was a sweater of a type i had always wanted. I knew it was a sign.I also had a vision of the place brimming with activity. I didnt get thrown out, and a year later it had been transformed in a place where 6 artists each had a large,classroom size, free studio.We eventually got recognised by the Town Council and negotiated a very low rent...when we eventually had to move, they supported us in finding another building.The gallery and studios are there till this day, 30 years later... Another place i squatted, during night, using a torch,the first thing i saw was my name, a brandname, written on a lightswitch.Another ´´sign´´.I lived there for free for 20 years...owners eventually even gave me an old canteen adjacent to the house, to use as a studio. i believe these things happen to me as i have no fear of becoming homeless. i have been homeless and living on a beach or sleeping under bridges. I know i can handle that. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2015 6:39:15 GMT -5
Yes, Portugal, i moved there from Holland in 2000. You live in SE Asia? Anther example of a ´´sign´´--i used to live in squats in Holland. Once i squatted an old school, and friends and other ´´activists´´ told me I´d never get away with that. They refused to help me, so i did it on my own.I´d been living on a beach, but winter was coming and i needed a roof. The windows were all broken and it was cold.In one of the classrooms i found a box with used clothes.One of the items was a sweater of a type i had always wanted. I knew it was a sign.I also had a vision of the place brimming with activity. I didnt get thrown out, and a year later it had been transformed in a place where 6 artists each had a large,classroom size, free studio.We eventually got recognised by the Town Council and negotiated a very low rent...when we eventually had to move, they supported us in finding another building.The gallery and studios are there till this day, 30 years later... Another place i squatted, during night, using a torch,the first thing i saw was my name, a brandname, written on a lightswitch.Another ´´sign´´.I lived there for free for 20 years...owners eventually even gave me an old canteen adjacent to the house, to use as a studio. i believe these things happen to me as i have no fear of becoming homeless. i have been homeless and living on a beach or sleeping under bridges. I know i can handle that. 'Signs' are something which catches your attention, because your mind is already 'primed' for this particular occurance. You noticed your name,and to another it would be just some name. You found a sweater which was what you've always wanted, and to another - it would be just an old musty sweater. You see... Mind is powerful beyond belief and plays tricks on us. Coincidences are random, but the Mind needs patterns, needs to makes sense of the radomness of this Organised Chaos. Yes, I am in SE Asia, but Portugal is a place I am considering as one of my next avenues. I have been homeless on a couple of occasions in my distant past, and now, strictly speaking, have no particular place in the world which I can call 'a base' or a 'home'. 'Home' is within. yes, i guess this is where you and Jed, and me, differ.I believe , know, it is possible to ´´take Maya by the hand´´.The mind is the Tool, and a very powerful one at that. I have had too many demonstrations of it.The ´´craftsman´´ using the tool is the ´´transcendent´´.Like Jed says, ´´desires manifest´´.The desire is a conditioning.And contrary to what has been said about it,and everybody seems to ´´believe´´ (!!!), the conditioning can be altered... if i have a ´´vision´´, it is not something i look for, or expect, it just appears. Most of these experiences come out of the blue, at times quite baffling. My ´´housing signs´´ , are beginning to look like a ´´pattern´´ .My latest place was (is) just uncanny, the perfection of it. My previous place,while acquiring it, i got ´´warning signs´´ that i ignored.Resulted in situations with people, i had rather avoided. if ever you get to come to PT, let me know. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2015 5:39:20 GMT -5
yes, i guess this is where you and Jed, and me, differ.I believe , know, it is possible to ´´take Maya by the hand´´.The mind is the Tool, and a very powerful one at that. I have had too many demonstrations of it.The ´´craftsman´´ using the tool is the ´´transcendent´´.Like Jed says, ´´desires manifest´´.The desire is a conditioning.And contrary to what has been said about it,and everybody seems to ´´believe´´ (!!!), the conditioning can be altered... if i have a ´´vision´´, it is not something i look for, or expect, it just appears. Most of these experiences come out of the blue, at times quite baffling. My ´´housing signs´´ , are beginning to look like a ´´pattern´´ .My latest place was (is) just uncanny, the perfection of it. My previous place,while acquiring it, i got ´´warning signs´´ that i ignored.Resulted in situations with people, i had rather avoided. if ever you get to come to PT, let me know. I guess what you call 'signs' I call 'intuition', from that visceral part of our reptilian brain which knows somehow, without being taught. The body has been evolving for millions of years and is much more aware, yet, we moved into the Cortex functioning and forgot about the language of Nature that we are. Yes, Jed is not into any supernatural stuff, he is very down to earth. But as he would say, and I see Infinite Wisdom in this... 'It is perfect - for you'. And it is, really, for how could it not be? Thank you for the Portugal suggestion, and likewise.. if you find yourself in Cambodia on a cheap SE Asia spin - let me know. Just beware... men specifically tend to lose their heads here I recall Jed mentioning ´´signs´´,maybe i am wr0ng.Isnt that what you mean by living from an ´´inner sense´´? question lets assume evolution is happening.What is evolving?I´d say it is Conscousness emerging out of Matter. Man is not the final product of it. From microbes to plants to animals to Man..to...  Ahhh...Cambodia, very tempting...after i sold my old house i will make a trip to India.From there it is not far...we´ll see... |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 7:18:31 GMT -5
I recall Jed mentioning ´´signs´´,maybe i am wr0ng.Isnt that what you mean by living from an ´´inner sense´´? question lets assume evolution is happening.What is evolving?I´d say it is Conscousness emerging out of Matter. Man is not the final product of it. From microbes to plants to animals to Man..to... Ahhh...Cambodia, very tempting...after i sold my old house i will make a trip to India.From there it is not far...we´ll see... You can never be 'wrong', Sunshine. I can never be 'wrong'. But we can be - deluded If you dig out that 'signs' quote, I may have a look and see. But really.. Inner Sense is living through the guidance of own Source - you. I think ZD explained it well in his Clarity thread response. But one has to be in touch with it. Intuition.. signs... still from the Inner, words don't matter. We haven't been here long enough in evolutionary terms - to notice our own Evolutionary development. Who knows... maybe Cortex will push out of the cranium and become an appendage.. or maybe, our heads will grow in proportion to the body.. or maybe, we will become extinct, like dinousaurs. In terms of your own life - it makes no difference. Nothing lasts forever. sorry, i dont have the books anymore, and my torrent provider got kicked off the web, so the ´´signs´´ quote has to wait. You say intuition originates in the reptilian brain. Where does creativity come from?Mozart? Beethoven? surely not their reptilian brain. Have you ever located the origin of thought? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2015 5:33:32 GMT -5
You are an artist. Do you really paint from your rational mind? Do you reckon Mozart approached his music as a well laid out task? Music (paintings, poems and ANY creative process, even software design) flow. Very reptilian. How one selss those is different, of course. That requires strategy. Regarding the origin of thought... I don't know. I don't even know what thought is... except that it isn't. And if you ask me to explain that last one - I will not be able either. Maybe there are other parts in the brain ,other than ´´reptilian mind´´--?Beethoven went deaf age 26 and had to give up his career as concert pianist and turned to composing...i dont see the lizards in my garden writing music, sorry... Thought... well, Candace Pert (among others former head of National health board USA) and her team discovered that thought does not orignate in the body.They waited 15 years with publication because they could nt believe what they found.They thought they did something wrong....if not in the body where else? It took her a long time to come to a very ´´unscientific´´ conclusion--there must be something she, for lack of proper terms, called ´´spirit´´ She should have got the Nobelprize for this, but hey, she is (was) a woman...  |
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Post by laughter on Nov 30, 2015 13:20:02 GMT -5
Yes, Portugal, i moved there from Holland in 2000. You live in SE Asia? Anther example of a ´´sign´´--i used to live in squats in Holland. Once i squatted an old school, and friends and other ´´activists´´ told me I´d never get away with that. They refused to help me, so i did it on my own.I´d been living on a beach, but winter was coming and i needed a roof. The windows were all broken and it was cold.In one of the classrooms i found a box with used clothes.One of the items was a sweater of a type i had always wanted. I knew it was a sign.I also had a vision of the place brimming with activity. I didnt get thrown out, and a year later it had been transformed in a place where 6 artists each had a large,classroom size, free studio.We eventually got recognised by the Town Council and negotiated a very low rent...when we eventually had to move, they supported us in finding another building.The gallery and studios are there till this day, 30 years later... Another place i squatted, during night, using a torch,the first thing i saw was my name, a brandname, written on a lightswitch.Another ´´sign´´.I lived there for free for 20 years...owners eventually even gave me an old canteen adjacent to the house, to use as a studio. i believe these things happen to me as i have no fear of becoming homeless. i have been homeless and living on a beach or sleeping under bridges. I know i can handle that. 'Signs' are something which catches your attention, because your mind is already 'primed' for this particular occurance. You noticed your name,and to another it would be just some name. You found a sweater which was what you've always wanted, and to another - it would be just an old musty sweater. You see... Mind is powerful beyond belief and plays tricks on us. Coincidences are random, but the Mind needs patterns, needs to makes sense of the radomness of this Organised Chaos. Yes, I am in SE Asia, but Portugal is a place I am considering as one of my next avenues. I have been homeless on a couple of occasions in my distant past, and now, strictly speaking, have no particular place in the world which I can call 'a base' or a 'home'. 'Home' is within. Yes, synchronicity is interesting. The most improbable ones that demonstrate just how small the world is have been, in my life at least, either benign or neutral. The mind has two functions: distinction and integration, but integration is really just a special case of distinction, because what is integrated ultimately is distinct both from what wasn't integrated and from the observer of it. Pattern recognition is a special case, a particular integrative function. Human minds are really really good at detecting patterns, so good that they often generate false alarms -- lots of times we make connections and see a pattern that is only there in our imagination. Ultimately, even when the story fits the bill of the Universe informing us of it's presence, that meaning is made with the same capacity of mind. |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Nov 30, 2015 17:36:28 GMT -5
You are an artist. Do you really paint from your rational mind? Do you reckon Mozart approached his music as a well laid out task? Music (paintings, poems and ANY creative process, even software design) flow. Very reptilian.How one selss those is different, of course. That requires strategy. Regarding the origin of thought... I don't know. I don't even know what thought is... except that it isn't. And if you ask me to explain that last one - I will not be able either. Actually, incorrect. The emotions involve the creative process more than the intellect, music, paintings, poems, all forms of art. This is the middle layer of the brain, known as the mammalian brain or the limbic system. The difference is your pet iguana or turtle is not capable of love, but Spot the dog is. IOW, sunshine is correct. The three brains in man (see link concerning Paul Maclean, neuroscientist, the Triune Brain) correspond to the evolution of animals, reptiles (#1), mammals (#2) and then human beings. The reptilian brain is the oldest, it's the center core of the brain plus the spinal column controlling movements and the senses, it's the source of the fight or flight mechanism. The mammalian brain/limbic system covers the reptilian brain, and (#3) the cortex (which has various structures), is responsible for abstract thought. www.kheper.net/topics/intelligence/MacLean.htm |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Dec 1, 2015 9:03:34 GMT -5
Actually, incorrect. The emotions involve the creative process more than the intellect, music, paintings, poems, all forms of art. This is the middle layer of the brain, known as the mammalian brain or the limbic system. The difference is your pet iguana or turtle is not capable of love, but Spot the dog is. IOW, sunshine is correct. The three brains in man (see link concerning Paul Maclean, neuroscientist, the Triune Brain) correspond to the evolution of animals, reptiles (#1), mammals (#2) and then human beings. The reptilian brain is the oldest, it's the center core of the brain plus the spinal column controlling movements and the senses, it's the source of the fight or flight mechanism. The mammalian brain/limbic system covers the reptilian brain, and (#3) the cortex (which has various structures), is responsible for abstract thought. www.kheper.net/topics/intelligence/MacLean.htmA good scientific evaluation, SDP. Do you understand the meaning of the word 'metaphor'? OK, I thought you were shooting for less metaphorical. |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Dec 1, 2015 20:42:55 GMT -5
OK, I thought you were shooting for less metaphorical. You were correct in your post. Emotions are involved in the creative process, this happens outside of the Cortex... the mammalian or reptilian brain. . I was pointing to that same destinction when I mentioned creativity. When I was going through my process for two years I started writing poems, hundreds pouring out of me. They were good, emotionally charged, because I was that way charged. The day 'it' got me - all stopped. Not a line since. I was a big Cat Stevens fan back in the '70's. This is partly opinion and partly part of the story. He almost died while swimming in the ocean, did the "God if you save me I will serve you the rest of my life" sort of thingy. He was bedridden for a long time, I want to say at least six months (it's been a long time since I read the story). But while bedridden he wrote tons and tons of stuff, which, for the most part became many albums, the three I remember most, Teaser and the Firecat, Tea for the Tillerman, and Catch Bull At Four (which is from the Zen Ox Herding pictures). I think when the 'juice' from that period ran out, he couldn't turn out the same quality of work. (That's the opinion part). For a while he was really into Buddhism (thus Catch Bull at Four), but when fulfillment of promise came about, he turned to Islam. ........And his first retirement is quite interesting. He was on tour and was in the middle of a song on stage one night, and just stopped right in the middle of the song, walked off the stage. (I don't remember the song, but the lyrics were significant concerning the walking off...)... A cool song from Catch Bull, I think it's just called Sitting, but it starts off: Sitting all alone inside myself... Care to share a poem? .......There was a poem thread, Charlie_. I know he's still around, he used to post often.....you could do it there....or anywhere..... |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2015 4:46:55 GMT -5
You are an artist. Do you really paint from your rational mind? Do you reckon Mozart approached his music as a well laid out task? Music (paintings, poems and ANY creative process, even software design) flow. Very reptilian.How one selss those is different, of course. That requires strategy. Regarding the origin of thought... I don't know. I don't even know what thought is... except that it isn't. And if you ask me to explain that last one - I will not be able either. Actually, incorrect. The emotions involve the creative process more than the intellect, music, paintings, poems, all forms of art. This is the middle layer of the brain, known as the mammalian brain or the limbic system. The difference is your pet iguana or turtle is not capable of love, but Spot the dog is. IOW, sunshine is correct. The three brains in man (see link concerning Paul Maclean, neuroscientist, the Triune Brain) correspond to the evolution of animals, reptiles (#1), mammals (#2) and then human beings. The reptilian brain is the oldest, it's the center core of the brain plus the spinal column controlling movements and the senses, it's the source of the fight or flight mechanism. The mammalian brain/limbic system covers the reptilian brain, and (#3) the cortex (which has various structures), is responsible for abstract thought. www.kheper.net/topics/intelligence/MacLean.htmif what tano says were true,all expression is a form of mating ritual or territorial marking,that would put Jed in the category of gorilla beating his chest in the jungle...i like that  E |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 6:14:52 GMT -5
if what tano says were true,all expression is a form of mating ritual or territorial marking,that would put Jed in the category of gorilla beating his chest in the jungle...i like that E Not ALL expression. Intellectual debates are very removed from the reptilian (mammalian! Thanks, SDP!) brain.. but the emotional undertones which fuel those - are certainly part of it Unseen, un realised, but they are present. However... Sunshine, you are actually spot on. Mating and territorial marking are what moves the world, the first one - number one force in the human universe. Sure, it's masked by all sorts of social conventions, aculturations, rituals, but really... there is a very fine line separating humans from animals. What you and jed did,autolysys,is concentration in the throatchackra,(creative expression-will) and ´´drilled´´a horizontal hole into the transcendent.As Sri Aurobindo explains, one can enter the transcendent on any level(chakra),body,vital,mental ,and achieve freedom.The (seven or so) main yoga-paths in Hindu tradition are disxiplines (forms of concentration) to realise the freedom. This is always only ONE realisation, and ususally the yogi stops after reaching freedom. Your realisation is a mental one, and leaves the lower chakras untouched and not liberated. If it werent so, Jed would have written a quite different book. Integral yoga aims at liberation on ALL levels.Full realisation of the human-divine potential. Check out ´´the Adventure of consciousness´´ by Satprem for explanation.free pdf download. |
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Post by figgles on Dec 3, 2015 13:30:41 GMT -5
What you and jed did,autolysys,is concentration in the throatchackra,(creative expression-will) and ´´drilled´´a horizontal hole into the transcendent.As Sri Aurobindo explains, one can enter the transcendent on any level(chakra),body,vital,mental ,and achieve freedom.The (seven or so) main yoga-paths in Hindu tradition are disxiplines (forms of concentration) to realise the freedom. This is always only ONE realisation, and ususally the yogi stops after reaching freedom. Your realisation is a mental one, and leaves the lower chakras untouched and not liberated. If it werent so, Jed would have written a quite different book. Integral yoga aims at liberation on ALL levels.Full realisation of the human-divine potential. Check out ´´the Adventure of consciousness´´ by Satprem for explanation.free pdf download. There is a couple of oddities in what you said. 'Mental', yet you send me to... read books, of all things. I haven't read on the subject in more than a year. And secondly... "If it werent so, Jed would have written a quite different book." You have some fixed idea about what 'it would be like'? I can tell you,, whatever you imagine about 'it' - is not 'it'. By far. I don't know much about chakras. But they seem to correspond nearly precisely to the human endocrine system points. I think though you have acknowledged agreement with Jed's assertion that 'deepening and further' still happens post TR...? If so, I'm pretty sure this is similar to what Sunshine is getting at. & no, That deepening is not predicated upon 'seeking' or 'searching' in the same way that happened pre TR, as now there is no sense of something HERE needing to be anything other than what it is, but nevertheless, the possibility of further, remains. I see significant movement (having gone deeper/farther) in the Jed character from his first book to his last....but still, he's just barely touching the 'heart' chakra, or said another way, just scraping the surface of embodying Love. |
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Post by figgles on Dec 3, 2015 21:58:42 GMT -5
I think though you have acknowledged agreement with Jed's assertion that 'deepening and further' still happens post TR...? If so, I'm pretty sure this is similar to what Sunshine is getting at. & no, That deepening is not predicated upon 'seeking' or 'searching' in the same way that happened pre TR, as now there is no sense of something HERE needing to be anything other than what it is, but nevertheless, the possibility of further, remains. I see significant movement (having gone deeper/farther) in the Jed character from his first book to his last....but still, he's just barely touching the 'heart' chakra, or said another way, just scraping the surface of embodying Love. Sunshine said this "ususally the yogi stops after reaching freedom", and I responded by saying I am not searching. As I stated before the Vision was Final. But Being keeps unravelling, without a doubt, Infinite. Whoever said that TR is about 'embodying love'? As I see it, "Embodying Love" is about deepening...further. TR (as in 'seeing through the BS') does not necessarily include that. |
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