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Post by laughter on Oct 3, 2014 4:23:36 GMT -5
Oh? Can you quote a disclaiming of virtue from my words?
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Post by laughter on Oct 3, 2014 4:30:57 GMT -5
In my aforementioned example I offered logical proof positive that arrogance is in error. Some would surely argue that arrogance can still exist, in this error form, among a vast many people. I feel we're conflating the process of living with the interpretation of concepts, categories and labels. Nah, you just think yer messin' with your readers with the cleverness of contextual ambiguity but that is very old hat 'round here son. Obviously humility, in terms of the question of a humble individual, is a double bind, but you can't disclaim that this is what you originally meant given the structure of the presentation -- the reference to such an individual is tattooed into the title question.
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Post by Reefs on Oct 3, 2014 4:39:56 GMT -5
Is it better to do the humbling or to have the humbling done to you? Feel free to interpret the word 'better', and to question the underlying premises of the inquiry. The humble business is for moralists. Just be yourself. Let it rip!
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Post by silver on Oct 3, 2014 5:45:59 GMT -5
Well, I can be better than another person. At farming, at math, at bicycling, etc. I can yield greater crops, solve more complex equations, cycle without hands, etc. But to say I'm better without defining any sense to it, that's the metaphorical as well as literal epitome of nonsense. So how I am compared to others is always a function of specific actions, ways or tendencies or otherwise of any specifically defined context. There's no better or worse in a general or universal sense. This is a pretty basic concept so I'm curious why you believe virtue is needed to define humility. For one, in terms of one who would either humble or be humbled, humility is typically considered a virtue, with the opposite number of pride. For another, in terms of one who would claim humility, they would of course, disclaim virtue, for if they didn't, how could they be considered humble? This quote demonstrates well enough what I think about humility and et cetera: Iow, humility is an attitude - NOT a virtue - in my book, anyway.
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Post by Transcix on Oct 3, 2014 12:09:43 GMT -5
In my aforementioned example I offered logical proof positive that arrogance is in error. Some would surely argue that arrogance can still exist, in this error form, among a vast many people. I feel we're conflating the process of living with the interpretation of concepts, categories and labels. Nah, you just think yer messin' with your readers with the cleverness of contextual ambiguity but that is very old hat 'round here son. Obviously humility, in terms of the question of a humble individual, is a double bind, but you can't disclaim that this is what you originally meant given the structure of the presentation -- the reference to such an individual is tattooed into the title question. Hmmmm, in fact I was speaking about humility seriously (not too seriously, just seriously). The logical proof that I elaborated earlier is an extremely important part of my paradigm, I certainly wasn't joking about that at all. I don't think humility is a double bind, I think you can have your cake and eat it too, and also not even get fat! Yes I think a person can get better, or less worse, whichever you prefer, and they can also get worse, or less better, or whatever, but I do view a spectrum, just that every person's spectrum is subjective, so I'll state mine subjectively, as a possible avenue that works for immortality. If you want to be ignorant and die, I'm not going to stop you! PS - That 'you' was a general 'you' of course, not specifically you laughter.. I hope you pick up on that sort of thing in my posts, I wasn't talking about you personally dying.
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Post by Transcix on Oct 3, 2014 12:13:23 GMT -5
Is it better to do the humbling or to have the humbling done to you? Feel free to interpret the word 'better', and to question the underlying premises of the inquiry. The humble business is for moralists. Just be yourself. Let it rip! RIP is the sound of fabric tearing. Unfortunately tearing has a double meaning, either crying or the action of being torn.. I'm still trying to work out the linguistic kinks of that expression.. I don't want any emo people to look at my phrase and start getting all teary eyed.. Iow, humility is an attitude - NOT a virtue - in my book, anyway. I'm going to have to start a thread about what the hell is this 'virtue' people are talking about.
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Post by silver on Oct 3, 2014 13:19:21 GMT -5
The humble business is for moralists. Just be yourself. Let it rip! RIP is the sound of fabric tearing. Unfortunately tearing has a double meaning, either crying or the action of being torn.. I'm still trying to work out the linguistic kinks of that expression.. I don't want any emo people to look at my phrase and start getting all teary eyed.. Iow, humility is an attitude - NOT a virtue - in my book, anyway. I'm going to have to start a thread about what the hell is this 'virtue' people are talking about. They're on a rip, if you will, tranny, of tearing things down, in case you hadn't noticed....tryin' to deconstruct your op, by using antiquated notions about stuff like humility.
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Post by Transcix on Oct 3, 2014 14:24:30 GMT -5
So there's no such thing as humility, no such thing as pride, no such thing as arrogance, no such thing as insecurity, no such thing as.. hold on.. I *am* proud.. this isn't bad.. just a different interpretation of proudness.. wow this thread has shown me how difficult it is to speak of attributes of character, even in jest.. it reinforces that it's inefficient to say that it's good to be proud, or it's good to be virtuous, or it's good to be etc, rather it's more efficient to say consider how the choice between the two can be realized.. back to the deconconstructivism I was and am so fond of..
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Post by enigma on Oct 3, 2014 20:13:56 GMT -5
Is it better to do the humbling or to have the humbling done to you? Feel free to interpret the word 'better', and to question the underlying premises of the inquiry. Humility isn't something that someone can do. There is an obvious hubris to trying to to be humble. Humility, very simply is the absence of pride that comes with seeing the emptiness of the notion that anything of virtue that our individuation is the vehicle for is the source of that individuation in any sort of independent sense. Yes, any genuine virtue is in the losing of interest in the polarities of the virtue. (Akin to walking off the battlefield)
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Post by enigma on Oct 3, 2014 20:23:52 GMT -5
It's better to have the humbling done to you. To try to humble someone else is pretty arrogant. And, what goes around, comes around. sdp It is better to have the humbling done to you, but it's usually - almost always I say - a situational thing because if someone tries to humble me, it's usually because of some animosity and it's not a pure thing, motivationally speaking. What that says is that it's good to be humble, but it's not good to be one who brings about that good.
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Post by laughter on Oct 3, 2014 20:35:02 GMT -5
Iow, humility is an attitude - NOT a virtue - in my book, anyway. I'm going to have to start a thread about what the hell is this 'virtue' people are talking about. Objectively speaking, virtue is a social construct related to the notion of value. Absent any objective reference, the word has a sort of residue to it that points away from what is false. Of course, I can't put my own subjectivity behind me.
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Post by laughter on Oct 3, 2014 20:37:30 GMT -5
Humility isn't something that someone can do. There is an obvious hubris to trying to to be humble. Humility, very simply is the absence of pride that comes with seeing the emptiness of the notion that anything of virtue that our individuation is the vehicle for is the source of that individuation in any sort of independent sense. Yes, any genuine virtue is in the losing of interest in the polarities of the virtue. (Akin to walking off the battlefield) Yes, definitely.
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Post by laughter on Oct 3, 2014 20:39:14 GMT -5
It is better to have the humbling done to you, but it's usually - almost always I say - a situational thing because if someone tries to humble me, it's usually because of some animosity and it's not a pure thing, motivationally speaking. What that says is that it's good to be humble, but it's not good to be one who brings about that good. precisomento ... the only way to escape the double-bind is the absence of the one who would be humble.
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Post by laughter on Oct 3, 2014 20:43:24 GMT -5
So there's no such thing as humility, no such thing as pride, no such thing as arrogance, no such thing as insecurity, no such thing as.. hold on.. Those artifacts obviously are, and they are in the movement of distinction, so no, to dismiss them entirely is to ignore the movement. I *am* proud.. this isn't bad.. just a different interpretation of proudness.. wow this thread has shown me how difficult it is to speak of attributes of character, even in jest.. it reinforces that it's inefficient to say that it's good to be proud, or it's good to be virtuous, or it's good to be etc, rather it's more efficient to say consider how the choice between the two can be realized.. back to the deconconstructivism I was and am so fond of.. That's the general nature of a double bind tran': "I am humble".
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Post by enigma on Oct 3, 2014 21:04:43 GMT -5
The humble business is for moralists. Just be yourself. Let it rip! RIP is the sound of fabric tearing. Unfortunately tearing has a double meaning, either crying or the action of being torn.. I'm still trying to work out the linguistic kinks of that expression.. I don't want any emo people to look at my phrase and start getting all teary eyed.. Iow, humility is an attitude - NOT a virtue - in my book, anyway. I'm going to have to start a thread about what the hell is this 'virtue' people are talking about. Humility has no value beyond it's supposed value as a virtue. One can be open to learning something without being humbled, and arrogance can actually be an effective way to function. Also, a smart dude like you doesn't need to investigate this what you call virtue thingamabob, so why the pretense?
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