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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2014 2:21:53 GMT -5
No worries, I just got a natural bias against the whole 13 great guys and a sleeper imagery.
I was never really given the Jesus story to be able to throw anything away. Living in Christian land means that the language of him has a reference here, though misinterpretations can often happen. Sometimes they are funny, and sometimes sickening. That's the way of misinterpretation though I guess.
My mother brought a copy of Holy Blood, Holy Grail years ago, and I dipped into it, to find out what it wanted to say. It's the book that unofficially, the whole Dan Brown series is born from. It gives an alternative back story to the life of a man that the Bible stories wanted to write about the way they did.
Talking of which.. biblehub.com/john/10-18.htm
This quote alone, always says to me that he knew he was eternal.
Yeah, I poked around on that book when I lived in Japan a while back. It was just about the time I started my throwing-stuff-out phase and traveling lighter, both figuratively and actually. I think it got caught in the mix as it had too many dates and places from the integrity of its research! I was hooked on nature and the idea of the timeless essence, so if it tried to make too much sense, it got thrown out! hehe Cool, cool
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2014 2:48:23 GMT -5
(** whispers to Enigma ... " d@mn, now you let on that we don't trust fat chicks!" ... **) **Puts away 10 foot pole and moves quietly along...** Consider this dropped.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2014 6:58:14 GMT -5
You are ST. Is that how you define awakening? I don't have a definition for 'awakening', other than the return of physical awareness after a period of slumber.. That makes two of us; and we both have massive amounts of posts here at ST. Whether you accept it or not, you are as much ST as anyone else here.
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Post by laughter on Sept 23, 2014 12:44:01 GMT -5
No worries, I just got a natural bias against the whole 13 great guys and a sleeper imagery.
I was never really given the Jesus story to be able to throw anything away. Living in Christian land means that the language of him has a reference here, though misinterpretations can often happen. Sometimes they are funny, and sometimes sickening. That's the way of misinterpretation though I guess.
My mother brought a copy of Holy Blood, Holy Grail years ago, and I dipped into it, to find out what it wanted to say. It's the book that unofficially, the whole Dan Brown series is born from. It gives an alternative back story to the life of a man that the Bible stories wanted to write about the way they did.
Talking of which.. biblehub.com/john/10-18.htm
This quote alone, always says to me that he knew he was eternal.
Yeah, I poked around on that book when I lived in Japan a while back. It was just about the time I started my throwing-stuff-out phase and traveling lighter, both figuratively and actually. I think it got caught in the mix as it had too many dates and places from the integrity of its research! I was hooked on nature and the idea of the timeless essence, so if it tried to make too much sense, it got thrown out! hehe This, for me, highlights the distinction between an artificially coerced mental stillness and one that is natural and effortless. When the absence of meaning is apparent in even the most elegant and profound conceptualization, there is no try.
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Post by laughter on Sept 23, 2014 12:45:41 GMT -5
The Da Vinci Code is based on this. What's really remarkable is how, in this case, the losers of the battle actually have a voice in the current image of history. Yeah, I've seen that site before. That was the one I poked around on that made so much more sense than the King James fluffy stuff. I had been working with/around a bunch of missionaries in Uzbekistan when the Gnostic Gospel stuff started to float around me. Not good timing when you're trying to maintain an illusory persona in front of the fire-n-brimstone crowd! hehe But, I grinned and bore it! talk about "split-mind"!
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Post by laughter on Sept 23, 2014 12:47:29 GMT -5
**Puts away 10 foot pole and moves quietly along...** Consider this dropped. (** Zenmaster impression **) we'll see.
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Post by tzujanli on Sept 23, 2014 18:42:31 GMT -5
I don't have a definition for 'awakening', other than the return of physical awareness after a period of slumber.. That makes two of us; and we both have massive amounts of posts here at ST. Whether you accept it or not, you are as much ST as anyone else here. Yes, 'I am', beyond 'am' is a matter of interpretation/perspective/preference.. my relationship with ST is not a matter of 'accepting it or not', it is what it is regardless of acceptance..
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Post by someNOTHING! on Sept 23, 2014 20:10:28 GMT -5
That makes two of us; and we both have massive amounts of posts here at ST. Whether you accept it or not, you are as much ST as anyone else here. Yes, 'I am', beyond 'am' is a matter of interpretation/perspective/preference.. my relationship with ST is not a matter of 'accepting it or not', it is what it is regardless of acceptance.. This post is clearer than the previous 4000+, though "my relationship" seems to allude to tzuito taking up residence as something of substance.
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Post by tzujanli on Sept 23, 2014 20:56:19 GMT -5
Yes, 'I am', beyond 'am' is a matter of interpretation/perspective/preference.. my relationship with ST is not a matter of 'accepting it or not', it is what it is regardless of acceptance.. This post is clearer than the previous 4000+, though "my relationship" seems to allude to tzuito taking up residence as something of substance. Tzu is something of substance, but to think that's all 'Tzu' is would be an error...
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Post by someNOTHING! on Sept 23, 2014 21:19:28 GMT -5
Yeah, I poked around on that book when I lived in Japan a while back. It was just about the time I started my throwing-stuff-out phase and traveling lighter, both figuratively and actually. I think it got caught in the mix as it had too many dates and places from the integrity of its research! I was hooked on nature and the idea of the timeless essence, so if it tried to make too much sense, it got thrown out! hehe This, for me, highlights the distinction between an artificially coerced mental stillness and one that is natural and effortless. When the absence of meaning is apparent in even the most elegant and profound conceptualization, there is no try. Exactly. And to be more verbose, the existential pain that was being experienced by the mind/body at that point DID want to think that it all was for a "reason". It's likely that the catholick conditioning played a large part of that! hehe Strangely, in hindsight, after it all came tumbling down, the role of catholickism was kind of mentalized as an important part of the development of the psyche for a while. This illusory time period was referred to in the other post, when living amongst the missionaries. I understood what they sensed that they were trying to do, and that they thought it was good, but it was indeed guided by an abstract rendition of the world filtered through belief. I listened deeply, felt their separation and longing, and saw how it spurred all kinds of "works" for the Lord that they were imagining. Ironically, I also knew that they needed to wake up first, and get a glimpse of jc's realization. That the psyche would have to develop into some illusive substantial thing that would then fall, and then wake up, and then realize the truth of its own lack of quality, did seem to make sense. Of course, later, it was realized that even that was a story trying to take hold as "a truth". As if there should be some kind of admonition, "first, go out and build illusory self up and then worry about trying to wake up". I simply don't know what "should happen" per se, but to this non-localized view, the pointers of non-duality towards truth seem to ring true when consciously interacting here in the mirage of life. Disclaimer: The previous babbling may sound like a personal story, but it's actually about the dissolving of anything personal. Furthermore, without realization, the following pointer will appear just as words, and likely doubted. Truth simply is. Nothing is looking out across the vast expanse of the universe It is imagining through the function of mind. All that is imagined, thoughts, perceptions, or otherwise, is impermanent and not true. Nothing is sacred. Perfectly so.
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Post by someNOTHING! on Sept 23, 2014 21:21:25 GMT -5
This post is clearer than the previous 4000+, though "my relationship" seems to allude to tzuito taking up residence as something of substance. Tzu is something of substance, but to think that's all 'Tzu' is would be an error... Explain Tzu's substance.
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Post by laughter on Sept 24, 2014 0:02:27 GMT -5
This, for me, highlights the distinction between an artificially coerced mental stillness and one that is natural and effortless. When the absence of meaning is apparent in even the most elegant and profound conceptualization, there is no try. Exactly. And to be more verbose, the existential pain that was being experienced by the mind/body at that point DID want to think that it all was for a "reason". It's likely that the catholick conditioning played a large part of that! hehe Strangely, in hindsight, after it all came tumbling down, the role of catholickism was kind of mentalized as an important part of the development of the psyche for a while. This illusory time period was referred to in the other post, when living amongst the missionaries. I understood what they sensed that they were trying to do, and that they thought it was good, but it was indeed guided by an abstract rendition of the world filtered through belief. I listened deeply, felt their separation and longing, and saw how it spurred all kinds of "works" for the Lord that they were imagining. Ironically, I also knew that they needed to wake up first, and get a glimpse of jc's realization. That the psyche would have to develop into some illusive substantial thing that would then fall, and then wake up, and then realize the truth of its own lack of quality, did seem to make sense. Of course, later, it was realized that even that was a story trying to take hold as "a truth". As if there should be some kind of admonition, "first, go out and build illusory self up and then worry about trying to wake up". I simply don't know what "should happen" per se, but to this non-localized view, the pointers of non-duality towards truth seem to ring true when consciously interacting here in the mirage of life. Disclaimer: The previous babbling may sound like a personal story, but it's actually about the dissolving of anything personal. Furthermore, without realization, the following pointer will appear just as words, and likely doubted. Truth simply is. Nothing is looking out across the vast expanse of the universe It is imagining through the function of mind. All that is imagined, thoughts, perceptions, or otherwise, is impermanent and not true. Nothing is sacred. Perfectly so. nice, thanks.
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Post by tzujanli on Sept 24, 2014 5:04:11 GMT -5
Tzu is something of substance, but to think that's all 'Tzu' is would be an error... Explain Tzu's substance. Energy behaving physically, forming a substantive presence through which it exerts its unique force on what is actually happening.. it surfs, hikes, plays Frisbee, interacts on forums, plays Taiji, and experiences its existence through experiencing itself as others and as the collective whole symphony of Life happening.. and, it pays attention to the happening with unconditional curiosity..
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Post by tzujanli on Sept 24, 2014 5:09:33 GMT -5
This, for me, highlights the distinction between an artificially coerced mental stillness and one that is natural and effortless. When the absence of meaning is apparent in even the most elegant and profound conceptualization, there is no try. Exactly. And to be more verbose, the existential pain that was being experienced by the mind/body at that point DID want to think that it all was for a "reason". It's likely that the catholick conditioning played a large part of that! hehe Strangely, in hindsight, after it all came tumbling down, the role of catholickism was kind of mentalized as an important part of the development of the psyche for a while. This illusory time period was referred to in the other post, when living amongst the missionaries. I understood what they sensed that they were trying to do, and that they thought it was good, but it was indeed guided by an abstract rendition of the world filtered through belief. I listened deeply, felt their separation and longing, and saw how it spurred all kinds of "works" for the Lord that they were imagining. Ironically, I also knew that they needed to wake up first, and get a glimpse of jc's realization. That the psyche would have to develop into some illusive substantial thing that would then fall, and then wake up, and then realize the truth of its own lack of quality, did seem to make sense. Of course, later, it was realized that even that was a story trying to take hold as "a truth". As if there should be some kind of admonition, "first, go out and build illusory self up and then worry about trying to wake up". I simply don't know what "should happen" per se, but to this non-localized view, the pointers of non-duality towards truth seem to ring true when consciously interacting here in the mirage of life. Disclaimer: The previous babbling may sound like a personal story, but it's actually about the dissolving of anything personal. Furthermore, without realization, the following pointer will appear just as words, and likely doubted. Truth simply is. Nothing is looking out across the vast expanse of the universe It is imagining through the function of mind. All that is imagined, thoughts, perceptions, or otherwise, is impermanent and not true. Nothing is sacred. Perfectly so. 'Truth' is the experience itself, not the words, labels, descriptions, beliefs and pointings we assign to those experiences.. Worship nothing, but maintain a sacred reverence for all that is..
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2014 7:02:57 GMT -5
That makes two of us; and we both have massive amounts of posts here at ST. Whether you accept it or not, you are as much ST as anyone else here. Yes, 'I am', beyond 'am' is a matter of interpretation/perspective/preference.. my relationship with ST is not a matter of 'accepting it or not', it is what it is regardless of acceptance.. Okay sounds good. I was confused because when you said this: Awakening is used differently at ST.. it seems to mean that the experiencer accepts specific beliefs as if they were true.. -- I got the impression that you saw yourself as apart from ST and were looking at it from the outside.
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