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Post by enigma on Nov 10, 2013 12:58:02 GMT -5
Greetings.. Trust is useful in encouraging one to look in the direction of the pointer, but "revered" is not at all needed. Even trust is not required as it's not about believing but rather confirming for yourself. Best to ignore the qualifications of the messenger as you can't know what they are, and get in the habit of always 'looking' regardless of what is said or who is saying it. Always be looking at what in blazes is really going on, whether it's ego work or Freedom work. The significance of pointers is that they refer to a realization that is not found in the concepts, and so you're not being asked to understand ideas and figure it out with logic. That's all. It's not arrogance to talk about something that you see that cannot be seen understood with the mind.What is it, when an imagined concept is labeled 'realization' by the mind in order to avoid discussing the mind's relationship with that concept? Be well.. Sounds like a pretty complex avoidance tactic. Why do you ask? |
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Post by tzujanli on Nov 10, 2013 14:28:00 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. What is it, when an imagined concept is labeled 'realization' by the mind in order to avoid discussing the mind's relationship with that concept? Be well.. Sounds like a pretty complex avoidance tactic. Why do you ask? I'm curious about why someone would use such a transparent tactic, give it a pejorative label, then dismiss the label as not connected to the tactic.. Be well.. |
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Post by enigma on Nov 10, 2013 20:37:02 GMT -5
Greetings.. Sounds like a pretty complex avoidance tactic. Why do you ask? I'm curious about why someone would use such a transparent tactic, give it a pejorative label, then dismiss the label as not connected to the tactic.. Be well.. I don't know. I spose you could ask someone who does it and see if they can give you any insight. |
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Post by tzujanli on Nov 10, 2013 22:58:13 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. I'm curious about why someone would use such a transparent tactic, give it a pejorative label, then dismiss the label as not connected to the tactic.. Be well.. I don't know. I spose you could ask someone who does it and see if they can give you any insight. Try harder.. or, clean the lens through which cannot see.. Be well.. |
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Post by enigma on Nov 11, 2013 2:30:20 GMT -5
Greetings.. I don't know. I spose you could ask someone who does it and see if they can give you any insight. Try harder.. or, clean the lens through which cannot see.. Be well.. How could I know? It's just a hypothetical. |
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Post by lolly on Nov 11, 2013 6:53:04 GMT -5
When we speak of 'pointing', we mean the pointing at the Truth with a capital T (pointing at the moon). The believer needs to revere the speaker because if not, the speaker is just a person the same as they are. If the speaker is just another person, their words aren't believed as Truth, but possibly agreed or disagreed with. I can talk about things that are true, but I can't 'point at the moon'. Trust is useful in encouraging one to look in the direction of the pointer, but "revered" is not at all needed. Even trust is not required as it's not about believing but rather confirming for yourself. Best to ignore the qualifications of the messenger as you can't know what they are, and get in the habit of always 'looking' regardless of what is said or who is saying it. Always be looking at what in blazes is really going on, whether it's ego work or Freedom work. The significance of pointers is that they refer to a realization that is not found in the concepts, and so you're not being asked to understand ideas and figure it out with logic. That's all. It's not arrogance to talk about something that you see that cannot be seen understood with the mind. Really though, pointy dudes have a little group of followers who're all like agape... |
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Post by tzujanli on Nov 11, 2013 6:55:12 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. Try harder.. or, clean the lens through which cannot see.. Be well.. How could I know? It's just a hypothetical. Yes, 'oneness' is a hypothetical.. Be well.. |
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Post by enigma on Nov 11, 2013 10:39:55 GMT -5
Trust is useful in encouraging one to look in the direction of the pointer, but "revered" is not at all needed. Even trust is not required as it's not about believing but rather confirming for yourself. Best to ignore the qualifications of the messenger as you can't know what they are, and get in the habit of always 'looking' regardless of what is said or who is saying it. Always be looking at what in blazes is really going on, whether it's ego work or Freedom work. The significance of pointers is that they refer to a realization that is not found in the concepts, and so you're not being asked to understand ideas and figure it out with logic. That's all. It's not arrogance to talk about something that you see that cannot be seen understood with the mind. Really though, pointy dudes have a little group of followers who're all like agape... You mean like Niz and Ramana? Is it devotion that is objectionable? |
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Post by enigma on Nov 11, 2013 10:42:38 GMT -5
Greetings.. How could I know? It's just a hypothetical. Yes, 'oneness' is a hypothetical.. Be well.. You misunderstood. This is what I was referring to as a hypothetical scenario: "I'm curious about why someone would use such a transparent tactic, give it a pejorative label, then dismiss the label as not connected to the tactic.." |
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Post by laughter on Nov 11, 2013 16:18:27 GMT -5
Trust is useful in encouraging one to look in the direction of the pointer, but "revered" is not at all needed. Even trust is not required as it's not about believing but rather confirming for yourself. Best to ignore the qualifications of the messenger as you can't know what they are, and get in the habit of always 'looking' regardless of what is said or who is saying it. Always be looking at what in blazes is really going on, whether it's ego work or Freedom work. The significance of pointers is that they refer to a realization that is not found in the concepts, and so you're not being asked to understand ideas and figure it out with logic. That's all. It's not arrogance to talk about something that you see that cannot be seen understood with the mind. Really though, pointy dudes have a little group of followers who're all like agape... Whether that's the case or not, the fact is that there's no need to pack a dagger 'cause Buddha don't walk the road. Said another way that masquerades as sayin' the opposite: there ain't no knife big or sharp enough to slay the world. |
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Post by tzujanli on Nov 11, 2013 18:16:56 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. Yes, 'oneness' is a hypothetical.. Be well.. You misunderstood. This is what I was referring to as a hypothetical scenario: "I'm curious about why someone would use such a transparent tactic, give it a pejorative label, then dismiss the label as not connected to the tactic.." I didn't misunderstand.. i illuminated the folly of throwing rocks from transparent fortifications.. Be well.. |
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Post by enigma on Nov 12, 2013 3:14:27 GMT -5
Greetings.. You misunderstood. This is what I was referring to as a hypothetical scenario: "I'm curious about why someone would use such a transparent tactic, give it a pejorative label, then dismiss the label as not connected to the tactic.." I didn't misunderstand.. i illuminated the folly of throwing rocks from transparent fortifications.. Be well.. You mean when you said "Yes, 'oneness' is a hypothetical.." I don't get the connection. |
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Post by acewall on Nov 12, 2013 3:19:48 GMT -5
Greetings.. I didn't misunderstand.. i illuminated the folly of throwing rocks from transparent fortifications.. Be well.. You mean when you said "Yes, 'oneness' is a hypothetical.." I don't get the connection. there is None... the walnut has dropped from the tree awaiting ignition, putting down roots and growing a young sappling.  |
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Post by lolly on Nov 12, 2013 3:41:57 GMT -5
Really though, pointy dudes have a little group of followers who're all like agape... You mean like Niz and Ramana? Is it devotion that is objectionable? In my experience at the ashram, devotees take as gospel the rantings of the teacher (which is really the teachings of the Buddha)... every word a pearl of wisdom. Actually the teacher is a wise man, but in other ways he's a fool all caught up in his own bulldust. Reminds me of myself in that way. |
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Post by lolly on Nov 12, 2013 3:50:40 GMT -5
Really though, pointy dudes have a little group of followers who're all like agape... Whether that's the case or not, the fact is that there's no need to pack a dagger 'cause Buddha don't walk the road. Said another way that masquerades as sayin' the opposite: there ain't no knife big or sharp enough to slay the world. I think people who fancy themselves as pointers feel a little stabbing sensation. Maybe those who identify as devotees feel a pang as I question the totality of their master's credibility. This is what happens when I suggest the dual set of master and follower merely perpetuate their mutual egoism... I know we just paint images like Ramana is such and such a type and spiritual, it's all a bit of a figment as no one ever met the guy, or if the did he'd be judged as grand poo bah and expected to perform. Not unlike the Dalai Lama who was seen as such and such a Buddhist, and his band if kind ones were all upset coz Dalai ate a pork chop. Oh how disappointing is the actual truth. Guess what, no-one has the right to tell the Dalai Lama what to eat. Whos the master and whos the minion. All this master minion crsap is merely painted up, and I can see the pointers indicating their own works of art... |
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