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Post by tzujanli on Mar 13, 2013 22:42:38 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. LOL.. Either stop gaming the forum, or give yourself more credit than that.. your statement creates the illusion, i hope it's an illusion, that you are attached to your pride of self-image, believing you can 'know' what you cannot.. No, you really don't 'know', what Tzu or a cat saw.. there is only one 'enemy', it is expectation, also referred to as 'attachment'.. Be well.. There's a tendency toward hatefulness on the part of some here. I don't know what Arisha's excuse is, but apparently yours is that you simply give what you get, which implies you hear hatefulness in my voice. If you pay closer attention you'll find I'm simply relating what I'm seeing in as clear a way as possible, which does not require ugliness or hatefulness. Believe me, I'm capable of putting together hateful tirades, but if I did, then some of the accusations made against me would actually be true. My words are descriptions, conveyed as gently as possible without compromising clarity. That's why Peter isn't chasing me through the halls trying to get me to stop using words that clearly convey that belligerence. There is no belligerence here, just information being conveyed. Phil, there is no hate or hatefulness, in my intentions, at all.. what there is, is clarity.. i clearly see you and others pushing people's 'buttons' under the guise of helping them, but.. the reality of the process you and some others employ, is to push people's 'buttons' to provoke them or intimidate them to agree with what you believe is 'true'.. the 'information you convey' is predicated by an agenda of influencing people to agree with your beliefs.. I do not hear "hatefulness in your voice", i see the intention to influence people's understandings to align with your understandings "at all costs", and you are not concerned with what those 'costs' might be.. you demonstrate no intention to allow people the ability to find clarity and their own experience of Life, you demonstrate every intention of influencing what people think they experience and what people believe.. Be well.. |
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Post by enigma on Mar 13, 2013 23:44:01 GMT -5
Greetings.. There's a tendency toward hatefulness on the part of some here. I don't know what Arisha's excuse is, but apparently yours is that you simply give what you get, which implies you hear hatefulness in my voice. If you pay closer attention you'll find I'm simply relating what I'm seeing in as clear a way as possible, which does not require ugliness or hatefulness. Believe me, I'm capable of putting together hateful tirades, but if I did, then some of the accusations made against me would actually be true. My words are descriptions, conveyed as gently as possible without compromising clarity. That's why Peter isn't chasing me through the halls trying to get me to stop using words that clearly convey that belligerence. There is no belligerence here, just information being conveyed. Phil, there is no hate or hatefulness, in my intentions, at all.. what there is, is clarity.. i clearly see you and others pushing people's 'buttons' under the guise of helping them, but.. the reality of the process you and some others employ, is to push people's 'buttons' to provoke them or intimidate them to agree with what you believe is 'true'.. the 'information you convey' is predicated by an agenda of influencing people to agree with your beliefs.. I do not hear "hatefulness in your voice", i see the intention to influence people's understandings to align with your understandings "at all costs", and you are not concerned with what those 'costs' might be.. you demonstrate no intention to allow people the ability to find clarity and their own experience of Life, you demonstrate every intention of influencing what people think they experience and what people believe.. Be well.. Your 'clarity' is all wacky. The truth is I don't want to push people's buttons. If I could avoid it, I would. When buttons get pushed, folks just shut down. I don't want to provoke or intimidate. I don't want anybody to agree with some beliefs. I want them to look for themselves and see if anything I say is true. This is part of the experience of life in which they have an opportunity to find clarity. If they don't then they don't. It's okay. I won't be ugly and hateful. I won't 'give what I get'. |
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Post by tzujanli on Mar 14, 2013 0:07:31 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. Phil, there is no hate or hatefulness, in my intentions, at all.. what there is, is clarity.. i clearly see you and others pushing people's 'buttons' under the guise of helping them, but.. the reality of the process you and some others employ, is to push people's 'buttons' to provoke them or intimidate them to agree with what you believe is 'true'.. the 'information you convey' is predicated by an agenda of influencing people to agree with your beliefs.. I do not hear "hatefulness in your voice", i see the intention to influence people's understandings to align with your understandings "at all costs", and you are not concerned with what those 'costs' might be.. you demonstrate no intention to allow people the ability to find clarity and their own experience of Life, you demonstrate every intention of influencing what people think they experience and what people believe.. Be well.. Your 'clarity' is all wacky. The truth is I don't want to push people's buttons. If I could avoid it, I would. When buttons get pushed, folks just shut down. I don't want to provoke or intimidate. I don't want anybody to agree with some beliefs. I want them to look for themselves and see if anything I say is true. This is part of the experience of life in which they have an opportunity to find clarity. If they don't then they don't. It's okay. I won't be ugly and hateful. I won't 'give what I get'. As the original 'giver', you already gave.. you 'say' you want people to look for themselves, but.. you tell them to see 'oneness', non-duality', and that it's all imagined.. you try to influence what people 'see', and what they believe.. the time has passed for you to claim you don't push people's buttons, it's easily observed that you do.. Be well.. |
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Post by enigma on Mar 14, 2013 0:34:15 GMT -5
Greetings.. Your 'clarity' is all wacky. The truth is I don't want to push people's buttons. If I could avoid it, I would. When buttons get pushed, folks just shut down. I don't want to provoke or intimidate. I don't want anybody to agree with some beliefs. I want them to look for themselves and see if anything I say is true. This is part of the experience of life in which they have an opportunity to find clarity. If they don't then they don't. It's okay. I won't be ugly and hateful. I won't 'give what I get'. As the original 'giver', you already gave.. you 'say' you want people to look for themselves, but.. you tell them to see 'oneness', non-duality', and that it's all imagined.. you try to influence what people 'see', and what they believe.. the time has passed for you to claim you don't push people's buttons, it's easily observed that you do.. Be well.. I never tell people to see anything. I discuss oneness and noduality with those who are interested. I don't discuss it with those who aren't. We all try to influence what people see. I don't want them to believe anything. Beliefs are not useful. They obstruct clarity. It's easily observed that buttons get pushed when I talk to some about what I see. That says nothing about my intention. |
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Post by andrew on Mar 14, 2013 3:35:28 GMT -5
So you don't experience decision making at all? I'm picturing Love putting his arm around your shoulders and whispering sweet commands in your ear. You're officially too far down the bunny hole for me on this one. That's the image you are presenting of yourself when you say that you do not experience personal motivation. What changed last year when you decided to start reporting posts? That will show you your reason for reporting them. |
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Post by andrew on Mar 14, 2013 3:43:50 GMT -5
Greetings.. LOL.. Either stop gaming the forum, or give yourself more credit than that.. your statement creates the illusion, i hope it's an illusion, that you are attached to your pride of self-image, believing you can 'know' what you cannot.. No, you really don't 'know', what Tzu or a cat saw.. there is only one 'enemy', it is expectation, also referred to as 'attachment'.. Be well.. There's a tendency toward hatefulness on the part of some here. I don't know what Arisha's excuse is, but apparently yours is that you simply give what you get, which implies you hear hatefulness in my voice. If you pay closer attention you'll find I'm simply relating what I'm seeing in as clear a way as possible, which does not require ugliness or hatefulness. Believe me, I'm capable of putting together hateful tirades, but if I did, then some of the accusations made against me would actually be true. My words are descriptions, conveyed as gently as possible without compromising clarity. That's why Peter isn't chasing me through the halls trying to get me to stop using words that clearly convey that belligerence. There is no belligerence here, just information being conveyed. You tell people that they are not well, insane and deluded and present those assertions as if you see 'the truth of things' and others do not. Its a dangerous and manipulative ploy because it presents you as 'THE expert' and therefore if you say that people are 'not well', then it MUST be true. I would say the fact that you prioritize 'the truth of things' above all else is actually a major clue that you are still operating from within your conditioning and needing to put yourself above others. Its fine to have an opinion, but perception is subjective, and these kinds of opinions should be offered subjectively, except perhaps in rare situations, or unless you have medical qualifications. |
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Post by tzujanli on Mar 14, 2013 7:02:00 GMT -5
Greetings.. Greetings.. As the original 'giver', you already gave.. you 'say' you want people to look for themselves, but.. you tell them to see 'oneness', non-duality', and that it's all imagined.. you try to influence what people 'see', and what they believe.. the time has passed for you to claim you don't push people's buttons, it's easily observed that you do.. Be well.. I never tell people to see anything. I discuss oneness and noduality with those who are interested. I don't discuss it with those who aren't. We all try to influence what people see. I don't want them to believe anything. Beliefs are not useful. They obstruct clarity. It's easily observed that buttons get pushed when I talk to some about what I see. That says nothing about my intention. Of course, self-absolution is always a useful illusion in the face of actuality.. Be well.. |
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Post by enigma on Mar 14, 2013 9:32:34 GMT -5
There's a tendency toward hatefulness on the part of some here. I don't know what Arisha's excuse is, but apparently yours is that you simply give what you get, which implies you hear hatefulness in my voice. If you pay closer attention you'll find I'm simply relating what I'm seeing in as clear a way as possible, which does not require ugliness or hatefulness. Believe me, I'm capable of putting together hateful tirades, but if I did, then some of the accusations made against me would actually be true. My words are descriptions, conveyed as gently as possible without compromising clarity. That's why Peter isn't chasing me through the halls trying to get me to stop using words that clearly convey that belligerence. There is no belligerence here, just information being conveyed. You tell people that they are not well, insane and deluded and present those assertions as if you see 'the truth of things' and others do not. Its a dangerous and manipulative ploy because it presents you as 'THE expert' and therefore if you say that people are 'not well', then it MUST be true. I would say the fact that you prioritize 'the truth of things' above all else is actually a major clue that you are still operating from within your conditioning and needing to put yourself above others. Its fine to have an opinion, but perception is subjective, and these kinds of opinions should be offered subjectively, except perhaps in rare situations, or unless you have medical qualifications. Opinion noted. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2013 10:22:39 GMT -5
There's a tendency toward hatefulness on the part of some here. I don't know what Arisha's excuse is, but apparently yours is that you simply give what you get, which implies you hear hatefulness in my voice. If you pay closer attention you'll find I'm simply relating what I'm seeing in as clear a way as possible, which does not require ugliness or hatefulness. Believe me, I'm capable of putting together hateful tirades, but if I did, then some of the accusations made against me would actually be true. My words are descriptions, conveyed as gently as possible without compromising clarity. That's why Peter isn't chasing me through the halls trying to get me to stop using words that clearly convey that belligerence. There is no belligerence here, just information being conveyed. You tell people that they are not well, insane and deluded and present those assertions as if you see 'the truth of things' and others do not. Its a dangerous and manipulative ploy because it presents you as 'THE expert' and therefore if you say that people are 'not well', then it MUST be true. I would say the fact that you prioritize 'the truth of things' above all else is actually a major clue that you are still operating from within your conditioning and needing to put yourself above others. Its fine to have an opinion, but perception is subjective, and these kinds of opinions should be offered subjectively, except perhaps in rare situations, or unless you have medical qualifications. Yes. |
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Post by silence on Mar 14, 2013 14:46:59 GMT -5
You are not seeing clearly, you are biased toward enigma's beliefs.. enigma's preaching and the beliefs he peddles are obstacles to clarity.. And this load of judgmental, assumptive beliefs you just unloaded on me are not obstacles to clarity? I have no belief that " the forum will fall to pieces and spontaneously combust", that phrase originates in your mind and for your purposes.. You said "it's offensive and it's tearing this forum apart". Yes, I made light of the insinuation that one man is tearing the forum apart. Yes, i do consider ceasing the behavior you reference, then i see enigma obstructing clarity.. Be well.. So you see engma obstructing clarity and you figure turning up the dial on the behavior you abhor should do the trick? Isn't this the definition of insanity. |
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Post by laughter on Mar 14, 2013 14:47:43 GMT -5
You tell people that they are not well, insane and deluded and present those assertions as if you see 'the truth of things' and others do not. Its a dangerous and manipulative ploy because it presents you as 'THE expert' and therefore if you say that people are 'not well', then it MUST be true. I would say the fact that you prioritize 'the truth of things' above all else is actually a major clue that you are still operating from within your conditioning and needing to put yourself above others. Its fine to have an opinion, but perception is subjective, and these kinds of opinions should be offered subjectively, except perhaps in rare situations, or unless you have medical qualifications. Yes. |
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Post by silence on Mar 14, 2013 14:51:29 GMT -5
Its fine to have an opinion, but perception is subjective, and these kinds of opinions should be offered subjectively, except perhaps in rare situations, or unless you have medical qualifications. This has come up several times and I can't help but laugh. So if someone scanned their medical degree and uploaded it here, your complaint would be null and void? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2013 16:05:57 GMT -5
You don't actually 'know' what Tzu see's, because it's the old misconception that 'you think you can know what it's like to be a cat'. You don't 'know' what Tzu see's because you don't 'know' what it is like to 'be' Tzu. You are only aware of what you 'think' Tzu see's, and thinking isn't knowing. Nonsense. If a cat wrote what Tzu wrote, I would know the cat saw enemies. Your not capable of knowing anything other than 'THIS'. It is your mental construction that 'thinks' it knows what it's like to be a cat and knows what it's like to be Tzu. But thoughts are not real, they are not based on some objective Reality. To wake up means not be deceived by the conceptual world that we all create and what your creating right now. When we realize how consciousness functions, we see that our sense of self and other, is an illusion created by consciousness itself. |
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Post by andrew on Mar 14, 2013 16:12:53 GMT -5
Its fine to have an opinion, but perception is subjective, and these kinds of opinions should be offered subjectively, except perhaps in rare situations, or unless you have medical qualifications. This has come up several times and I can't help but laugh. So if someone scanned their medical degree and uploaded it here, your complaint would be null and void? Unlikely I would need to see a document/upload, if someone explained to me the way in which they were qualified to make diagnoses of those kinds, I would likely accept their word. That doesn't mean I would necessarily agree with the diagnosis, but at least there is some basis for it. |
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Post by enigma on Mar 14, 2013 19:40:49 GMT -5
Nonsense. If a cat wrote what Tzu wrote, I would know the cat saw enemies. Your not capable of knowing anything other than 'THIS'. How do you know? I don't know what it's like to be Tzu. I didn't say that. He has his own subjective experience that I can't be a part of. What I'm saying is that if he tells me he sees purple elephants, then I know he sees purple elephants. So you figure I can't know that you just said that? You're misconceiving the illusory nature of thoughts. You seem to have deceived yourself in this post by believing your thoughts. |
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Greetings..
