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Post by theuncreated on Feb 26, 2013 18:27:23 GMT -5
I prefer to keep talking about HOW to start seeing things as they are. That's been answered a million times over, by many who have seen. So in other words, you're content with staying in the dark and encouraging others to do the same. How do we start seeing things as they are? Ramana said it as simply as anyone could: "ask yourself, 'who am I' until you find out". That's the teaching in a nutshell. It's the full stop to all arguments. Alas, I trust you and the rest of of your bed mates here would scoff at the suggestion as "too easy" as if you're expecting some fancy, complicated answer to smack you into realization. If you haven't in all your years of searching developed an utter distaste or outright disgust for discourse, then you are still in deep slumber and you've plenty of work to do yet. I'm waiting for you to equate my "lack of self control" and "knowitallitis" as a lack of having seen, Mountain Goat. Common trap. Lemme know in a few years. I'll be back in a few years to yell at you lazy asses some more. Ciao.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2013 18:51:19 GMT -5
I'm waiting for you to equate my "lack of self control" and "knowitallitis" as a lack of having seen, Mountain Goat. Common trap. Lemme know in a few years. I'll be back in a few years to yell at you lazy asses some more. Ciao. I'm posting this now because i won't be here in a few years.
I just find it interesting how you confidently proclaim many things about others, yet you can't even control your own curiosity. And i equate that to a lack of self awareness, and if you lack self awareness, what does that say about your insights of others.
And by all means, come back and yell as much as you feel the need to, it's a free concert. As whatshisface said to James Cole in 12 Monkeys, "Yelling won't get you want you want, you have to be smart to get what you want."
But knock yourself out, enjoy your yellfest.
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Post by arisha on Feb 26, 2013 19:08:15 GMT -5
I prefer to keep talking about HOW to start seeing things as they are. That's been answered a million times over, by many who have seen. So in other words, you're content with staying in the dark and encouraging others to do the same. How do we start seeing things as they are? Ramana said it as simply as anyone could: "ask yourself, 'who am I' until you find out". That's the teaching in a nutshell. It's the full stop to all arguments. Alas, I trust you and the rest of of your bed mates here would scoff at the suggestion as "too easy" as if you're expecting some fancy, complicated answer to smack you into realization. If you haven't in all your years of searching developed an utter distaste or outright disgust for discourse, then you are still in deep slumber and you've plenty of work to do yet. I'll be back in a few years to yell at you lazy asses some more. Ciao. If this has been answered a million of times, my answer is a million and first. Simple like that. There is still a demand for answers. Do you know that YOU have plenty of work to do yet? No? Now you know, and that's why I am here, waiting for such a lazy ass as you are, to tell you more about yourself.
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Post by enigma on Feb 26, 2013 19:36:46 GMT -5
Not talking about "the infinite". I'm talking about what oneness means. You can't talk about what Oneness is by definition. When being talked about, Oneness is not a Oneness anymore. When "touched", even in a talk, it stops being Oneness, and stops to exist. Don't be silly. Oneness, 'by definition', means everything is one. Do yous guys purposely try to make oneness inaccessible?
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Post by enigma on Feb 26, 2013 19:55:33 GMT -5
So you would say there are billions of intelligences? Yes, united into one, which is also billions.. many molecules of water flowing as one river..You see the whole making it's own choices? How do you see that happening? As we /us/Life, freewilled versions of itself.. it chooses that we 'be'..I say experience is not a good indicator of what's actually going on. I've used metaphors endlessly to show how an experience can easily be the experience of an illusion, so I spose the issue is about what you mean by "direct experience". What makes it different from other experience such that the illusions don't happen? Rope or snake? direct experience solves the illusion.. if you are experiencing an illusion, you are 'experiencing' an illusion..I suggest that separate, volitional persons will never consistently place the welfare of the collective whole over that of themselves and their families. What father will not steal an apple from a cart to keep his child alive one more day? The thing is that nature doesn't demand the generosity of unity as it is already unified. What man has done is turned his back on his mother and so she can no longer nurture him. What nature demands is the end of the self delusion of separateness. What nature demands is 'truth'.. to see a problem that 'is', and you identify the problem succinctly, but to see it as it 'is' and to suggest conceptual thinking, 'oneness', as a solution is not 'truth'.. I suggest that there are abundant resources for the security and welfare of all people, that what is lacking is the will and inspiration to distribute those resources fairly to all people.. i suggest a spiritual and cultural revolution, where unity is revealed as the functional solution, where no father ever has to "steal an apple" to feed his kids.. Be well.. Oh, I soitainly don't suggest conceptual thinking about oneness. I 'suggest' the realization of oneness.
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Post by arisha on Feb 26, 2013 20:02:48 GMT -5
You can't talk about what Oneness is by definition. When being talked about, Oneness is not a Oneness anymore. When "touched", even in a talk, it stops being Oneness, and stops to exist. Don't be silly. Oneness, 'by definition', means everything is one. Do yous guys purposely try to make oneness inaccessible? You haven't understood the idea, silly. Oneness, 'by definition', refers to a condition of being one, and nothing else.
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Post by arisha on Feb 26, 2013 20:08:09 GMT -5
Oh, I soitainly don't suggest conceptual thinking about oneness. I 'suggest' the realization of oneness. You suggest the impossible. Stop deceiving people. You are a dreamer who is in a dream state, your being deluded can be seen from the first sight.
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Post by tzujanli on Feb 26, 2013 20:08:13 GMT -5
Greetings.. You can't talk about what Oneness is by definition. When being talked about, Oneness is not a Oneness anymore. When "touched", even in a talk, it stops being Oneness, and stops to exist. Don't be silly. Oneness, 'by definition', means everything is one. Do yous guys purposely try to make oneness inaccessible? Don't be silly. If "everything is one", there's no one to access oneness, and.. if 'oneness' is accessible, it's not really 'oneness'.. Be well..
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Post by arisha on Feb 26, 2013 20:09:37 GMT -5
Greetings.. Don't be silly. Oneness, 'by definition', means everything is one. Do yous guys purposely try to make oneness inaccessible? Don't be silly. If "everything is one", there's no one to access oneness, and.. if 'oneness' is accessible, it's not really 'oneness'.. Be well.. Nicely said.
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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2013 20:17:22 GMT -5
Okay, here's the deal. A few of you know me as a rather cut-to-the-point poster who frequented the board roughly three years ago. Couldn't help my curiosity so I returned to the board to see exactly who's maintaining the status quo on the endless, distracting, bullnuts conversation. Naturally I still see a sample of the same names I saw then, with seemingly no indication that you've tired of all the talk. I said it then and I'm saying it again. You're all wasting your time and you seem to rather enjoy your slumber. How else can one explain the circular talk, the same rehashed topics, the novice questions that anyone that's taken even a single step in their journey would have the answer to? There are several folks on this board who seem to be on that all-important precipice -- they've been there for YEARS -- but they clearly have no interest in going beyond it. You want to talk "oneness", "nonduality", "enlightenment" and all that nonsense, but let's be honest -- how many of you want to experience it? If this messageboard is any indication, the answer to the question is "not very many." So, on topic, what is oneness? You may ask a million times and receive the answer as many times, but what use is it to you if you don't see it for yourself? Here's what I experienced many years ago. Mind you, I explained this at least once on this board, many years ago. The experience is the clearest realization that you are as virtual as a Super Mario life. The physical presence taken to be you feels no more "you" than your car, your house or your yacht.
For all intents and purposes, you feel disembodied -- ghost like, and as a result, indestructible. There's a subtle, singular experience of simple awareness and it is thundering in its silence because it's -- you're so powerfully present. There is a simple shifting in perspective, but the resulting feeling is exponentially different in presentation. I won't mince words here, the experience gives you a very strong and clear impression that you are dead on the spot.
There is a powerful recognition that "you" are the canvas upon which all else is painted; that there is no subsequent structure behind or before you because you are it -- the a priori presence that all else is dependent upon.
It's a simple experience, devoid of any awe. You're not granted super powers, your perspective simply shifts.
That's the bottom line.
While in this state, if you perform the simple experiment of uttering your own name, you will realize that there will be no answer -- neither conscious nor unconscious -- because your name points nowhere. The utterance will simply disappear into you, the void, with no trace of response.
So now, satisfied? What more do you any of you want? Well, I guess that's it then. **PHEW!** Glad that's finally over! So now that we've once and for all collectively and with finality answered the question "Who am I?" I suggest that we all meet here and login at once at 1:72 on the 2nd Tuesday of next week to do a synchronized resignation of our accounts! No cheating Silver! edit: I can editing too!
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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2013 20:21:25 GMT -5
If "everything" excludes "nothing" and the opposite state of them both, then you haven't quite hit the mark, and quite frankly never will unless you put an end to the talk. Nagarjuna, essentially. You can't simply slot the infinite into neat little boolean logic and say such limiting things as "it's everything." This. Not this. This and that. Neither this nor that. None of the above. All of the above. Both all of the above and none of the above. Neither none of the above nor all of the above. it's just a two-variable boolean truth table 0 0 0 1 1 0 1 1
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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2013 20:23:44 GMT -5
Look here, if you can't see the folly in trying to slot something that's shapeless and incapturable into a neat and finite little explanation, then I'm afraid you have a lot of work to do. Nothing more to be said on that matter. yup
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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2013 20:24:42 GMT -5
Not talking about "the infinite". I'm talking about what oneness means. You can't talk about what Oneness is by definition. When being talked about, Oneness is not a Oneness anymore. When "touched", even in a talk, it stops being Oneness, and stops to exist. yup
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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2013 20:26:19 GMT -5
You can't talk about what Oneness is by definition. Congratulations, you essentially summed up the post you responded to. Now what are you gonna do about that? Keep talking? y knot?
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Post by laughter on Feb 26, 2013 20:32:11 GMT -5
Okay, here's the deal. A few of you know me as a rather cut-to-the-point poster who frequented the board roughly three years ago. Couldn't help my curiosity so I returned to the board to see exactly who's maintaining the status quo on the endless, distracting, bullnuts conversation. Naturally I still see a sample of the same names I saw then, with seemingly no indication that you've tired of all the talk. I said it then and I'm saying it again. You're all wasting your time and you seem to rather enjoy your slumber. How else can one explain the circular talk, the same rehashed topics, the novice questions that anyone that's taken even a single step in their journey would have the answer to? There are several folks on this board who seem to be on that all-important precipice -- they've been there for YEARS -- but they clearly have no interest in going beyond it. You want to talk "oneness", "nonduality", "enlightenment" and all that nonsense, but let's be honest -- how many of you want to experience it? If this messageboard is any indication, the answer to the question is "not very many." So, on topic, what is oneness? You may ask a million times and receive the answer as many times, but what use is it to you if you don't see it for yourself? Here's what I experienced many years ago. Mind you, I explained this at least once on this board, many years ago. The experience is the clearest realization that you are as virtual as a Super Mario life. The physical presence taken to be you feels no more "you" than your car, your house or your yacht.
For all intents and purposes, you feel disembodied -- ghost like, and as a result, indestructible. There's a subtle, singular experience of simple awareness and it is thundering in its silence because it's -- you're so powerfully present. There is a simple shifting in perspective, but the resulting feeling is exponentially different in presentation. I won't mince words here, the experience gives you a very strong and clear impression that you are dead on the spot.
There is a powerful recognition that "you" are the canvas upon which all else is painted; that there is no subsequent structure behind or before you because you are it -- the a priori presence that all else is dependent upon.
It's a simple experience, devoid of any awe. You're not granted super powers, your perspective simply shifts.
That's the bottom line.
While in this state, if you perform the simple experiment of uttering your own name, you will realize that there will be no answer -- neither conscious nor unconscious -- because your name points nowhere. The utterance will simply disappear into you, the void, with no trace of response.
So now, satisfied? What more do you any of you want? What you are describing is just a mind state which gives nothing but some changes of one's energy structure. Enlightenment and awakening have nothing to do with it. But such a mind state experience can be a useful experience for some people. pretty good go of describing the "unity woo-woo" though, dontcha' think? ... left out a bunch of stuff that I would've put in like "ooooooooooohhhh! of course! of course! ...." ... how to bottle the ocean?
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