Debate

[ravenscroft]

yawn

these debate are pretty uninteresting

nothing is true

life has no conceptual meaning that your monkey mind can bring down to size

next

[zendancer]

Jun 22, 2010 16:33:26 GMT -5 fact said:

evolution is false!

Hmmmmmm.......Another super cigarette-man! How do you teach someone who is this strongly attached to his ideas anything about the world of the absolute? What a fabulous koan! It is also reminiscent of the tea master story. The tea master kept pouring tea until it overflowed the professor's cup. The professor finally quit spouting his non-stop ideas and said, "Tea Master! My cup is full; no more will go in." The tea master responded, "Like this cup, your mind is full; no more will go in."

I always get a kick out of statements like this. The MRSA problem in hospitals is a current example of evolution in action. Certain weeds are becoming resistant to the popular herbicide Roundup. Same thing. Several years ago a mutation in sheep led to sheep with shorter legs, so farmers bred them to become dominant (they don;t run as fast and are easier to control). Same thing. This weekend I went to a cool nature museum in Westminster, CO and saw some incredible animals that had adapted and evolved to fit highly specialized niche envionments. Same thing. Penicillin-resistant bugs are another good example. But, evolution is false. None of this stuff I mentioned is really happening. LOL

[Good]

Jun 22, 2010 17:40:48 GMT -5 ravenscroft said:

yawn

these debate are pretty uninteresting

nothing is true

life has no conceptual meaning that your monkey mind can bring down to size

next

many things are true my friend

[enigma]

Jun 22, 2010 16:33:26 GMT -5 fact said:

evolution is false!

What makes it irrelevant is....well....so are you. Hehe.

[enigma]

Jun 22, 2010 18:45:22 GMT -5 @Good said:

Jun 22, 2010 17:40:48 GMT -5 ravenscroft said:

yawn

these debate are pretty uninteresting

nothing is true

life has no conceptual meaning that your monkey mind can bring down to size

next

many things are true my friend

Last night, my lady had a dream that she was bitten by a dog. This is the truth. After careful deliberation this morning, we chose not to go to the doctor for rabies shots. We're keeping our fingers crossed.....

[Guest]

Hmmmmmm.......Another super cigarette-man! How do you teach someone who is this strongly attached to his ideas anything about the world of the absolute?

Hello, if i am a cigarette man then so are you Zendancer. Becuase you seem to think everything you say is correct and anyone who does not agree with you is wrong.

Go and read over some of your posts. You didn't even want to know about Edgar Cayce becuase apparently he did not fit into the category of "Nonduality". Basically if something is not "Nondual" to you, you will not look into it becuase you believe it is false.

Also read over your posts ranging from mediumship, Theosophy, Christianity, Religion, philosophy... you even called philosophy "useless". Just look back on the last 10 pages of threads everyone you talked about something being false becuase it is not "Nondual", you seem to automatically discard anything which does not fit into your little category of "Nonduality" so all of these things are false to you and anyone who believes in them you laugh at.

You talked about people attached to ideas, but you are fixated and very much attached on "Nonduality". There is not a post where you can not mention "Nonduality".

I would pretty much say this "Nonduality" seems to run your life. I have no problem with this, if you get enjoyment out of it and you like it, then great for you. But no need to put others down becuase they believe differently. Not everyone has found "Nonduality" in the world, many people do not even know the definition of this word, really is no need to push it upon people. Many people are attached to things in the world you clearly have pointed this out. A few examples.. An animal lover is attached to animals, the footballer attached to his game of football, the Christian attached to the teachings of Jesus, the list goes on and on.

You are clearly very much attached to "Nonduality" otherwise you would not be on this forum posting about it all the time. If you believe "Nonduality" is what life is about, then good for you, maybe you are correct. But really you have been no different than what i have done and all my "Christian fundamentalist" posts. I am attached the the teachings of Jesus and the bible, while you are attached to the teachings of "Nonduality". We are both attached to something. We have both put alot of effort into our posts. I highly respect you and your posts please do not think i came here for a rant.

I will not post anymore. My intention was to post abit about the bible (Which i did do - even though the direction has swayed off on the other thread into a debate over the errors of Homosexuality and Catholicism). On another thread people were saying i am other users to try and discredit and attack me personally. I did not come here for that, hence why i did not respond in great detail, i do not believe in argueing. I represent peace. Remember this is a spiritual forum. I have not personally attacked anyone. I respect everyone that is here and all of their belief systems and experiences.

So i will say. Good bye. God Bless. Thank you. And Good luck on all of your spiritual paths wether it is "Nonduality" Christian or another. Correct paths will lead in the same direction.

[zendancer]

Guest: Best of luck to you, too. Blessings and peace.

[Questions]

Guest i think this forum was set up to discuss nonduality this is perhaps why zendancer mentions it in his posts , isnt the essence of spirituality nondual? i have found little duality if any in spirituality is this the case for anyone else?, if anyone thinks differently on this questions plz enlighten me1!

[Fact]

hey zendancer evolution is a theory it can not be proven.

"Science is knowledge from observation" things we can see, witness, touch, feel, sense and be aware of. Thing we observe.

Evolution can not be seen, felt, touched, witnessed, sensed.. or observed the list goes on. It's just a belief and a theory which can never be proven or directly observed, we can never see evolution taking place directly, quite frankly becuase it is a false theory.

[cabinintheforest]

These debates bring up some very interesting questions. I know there has been some silly posts but i am interested in this debate. Zendancer has experienced Cosmic Consciouness (Nonduality) he brings it up becuase he has actually experience this truth personally. I have not had an experience of this as yet but i am planning to. So we do need his posts about Nonduality to help certain people on here who have not yet had the experience/s.

Anyway regarding evolution I brought it up before. Is evolution compatible with Nonduality?
The answers i got were that evolution is just another word for change, and that it is an illusion. So the answer would be no.

Heres also something very interesting, evolution has been described as dual.

i would like your opinion on this (to anyone):

www.theosophy-nw.org/theosnw/evol/ev-prent.htm

It is saying evolution is fully dualistic.

[lobo]

Jun 23, 2010 14:52:18 GMT -5 @Questions said:

Guest i think this forum was set up to discuss nonduality this is perhaps why zendancer mentions it in his posts , isnt the essence of spirituality nondual? i have found little duality if any in spirituality is this the case for anyone else?, if anyone thinks differently on this questions plz enlighten me1!

Dude, didn't you read the introduction/instructions right at the top of the page under the banner ads?

I will past it here for you in case you didn't.

Late night neo-advaitic ramblings, questions and curiosities, or that thought that you just have to share, all such posts are welcome here.

Seems the intention is to be wide open on topics.

Let 'er roll

[thistoo]

Jun 23, 2010 19:48:16 GMT -5 @cabinintheforest said:

Is evolution compatible with Nonduality?

Great question! I'll have to give that some serious thought.

I do think that any debate about the theory of evolution versus belief in creation is remarkably (and unnecessarily) dual, though.

The theory of evolution, as I see it, is just that---a theory to explain, and to be proven or disproven, how earthly critters came to be as they are at any given point on the space-time continuum. It isn't a belief system, and even the most ardent proponents of the theory would tell you that it is not to be accepted as fact, nor does it explain how the whole thing started.

Creationism, in contrast, is a belief system, held on faith, that some greater force or intelligence is responsible for the manifestation of living things on the planet, and moreover the entire universe. This inevitably brings us to the big bang theory.

I have never fully understood why there is a perceived battleground between scientific theory and religion. Even renowned physicist Stephen Hawking has said that the big bang theory, the leading but not the only scientific theory about the origin of the universe, is the only one that by its nature leaves open the possibility for a creator, because it cannot explain how it started.

I don't see them, in other words, as something one needs to choose between.

[lobo]

thistoo, the reason it is a battleground is that science is a religion to most people. There is a belief in the truth of science, when what it actually is is a system for observing, conjecturing relationships, testing them with experiment to see if the theory holds up, at least statistically.

Nobody questions Newton's laws because they work, until one looks closer to see that they do not work. Then there is a scramble for a new theory.

Have you noticed that the theories keep getting more and more complex trying to explain what doesn't make sense from the latest experiments? There is still the desparate hope in hanging on to the notion that we can know the truth within the paradiam of the scientific method.

Already experiments have shown, or suggested, nobody can say for sure, that the universe is not causal, nothing can be observed objectively-only subjectively, that time does not flow in just one direction-future events affecting previous results, and even that matter doesn't really exist in the normal way we think uf it-physical manifestation fits the expected outcome.

These are just some of the "wierdness". But it is only wierd because of the belief system held about the world. Just like the wierd sensations when the belief system about the self is contradicted by some perception. But the belief that they are right, that the system will reveal the truth even though it fails over and over, is stubbornly held on to. It is far easier to filter what doesn't fit, to only consider possibilities that fit into the existing beliefs, than it is to open up and question the basic beliefs. Scientists will say they are not in that business, that it is philosophy or religion. But they hold beliefs just as any religion out there. May as well call it a religion.

This is a monument to the power of belief.

I am not interested in the dabate. I am interested in uncovering false beliefs. This mind seems to have an affinity for it LOL. The point would be it is all a game, just like all of life, just one grand, unpredictable happening.

The truth is beyond what science as it is practiced can uncover.

Another point. The mind, intellect, using logic, is limited. Logic cannot get to or prove ultimate truth, only relatively true statements within a predifined system.

The great use of logic is in finding contradictions, finding untruth.

[Dolph]

Nobody questions Newton's laws because they work

alot of people question them and alot of people do not believe in newton's laws.

[lobo]

Jun 24, 2010 11:21:43 GMT -5 @Dolph said:

Nobody questions Newton's laws because they work

alot of people question them and alot of people do not believe in newton's laws.

Dolph, the least you could do is put the whole quote up there LOL
Here, I'll do it for you:

"Nobody questions Newton's laws because they work, until one looks closer to see that they do not work. Then there is a scramble for a new theory. "

Specifically, when the mass is large enough the wavelengths are long enough that the quantum probabilities are essentially certain, .... in that case one should step out of the way of the Mac truck or almost certainly get the body splattered into a non-functional configuration LOL

In what ways are you questioning them, may I ask?